Chinese guns are overrated.

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Actually, the ban on Chinese weapons was expanded to all semi-automatics.
While I'm not doubting you, I have to ask, why aren't we seeing those cheeeeep bolt .22 rifles here like I see on marstar.ca?

I'm not knocking the chinese guns, as I wouldn't mind picking up their 870 COPY for 150 bucks. Still trying to find a Maverick for the simple fact that it's not much more expensive (30 bucks, if that) and I can get it with the 20" bbl and 8 round capacity :) Plus it's "made in usa" as far as I know ;)
 
i believe mavericks are made in the USA from mexican parts. or made in mexico from US parts... some wierd relation.
 
My big bit*h about chinese goods, is when they stick a American name on it, like Schrade, or Buck, Winchester, or New England Firearms!!!
That really get's in my crawl.................
 
Firearms are relatively simple products. You can replace high-tech precision machinery with cheap manual labor and still come up with an equivalent or better product.

Guess what China has a lot of.

Anyway, China firearms aren't in anyway special compared to American firearms, just that they are much cheaper and therefore good enough for most people.

Norinco 1911 ($200 earlier now $400) still cheaper than 90% of the 1911s out there.
Norinco M14 much cheaper than SA and custom.
Chinese shotguns are cheaper, and a shotgun is a bloody simple design to screw up.

The Chinese clone good designs from other countries and reproduce them cheaply. If the design sucks, it's not their fault.

Whining about chinese firearm prices is pretty damn sad. People pay higher prices because supply is finite and non-increasing. If you don't think it's worth your money don't buy them.

It's sad really they are banned and will never be unbanned. Competition and more choices are good for consumers.
 
I've shot the Chinese reproduction mod 97 pump shotgun as well as the lever action shotgun (can't remember the model #). The pump shotgun was so-so, but I thouroghly enjoyed the lever action 12ga. Having handled a late 1800s lever action 12 of the same model, I was impressed with the accuracy of the reproduction. Fairly smooth gun, IMO.

I do agree with your opinion on the Norinco SKS, however. They feel less solid than my Yugo, and the two that I have shot had ejection problems (tight chamber?)
 
A material engineer explains why Chinese Norinco steel is superior to most American made steel. As a side not, many gun-smiths won't work on Norincos because the steel is too strong/tough for common American made tools. To cut into the steel, they either have to spot heat the metal first to use their common tool bits or they have to use special expensive carbide bits. But, as the engineer quoted below says, the Norinco steel is "most probably, the alloy most manufacturers WOULD chose to build receivers if tool bits were cheap and labor costs were low."

Wow. This is made of win. Just awesome.
 
from what I have seen the chinease SKS and AKMs are better quality guns than the same era of gun out of east europe. Better finish, better attention of assembly and just more solid guns too.
 
Try a Polytech or Norinco M14S Rifle

The Polytech and Norinco rifles available in the U.S. arrived before the '94 AWB. If you like the M14 rifle platform, you ought to shoot one of these rifles. They are reliable, durable, and generally quite accurate. Their receivers are frequently used for building custom rifles as they are dimensionally the closest to mil-spec. Sure, their metal finish can be rough by our standards and a few parts should be upgraded to USGI, but they are good rifles. While I like the Springfield Armory, Inc. M1A rifle, it costs nearly twice as much as the chinese version.

The Canadians don't have our AWB restrictions. They've continued to import the chinese M14S rifles and the chinese M14S quality is as good as other makers.

While I prefer to buy U.S.A. made products and check the "Made in xxxxx" country sticker before I do, chinese products are rapidly improving in quality.
 
Owning a Chinese made 1911 is like giving up your Citizenship to the Chinese. It's a slap in the face to our Country.

That being said I do have a Chinese SKS that I bought for 80 bucks brand new way back in the days when SKS's were being imported and everyone was buying them in their crates at gun shows. It has worked flawlessly.
 
Owning a Chinese made 1911 is like giving up your Citizenship to the Chinese. It's a slap in the face to our Country.

Couldn't you say that about everything now? Toys, food, clothes, machine parts?

Chinese guns, at least, have a nice irony factor. If they ever DO invade, some Chinese made guns will be used to kill Chinese. Can't say the same for their clothes or toys. And they're probably smart enough not to eat the food they shipped here.
 
I am not really bashing Chinese guns but I do think they command prices that are out of whack with the quality and preformance they deliver.

I understand your reasoning. But I can tell you, there are a lot of US made weapons that fall into that same category, priced way out of whack with the quality and performance they deliver.

Go take a look at the over/under shotgun market or the 1911 market, and you'll see dozens of examples of what I mean.

As others have said, it's just pure supply and demand. They aren't importing Chinese guns into the US anymore, so the supply has stopped, which means prices will go up. Doesn't have anything to do with the quality or performance.
 
Couldn't you say that about everything now? Toys, food, clothes, machine parts?

My point was more geared towards the significance of the 1911 as a Symbol of our country and the bad relations of the Chinese.

The 1911 is a symbol of our Country and its involvement.
 
The 1911 is a symbol of our Country and its involvement.

Some people might consider the flag to be the symbol of the country, and most flags are not manufactured here but in China.

Personally, it's a tool. Just like people say "firearms don't kill people, people kill people". The tool isn't communist nor does it abuse people. <insert cool star wars quote here>
 
I overheard a customer who came in today to my local gunshop.

He was complaining to the clerk that his made in china H&R NEF 12 gauge pump has an extremely loose barrel. The clerk pulled out another one, showed the customer how it was loose as well, then said: "You paid half as much as an 870, you're not going to get 870 fit."

The customer of course then babbled on how the made in china shotgun was "good enough for the price" and ambled away.

I told the clerk it was odd the guy pays china $190 for a piece of crap, then expects Remington Wingmaster quality. The clerk said he hears it every day. People feel the Sako 85, then the Remington 770, then they scream at the staff that they want Sako 85 quality for the price of the 770, and they want it RIGHT NOW.
:banghead:
 
Owning a Chinese made 1911 is like giving up your Citizenship to the Chinese. It's a slap in the face to our Country.
Give it a rest please It's a gun, nothing more and nothing less
We can not raise it to revered status and then tell the antis that it is just a tool
 
I like my Norinco Model of 1911. It's a well built, inexpensive .45 auto. Liked it so much I bought a second. Back when they were around $269 or so.

Sometimes cheap is good.

Took a lot of verbal shinola from Commie haters tho', I will admit. A lot. Had to laugh at them, cause their anger was comical to me.

They were badmouthing the single largest nation (call it an economic machine if that makes ya feel any better) that's financially holding the US dollar afloat, using "Made in China" this and "Made in China" that and I was literally called a "Commie Lover"... and it makes me laugh to this day.

Those Norks are good little shooters too, ya know? Well mine is.

And what's up with the price nowadays of those cheap old PolyTech AK's?
While I haven't shot mine very often (haven't brought it out of the safe in 10 years I bet, preferring to shoot my Russian SKS) cause it's got that micro minie buttstock and I only paid about $325 back in the late 80's (pre-Purdy/Stockton... I thought that was too much then for what it is), I simply cannot believe what people are asking for those things nowadays.

Just shows ya how far the US $ has sunk in the past 20 years... due to those dirty Commies I betcha ;) (and there's some truth to that I have no doubt.)

I only own those couple of Chinese guns (that I recall). Over-rated? Not for what I paid for them knowing how much they whiz off certain political types.

As in all things, YMMV
 
Owning a Chinese made 1911 is like giving up your Citizenship to the Chinese. It's a slap in the face to our Country.

Really? 'Cause I bought a Springfield GI a couple months ago and the frame says (in small print): "Made in Brazil by Imbel". And I bought it over a Taurus because the Taurus I knew was made in Brazil, but I thought, "well, I might as well go all American". And that ladies and gentlemen, was the last time I decided I would ever, "buy American".

I'm pretty sure when you bought all those import Norincos, more dollars went to the American distributer (CAI, Sile, etc.) than went to North China Industries.
 
I can buy Polish, Yugo and Romanian AK in pre-ban config for less than $500.

That doesn't seem right, I see pre-ban yugos and hungarians for equally insane prices.

With the chinese propping up our dollar, we out to be buying chinese for our own sake.:fire:

That said, the norincos really are fine weapons--supposedly the seals bought 'em for opfor (deployment?)--could've had their pick i suppose.

I'd rather buy american in general, but growing up the commie stuff was the exotic, forbidden fruit.
 
The Chinese SKS's are quality.

No, they don't look great... I have compared my Yugo to my old Chinese SKS side by side, stripping them down to examine the bolts, etc... and the Yugo looks nicer and better...

but I will say this, I have never had a malfunction from either... And that is all that really matters.

The Yugo "looks" and "feels" better in every way, but they both work 100%.
 
IMO, "value" is an entirely subjective term. Personally, I consider the several different Chinese firearms that I've owned now and in the past to have been very good values relative to what I paid for them and to the cost of directly comparable items manufactured elsewhere.

EG: I have a Norinco ATD-22, a copy of the little Browning take-down semiauto that Interarms imported back in the day. I bought it for $35 with less than 200 rds through it because the fellow had managed to break one of the fingers off of the extractor and blamed it on the rifle being Chinese "junk". Actually, he apparently hadn't cleaned the packing grease out of the action before using it the first time. This combined with using poor quality bulk ammo had packed so much crud under the extractor that it could no longer move as it should, which resulted in the part beating itself to death in very short order. I'd have used a Norinco part, if Interarms hadn't gone away by then, without a qualm. A Miroku replacement from Brownell's cost about $12 and dropped right in. Now properly maintained, it's gone through literally thousands of rounds without a bobble and still puts 10 rds into a bit over an inch at fifty yds from a bench with the rudimentary open irons with its favorite ammo, when I'm up to the task.

A used Miroku-made Browning in similar condition would've cost about $275-$300 in these parts and would most likely have also trashed the extractor given the same abuse.

I've owned six Chinese SKSes over the years. I still have two: My 'trophy' M21 and a Norinco-made commercial model I bought in 1988 NIB with accessories and 200 rds of ball ammo for about $120, with taxes. None of them broke and none of them - commercial or surplus - were less than completely reliable functionally. I currently own a representitive of the more common makes, a Rommie, an Albie, a Yugo, A Russian Tula '54, the Norinco and the M21. IMO, it's most likely that the main reason is that it was brand-new and manufactured for the commercial export market but the Norinco will consistently group into less than half the area of any of the others.

Then there's the Norinco JW-15 BA .22 Rf that cost about $90. More or less a knock-off of an earlier version of the highly respected CZ-452 design, it'll put 5 rds of Aquila SV .22 LRs or Ely Silhouette into 5/8" or a bit less at 50 yds with a 7X scope and a solid rest.

Finally, there's the .177 'side cocker' air rifle (make and model long forgotten) purchased at a show for about $25. Wood and steel rather than plastic and zinc alloy, throws a 'heavy' 9.2 gr. lead pellet at an average of 810 f/s over a CED chronograph, and puts 10 "Match"-grade pellets into one ragged 3/16" hole at 10M (33'). Try finding a Crossman, Benjamin, Sheriden or Daisy of comparable materials capable of those numbers for even 4X that price. My RWS M48 will match it with a .22 pellet, but it also cost more than 10X the price.

Cosmeticly or aestheticly some of these might fall short of the 'originals', but in terms of function they seem to come off quite well. The wood isn't walnut, the polish not as fine, and the finish machining not of as high an order, but so? What exactly do you expect for a fraction of the price? They're every bit as servicable a tool, much more affordable, and at least as practical for the same uses.

The fact that their value, especially when related to the original cost, on the used market has held up so well after they ceased to be imported ought to be enough to tell you something positive. It's not just scarcity that's done it; it's also because they're still perceived by many folks to offer a level of utility and "value" for the buck at least commensurate with the cost.
 
Big 5 always has a sale going on Chinese made S&W folding knives- MSRP $60, $15 on sale- different models on different weeks, The trick is to look at several since the fit on a liner lock is important and they aren't always consistent. The ones that fit are a good deal, pass on the ones that don't. I just returned one that wasn't up to snuff- the one before that I can shave with and it locks up tight, opens with one hand easily. That's my carry/eatin'/food prep knife. Oh, and my pinned barrel cheapie SKS works OK too. There is no finer beater rifle. If my Sako fell on the ground I would be irritated. If the SKS did, who could tell?
 
You wouldn't be able to buy a "Made in China" anything if there weren't American Importers, American Shippers, American Stores and American Salespeople offering them to you.

As Wholesalers and Retailers, Americans make more money off-of any sale of "Made in China" goods than China does.

Lighten-up and understand how the world works.
 
I've seen polytech aks and they are much nicer than any WASR/SAR out there. As everyone else stated, they're expensive because they're rare. In regards to the SKS, I'll have to disagree. The build quality of my dad's is much nicer than any of the Yugo's I've seen. 1911's? Well, can't comment on that one since I haven't found one. But based on what I've read on these forums, they eat everything you feed em and if that's the case it's already functioning better than the Kimber Pro Carry II I fired.
 
I own chinese rifles and find them to be of good quality...I especially like the 1.5mm thickness of their ak receivers . The bluing on them is nice also.
Bottom line is that if the chinese WANT to, they can make/copy an item and end up with a quality product.
Americans are killing themselve buying chinese JUNK! We should only purchase quality products regardless of country of origin.
 
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