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College defense

Discussion in 'Non-Firearm Weapons' started by conw, Jul 17, 2008.

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  1. conw

    conw Member

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    Being a college student I thought I'd make a list of my SD tools for next semester 'n' maybe get some feedback...being unable to carry, of course, in NC. Hence they are, in fact, non-firearm weapons. I do live off campus and have a car, so I will be well-armed at home and driving about town.

    Better to have some tools than none, right?

    Kimber Lifeact - preferable choice - for drunken heehaws and the like, or the homeless people that sometimes wander onto campus and accost people, etc

    Shillelagh (don't have it yet, from lollysmith) - obvious choice. Pitbulls :)p), serious work ("stick beats knife," right?), etc

    Screwdriver - last ditch - how long is the preferred length, sm?

    Case sodbuster jr. - not really a weapon, but it is another tool.

    Thanks!
     
  2. conw

    conw Member

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    Oh, cell phone obviously, and a 180 lumen Olight.
     
  3. TimboKhan

    TimboKhan Moderator

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    I always packed a knife when I was in college, so there is that. Truth be told, I always had a "truck gun" too. I don't think that's allowed here in CO, and I was taking a big risk getting caught, but I have a good, quickly accessible hiding spot in my truck and my truck is pretty nondescript. In any event, I graduated in 07, so it's a non-issue now.
     
  4. TAB

    TAB Member

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    The only tool you really need is your brain...
     
  5. j-easy

    j-easy Member

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    College defense? now that's an oxymoron if i ever heard one.
     
  6. Cosmoline

    Cosmoline Member

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    Shillelagh or a good walking stick of some sort would be my number one suggestion. It gives you more leverage and impact force than any knife and is considerably easier to deploy and use effectively. It can also be carried openly without causing undue alarm, esp. if you fake a wee limp. One thing you might also consider is taking martial arts courses at your college if they're offered.
     
  7. hso

    hso Moderator Staff Member

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    If you don't live on campus you can exercise good judgment and situational awareness and avoid "drunken heehaws". Homeless folks don't tend to be much of a threat (outside of those states/cities that tolerate aggressive panhandlers). Keep the Lifeact for going and coming out of the campus parking garages.

    How are you going to encounter pitbulls on campus??? You may want to consider something that is less obvious than a short cudgel (you're not talking about a cane after all). Find some normal campus gear that serves the same purpose so that it can hide in plain sight in that environment.

    Add a couple of other tools to that and you might have a good explanation for why you're carrying them around in your bag, but you're going to tire of lugging them around. Remember that anything you use will have to be explained. I'd rather carry a socket wrench and explain that you got tired of people stealing your tools from the car.

    Any knife will do, if you will.
     
    Last edited: Jul 17, 2008
  8. kBob

    kBob Member

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    Not quite three decades ago I was a college student. WHen there started to be some serial assaults on campus the response of the campus and local police was to hammer folks they found carrying guns or sheath knives. Keep in mind there were not five thousand choices of quality folders available. There was no pepperspray. No pocket flashlights that qould burn the eyeballs out of a bad guy at half a mile.

    Sure I liked my little 5 shot .38 Special snubbie and a flat but heavy Beretta M34 .380, but I felt I was far more likely to be stopped by a cop while walking the two miles from my of campus appartment to my girl buddy's appartment on the other side of campus than be assaulted.

    Sure I had my Buck 112 in its little belt sheath, and a folder in my front left, but neither was as fast as might need be.

    As it happened girlbuddy had an older MG that was frequently in need of repair. On those evening walks I there for carried the flat head and philips head screw drivers and cresent wrench I might need to work on her car with. As it turned out I needed them for the car on more than one occassion, ended up never stopped by LEOs and in the closest thing to an assault I suffered did not use them.

    The four man gang that was doing the sexual assaults were caught and deported to their home land where sheria law was in force and large caucasian guys on campus breathed a sigh of releif.

    What ever you do, stay with in the letter of the law and where possible the spirit of it as well.

    Most importantly, take your brain along with you. Pay attention to what is going on. Don't feel you need to stand up to an annoying drunk redneck, move along, nothing to see or prove there.

    -Bob Hollingsworth
     
  9. wheelgunslinger

    wheelgunslinger Member

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    I attended App State and found the biggest danger by far was presented by the white collar gangs with Greek letters.
    Most of the frat guys come from well to do families that can and will pay them out of trouble, or know how to work the system so that the charges don't go off campus and on their criminal record. And, once you tangle with one, you have to tangle with 50.

    The drunken heehaw guys weren't ever really a major problem.

    The rugby team was also another good group you could count on to start trouble, and they went either in pairs or groups. But, I played rugby and was friendly with them. And, they seemed to enjoy the challenge of taking on Football players instead of hippies and bony potheads.

    In other words, you can likely handle any one on one conflict you may get into on campus by just putting up your dukes if you must and seeing who comes out on top. But, campus has a lot more pack mentality violence than you might believe.

    So, you might consider spending time working on your core and cardio training to make sure that if you have to run for your life that you actually can, since you have to be disarmed on campus.

    The hardened cane or walking stick might work. I wouldn't employ a hiking or trekking pole since they'll break or fold on the first whack.
     
  10. conw

    conw Member

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    TAB, forgot to list that one.

    j-easy, have you been reading Abby Hoffman or something? Maybe I should go back to working for $12/hr for the rest of my life...yeah...good idea. **** the system!

    Cosmoline, thanks. I weight train a lot, and do sometimes hurt my ankles.......

    hso, I do try to exercise good judgment. Drunken heehaws was a non-discriminatory way of saying frat boys. Aggressive panhandlers are tolerated, but not so much on campus - more like the exigent areas. The pitbull reference was a joke about Carl Levitian's recent account of using his shillelagh defensively...

    kbob, thanks. I appreciate that input. My mindset is similar to the last paragraph; I think I have the S&T down pretty well, I'm working on my tool set. But reminders are good too.

    wheelgunslinger, thanks. I train with the rugby team, and they're pretty nice guys...my conditioning is pretty good at the moment, I made a thread on it here if you're interested in weight training stuff.

    Thanks for the advice everyone...keep it coming.

    PS: hso, the lollysmith shillelaghs are about 3.2' long, so they are in the "plausibly a cane" realm.
     
  11. Saba

    Saba Member

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    Non Lethal Self Defense Gear

    Hey,

    Well depending on what state you live in, there are several options available to you. As one post said, the primary weapon is your brains but when you support that with non lethal devices you will be in good shape.
    Now what self defense weapon to get depends on the type of person you are. Deep down are you a person who can RESPONSIBLY have a knife with you and use it first as a deterrent before using it as a last resort or will you go out swinging at the smallest sign of threat. The reason I ask that is because you always have to take the law into account when deploying a weapon (lethal or otherwise).
    Self defense is not just using a weapon. There is something called verbal self defense where if you know how to talk your way out of a situation then you re truly well armed.

    sometimes just how you walk or talk can tell a lot to your potential attacker. The objective is never to use your weapon, but to have it "just in case"

    Lets assume you are a person with a vulnerable demeanor/disposition and an attackers gets attracted to you somehow. If you are looking for a non lethan self defense device while you are outdoors then something like a taser gun or stun gun can do the job well and even a personal alarm.
    Reason I say that is because stun guns have an amazing psychological as well as physical effect.
    it is psychological because just engaging the probes infront of an attacker can send them packing. And if they venture closer, you can stun the daylights out f them. Some stun guns have up to over 1 million volts of take down power.
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]

    Indoors:
    If you are indoors then to protect your house you can get many other options. You can get a stun baton or taser that you can have under your pillow. For the house you can install window alarms and door jammers.

    A burglars worst nightmare is Sound, light and time. If you can enhance these three things you will probably stay safe.

    Got the images from: www.safetybasement.com
     
  12. conw

    conw Member

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    Saba, the knife is more for apples and cheese and string.

    I don't much care for the idea of a stun gun unless it was a projectile (Taser) model, and I am trying to avoid overt weapons. Aside from the pepper spray, which is "less than lethal." (I know, so are electrical weapons, but they would get me in more trouble here).

    I am pretty well outfitted for my house...a couple of guns there.

    Thanks for the reply. I liked what you said about 'mindset.'
     
  13. JShirley

    JShirley Administrator Staff Member

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    I don't believe advertising your weapons is a good policy.
     
  14. conw

    conw Member

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    Were you talking to me or the previous poster JS?
     
  15. M203Sniper

    M203Sniper member

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    Don't underestimate the effectivness of a stun Gun, and don't jump on a Taser because it is a projectile. Read up on their AFID first.

    Every time a TASER cartridge is deployed, 20-30 small confetti-like Anti-Felon Identification (AFID) tags are ejected. Each AFID is printed with the serial number of the cartridge deployed, allowing law enforcement to determine which cartridge was fired. This system was originally developed to prevent misuse of TASER devices by private citizen users

    http://www.taser.com/research/technology/Pages/AFID.aspx

    That's why I'll never own a taser.



    You might consider a pocket knife and some training as your most effective tool and keep an ASP or bat in your car....if your not the road rage type.
     
  16. j-easy

    j-easy Member

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    not what i meant, i'm referring to the fact that you can't have guns for personal protection on campus. leaving law abiding college students defenseless against the criminals who will bring weapons regardless of laws. now this isn't going to stop me from getting my education, but it really annoys me.
     
  17. TAB

    TAB Member

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    if you beleave a gun is the only way to defend yourself, chances are very good you won't be able to defend yourself with one.

    Its not the hardware folks, its the software.
     
  18. j-easy

    j-easy Member

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    the gun would be the most effective tool for defending against a threat with a gun, you can't run away from bullets.
     
  19. hso

    hso Moderator Staff Member

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    conwict,

    John's addressing Saba's reference to displaying a knife
    . Neither one of us, nor most trainers, advocate brandishing a knife to change the minds of an attacker. A knife is a lethal weapon that gets it's maximum benefit during an attack by being deployed without the attacker seeing it. Common thought aside, brandishing a knife is not a good idea. Most of Saba's other advice is consistent with SD trainers.
     
  20. TAB

    TAB Member

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    ok so some one points a gun at you and says give me your money.

    Do you:

    A) draw your weapon and fire

    B) give him your money








    A will get you killed, I don't care how fast you are, your not faster then some ones trigger finger.

    B might get you killed, but you atleast have a chance.

    With out training all a gun is going to do is make your pants fall down.
     
  21. j-easy

    j-easy Member

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    the point i was trying to make is that it should be allowed on college campuses just like most other public places.
     
  22. TAB

    TAB Member

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    colleges are not public places.
     
  23. j-easy

    j-easy Member

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    what im saying is that if i can legally have a gun in my car or concealed carry at a grocery store, bank, my workplace etc. i should be able to legally do it on a college campus
     
  24. TAB

    TAB Member

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    why?
     
  25. Cosmoline

    Cosmoline Member

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    That's a gross oversimplification. Whether or not you have a good opportunity to draw and fire depends on the circumstances. You may, or you may not. But if you have no firearm you will have a much harder time taking advantage of any opportunities that arise. I personally know two people alive and kicking who shot and killed armed criminals in confrontations. Criminals aren't always the brightest bulbs around and if you're paying attention and have iron to hand you can get your lead in first.

    It's useful, but I cannot kill people with my brain alone. I've tried and they just stand there laughing at me.

    That's worthy of its own thread, but my own feeling is if the college is taking public funds (as virtually all do) it must recognize basic constitutional rights. That doesn't mean they have to let everyone on campus, but those they do let on should be able to carry if they are able to do so outside campus.
     
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