comparison between 357mag and 357sig?
- Thread starter arinvolvo
- Start date
- Status
For ballistics comparison, ammo manufacturers web sites should give a good amount of data. And yes the 357 SIG was developed to mirror the .357 Magnums 125 grain JHP's performance. The magnums performance in law enforcement was legendary, and most auto pistols didn't measure up in some peoples eyes. With light bullets (125gr.), velocity is roughly the same. The magnum can handle much heavier bullets, up to 200 grains, but the SIG tops out at 150 grains, and doesn't drive them very fast. The magnum also has the advantage of using semi-jacketed hollowpoints, which expand/break up better than the SIG's jacketed HP's, which are required for the auto's feed cycle.
There's really no comparison between the two--it's really an apples and oranges thing. The .357 Magnum will easily drive a 125-grain Gold Dot anywhere from 150 to 250 fps faster out out of a four inch barrel than any 357 SIG, and the 357 SIG is just not in the same league as the .357 Magnum when it comes to load selection and just plain all around versatility.
4 inch S&W L frame Mt. Gun
180gr. Hard cast LFN = 1375 fps
170gr JHC = 1411 fps (faster than most 357 SIG factory 125-grain loads)
158gr. Gold Dot = 1485 fps (faster than 357 SIG factory 125-grain loads)
125gr. Gold Dot = 1603 fps (easily topping any 357 SIG factory load)
To be honest, the 10mm--and only with its very hottest factory loads--just barely approaches the .357 Magnum's hottest factory loads. A better (far closer and "fairer") comparison would be to compare the 357 SIG to the 10mm.
4 inch S&W L frame Mt. Gun
180gr. Hard cast LFN = 1375 fps
170gr JHC = 1411 fps (faster than most 357 SIG factory 125-grain loads)
158gr. Gold Dot = 1485 fps (faster than 357 SIG factory 125-grain loads)
125gr. Gold Dot = 1603 fps (easily topping any 357 SIG factory load)
To be honest, the 10mm--and only with its very hottest factory loads--just barely approaches the .357 Magnum's hottest factory loads. A better (far closer and "fairer") comparison would be to compare the 357 SIG to the 10mm.
Standing Wolf
Member in memoriam
I'm sure the bottle-necked .357 SIG is much more difficult to reload than the .357 magnum.
Sean Smith
Member
- Joined
- Dec 28, 2002
- Messages
- 4,925
The hottest .357 Sig load available is the Cor-Bon 125gr @ 1,425 ft/sec. By way of comparison, the factory 125gr .357 Magnum loads that it was supposed to emulate were the Remington and Federal 125gr @ 1,450 ft/sec loads. In that light, .357 Sig does a pretty good job of what it was meant to do. But it is a one-trick pony; the ballistics really crap out as you increase bullet weight in .357 Sig, since the case capacity just isn't there.
Maybe, but here .357 Sig gets beat on like a read-headed stepchild. Aside from being a smaller bore (like the .357 Magnum), we have to consider that the hottest .357 Sig load we can find is something like 575 foot-pounds at the muzzle. The hottest factory 10mm load is more like 767.
Maybe, but here .357 Sig gets beat on like a read-headed stepchild. Aside from being a smaller bore (like the .357 Magnum), we have to consider that the hottest .357 Sig load we can find is something like 575 foot-pounds at the muzzle. The hottest factory 10mm load is more like 767.
fastbolt
Member
I no longer have any of the early info I once collected regarding many of the velocity comparisons.
I think your second statement is about as generally appropriate as anything else that's been offered.
From Winchester's catalog ...
X3576P 125gr .357 Magnum, 4" Vented barrel:
1450fps @ muzzle; 1427fps @ 5yds; 1338fps @ 25yds
583fpe @ muzzle; 497fps @ 25yds
RA357SIGT 125gr 357SIG, 4" barrel:
1350fps @ muzzle; 1331fps @ 5yds; 1262fps @ 25yds
506fpe @ muzzle; 442fpe @ 25yds
These are the same figures listed for both the Q4309 (125gr FMJFN) & the USA357SJHP (125gr JHP)
A couple of things have always stood out, at least to me, since I first started reading all of the articles, reviews, ballistics tests, etc. for the 357SIG ... and especially after shooting the cartridge.
Many magazine article authors have always said that the solid barrel of the semiauto pistol provides the advantage of lacking the barrel/cylinder gap of a revolver ... and it does ... but they've often also claimed that this is why the semiauto caliber can achieve the performance of the rimmed revolver cartridge.
That being the case, why did earlier ballistics testing of service length 4" revolvers often show a velocity of 1400-1450fps for 125gr .357 Magnum ammunition, and yet the average major ammunition manufacturers ... such as Winchester, for example ... often show a tested velocity of only 1350fps from 4" barrels in the 357SIG?
Sure, the unburned powder (responsible for the greater muzzle flash in 4" barreled service revolvers) in the revolver cases DID provide for even higher velocities in longer revolver barrels, and some of the revolver round's potential was unrealized in 4" barreled revolvers.
But why is the average major factory ammunition only generating in the low-to-mid 1300's fps with the 125gr 357SIG load from solid semiauto barrels?
I guess what the magazine writers really meant was that the new 357SIG was able to attain the "lesser" potential .357 Magnum velocities realized out of short service length revolver barrels ... which is what a couple of authors actually implied, if not directly said.
So, the 357SIG does almost reach the velocities of the .357 Magnum, but only in the Magnum's lesser performance envelope, when fired out of shorter revolver barrels.
Since this was the common service length barrel, and the barrel length involved in most of the earlier anecdotal "street performance" statistics, it makes sense that it would be appropriate to "compare" the new semiauto pistol caliber to it. It DID have many magazine authors' approval as being the defensive hangun caliber "King of the Street", as one author called it ...
Actually, I used to have some older chrono listings for some 125gr .357 magnum loads fired out of 2.5" & 3" revolvers ... and the velocities listed showed a broad average in the low-to-mid 1300's fps ... just about where a 4" 357SIG pistol seems to exhibit velocities with 125gr loads.
Of course, many of the smaller ammunition companies are offering faster velocities in 357SIG, although most of them are using bullets that have been designed and tested for slightly lesser optimal velocities. That doesn't mean they may not perform well at the highter velocities ... but neither does loading them to faster velocities necessarily guarantee "better" performance. That's what standardized, carefully controlled testing can determine for us ...
So, the fans of the 357SIG will naturally say that none of this matters, because the cartridge is better when it comes to perceived recoil & controllability ... but that might be more the result of the platform in which it's being used.
It also can be carried in greater capacity magazines. True.
Then, there's the bullet design issue. Revolvers aren't sensitive to "feeding" issues ... and the revolver caliber does offer a lot more versatility in regard to bullet weight & design.
But it still seems to me, anyway, to always come back to the how the 357SIG is kinda, sorta, supposed to duplicate the performance of the more powerful revolver round's "statistical street results" ... when the revolver round was fired from the shorter service length barrels.
As I remember when I used to carry an issued .357 Magnum revolver, it was explained to me that we issued the shorter 4" barreled models ... instead of the longer, and potentially more powerful 5"-6" barreled models ... because it was more comfortable for the smaller statured cops that started entering L/E in the 70's. Nobody really wanted to argue that the longer barrels might not offer a bit more "performance" than the shorter barrels, though ... It was more that the shorter barrels seemed to offer "enough".
Of course, it didn't hurt that the M19 was reportedly Bill Jordan's favorite balance of platform size, weight and caliber performance ... but he was probably a bit "better" when it came his presentation and shooting skills than most folks wearing badges hither & yon ...
I've always wondered what Bill Jordan might've said if someone told him he HAD to carry a Level 3 security holster, instead of his "antiquated", unsafe ... from a modern "officer safety viewpoint" ... preferred pouch holster.
So, I think the 357SIG probably WAS intended, at least partially, to duplicate the "popular" American .357 Magnum 125gr load ...
Did it achieve its goal?
Well, if you consider the average velocities of the major American ammunition manufacturers ... probably not quite ... not at velocities in the 1300's fps.
Is it "performing" well? Well, the anecdotal results seem to indicate it's working as well as the other 3 major calibers in use in L/E ... and that's an entirely different, and muchly debated, topic.
Just to leave you with this final thought ... a recap of the earlier Winchester data, with the RA9TA 127gr +P+ 9mm load listed ...
125gr .357 Magnum - 1450fps
125gr 357SIG - 1350fps
127gr 9mm +P+ - 1250fps
So, I suppose velocity-wise the 357SIG is about halfway between the 9mm +P+ (and a couple of other 124gr +P loads, which are more easily available to non-L/E) and the .357 Magnum ... but only when fired from a short barreled revolver.
I've always LIKED the .357 magnum cartridge, but then I spent a lot of range time toward developing my skills with it. I carry the 9mm in the hotter major factory loadings because I feel it's adequate for my defensive needs ... and it's also issued to me ... but the 357SIG leaves me a bit lukewarm.
I think your second statement is about as generally appropriate as anything else that's been offered.
From Winchester's catalog ...
X3576P 125gr .357 Magnum, 4" Vented barrel:
1450fps @ muzzle; 1427fps @ 5yds; 1338fps @ 25yds
583fpe @ muzzle; 497fps @ 25yds
RA357SIGT 125gr 357SIG, 4" barrel:
1350fps @ muzzle; 1331fps @ 5yds; 1262fps @ 25yds
506fpe @ muzzle; 442fpe @ 25yds
These are the same figures listed for both the Q4309 (125gr FMJFN) & the USA357SJHP (125gr JHP)
A couple of things have always stood out, at least to me, since I first started reading all of the articles, reviews, ballistics tests, etc. for the 357SIG ... and especially after shooting the cartridge.
Many magazine article authors have always said that the solid barrel of the semiauto pistol provides the advantage of lacking the barrel/cylinder gap of a revolver ... and it does ... but they've often also claimed that this is why the semiauto caliber can achieve the performance of the rimmed revolver cartridge.
That being the case, why did earlier ballistics testing of service length 4" revolvers often show a velocity of 1400-1450fps for 125gr .357 Magnum ammunition, and yet the average major ammunition manufacturers ... such as Winchester, for example ... often show a tested velocity of only 1350fps from 4" barrels in the 357SIG?
Sure, the unburned powder (responsible for the greater muzzle flash in 4" barreled service revolvers) in the revolver cases DID provide for even higher velocities in longer revolver barrels, and some of the revolver round's potential was unrealized in 4" barreled revolvers.
But why is the average major factory ammunition only generating in the low-to-mid 1300's fps with the 125gr 357SIG load from solid semiauto barrels?
I guess what the magazine writers really meant was that the new 357SIG was able to attain the "lesser" potential .357 Magnum velocities realized out of short service length revolver barrels ... which is what a couple of authors actually implied, if not directly said.
So, the 357SIG does almost reach the velocities of the .357 Magnum, but only in the Magnum's lesser performance envelope, when fired out of shorter revolver barrels.
Since this was the common service length barrel, and the barrel length involved in most of the earlier anecdotal "street performance" statistics, it makes sense that it would be appropriate to "compare" the new semiauto pistol caliber to it. It DID have many magazine authors' approval as being the defensive hangun caliber "King of the Street", as one author called it ...
Actually, I used to have some older chrono listings for some 125gr .357 magnum loads fired out of 2.5" & 3" revolvers ... and the velocities listed showed a broad average in the low-to-mid 1300's fps ... just about where a 4" 357SIG pistol seems to exhibit velocities with 125gr loads.
Of course, many of the smaller ammunition companies are offering faster velocities in 357SIG, although most of them are using bullets that have been designed and tested for slightly lesser optimal velocities. That doesn't mean they may not perform well at the highter velocities ... but neither does loading them to faster velocities necessarily guarantee "better" performance. That's what standardized, carefully controlled testing can determine for us ...
So, the fans of the 357SIG will naturally say that none of this matters, because the cartridge is better when it comes to perceived recoil & controllability ... but that might be more the result of the platform in which it's being used.
It also can be carried in greater capacity magazines. True.
Then, there's the bullet design issue. Revolvers aren't sensitive to "feeding" issues ... and the revolver caliber does offer a lot more versatility in regard to bullet weight & design.
But it still seems to me, anyway, to always come back to the how the 357SIG is kinda, sorta, supposed to duplicate the performance of the more powerful revolver round's "statistical street results" ... when the revolver round was fired from the shorter service length barrels.
As I remember when I used to carry an issued .357 Magnum revolver, it was explained to me that we issued the shorter 4" barreled models ... instead of the longer, and potentially more powerful 5"-6" barreled models ... because it was more comfortable for the smaller statured cops that started entering L/E in the 70's. Nobody really wanted to argue that the longer barrels might not offer a bit more "performance" than the shorter barrels, though ... It was more that the shorter barrels seemed to offer "enough".
Of course, it didn't hurt that the M19 was reportedly Bill Jordan's favorite balance of platform size, weight and caliber performance ... but he was probably a bit "better" when it came his presentation and shooting skills than most folks wearing badges hither & yon ...
I've always wondered what Bill Jordan might've said if someone told him he HAD to carry a Level 3 security holster, instead of his "antiquated", unsafe ... from a modern "officer safety viewpoint" ... preferred pouch holster.
So, I think the 357SIG probably WAS intended, at least partially, to duplicate the "popular" American .357 Magnum 125gr load ...
Did it achieve its goal?
Well, if you consider the average velocities of the major American ammunition manufacturers ... probably not quite ... not at velocities in the 1300's fps.
Is it "performing" well? Well, the anecdotal results seem to indicate it's working as well as the other 3 major calibers in use in L/E ... and that's an entirely different, and muchly debated, topic.
Just to leave you with this final thought ... a recap of the earlier Winchester data, with the RA9TA 127gr +P+ 9mm load listed ...
125gr .357 Magnum - 1450fps
125gr 357SIG - 1350fps
127gr 9mm +P+ - 1250fps
So, I suppose velocity-wise the 357SIG is about halfway between the 9mm +P+ (and a couple of other 124gr +P loads, which are more easily available to non-L/E) and the .357 Magnum ... but only when fired from a short barreled revolver.
I've always LIKED the .357 magnum cartridge, but then I spent a lot of range time toward developing my skills with it. I carry the 9mm in the hotter major factory loadings because I feel it's adequate for my defensive needs ... and it's also issued to me ... but the 357SIG leaves me a bit lukewarm.
Last edited:
In agreement with most of the posters here, there seems to be a small vocal group which spends a lot of energy attempting to convince the rest of us that a 357 Sig equals a 357 Mag. It doesn't, it gets close with one bullet weight, and close only counts in my book with atom bombs, hand grenades, and teen aged sex.
This subject has been beat to death, even my pet ducks the 38 supercomp and the 9x23 only get close. And none of these perform with heavy bullets.
This isn't a comment one way or the other on the performance of the 357 Sig, I don't own one and since it pretty much duplicates one of my favorite rounds the 38 Super, I probably never will.
This subject has been beat to death, even my pet ducks the 38 supercomp and the 9x23 only get close. And none of these perform with heavy bullets.
This isn't a comment one way or the other on the performance of the 357 Sig, I don't own one and since it pretty much duplicates one of my favorite rounds the 38 Super, I probably never will.
I'm not a big fan of the .357 Sig, but to say that it's useless since it only approximates .357Mag performance with one bullet weight ignores one very pertinent fact.
The 125 grain loading of the .357Mag that is roughly duplicated by the .357Sig was probably the most common "antipersonnel" .357Mag loading and was/still is thought by many to be one of the premier "stopping" loads ever fielded in a handgun.
Or, said another way, it does exactly what it was intended to do and nothing more.
To say it's worthless because it can't handle 180 grain bullets overlooks the fact that it was never intended to do anything like that. It was intended to do ONE thing, and that one thing is what it, in fact, does.
The 125 grain loading of the .357Mag that is roughly duplicated by the .357Sig was probably the most common "antipersonnel" .357Mag loading and was/still is thought by many to be one of the premier "stopping" loads ever fielded in a handgun.
Or, said another way, it does exactly what it was intended to do and nothing more.
To say it's worthless because it can't handle 180 grain bullets overlooks the fact that it was never intended to do anything like that. It was intended to do ONE thing, and that one thing is what it, in fact, does.
worthless???????
No, I don't think so at all. I think it duplicates another of my favorite rounds, redundant maybe, but definately not worthless. It does what it was designed to do which is work in 9mm/40SW platforms.
When I said it doesn't equal heavier bullets I was refering to 140-158 gr bullets, discuussion of 180 gr bullets in the 357 Sig are pointless when compared to the 357 mag ( which isn't the hottest platform for this heavy of a bullet either )
No, I don't think so at all. I think it duplicates another of my favorite rounds, redundant maybe, but definately not worthless. It does what it was designed to do which is work in 9mm/40SW platforms.
When I said it doesn't equal heavier bullets I was refering to 140-158 gr bullets, discuussion of 180 gr bullets in the 357 Sig are pointless when compared to the 357 mag ( which isn't the hottest platform for this heavy of a bullet either )
caz223
Member
Just an uninformed opinon, but I'll bet a 4" .357SIG would be fairly close to 125 grain bullets out of a snubby .357 revolver.
"This isn't a comment one way or the other on the performance of the 357 Sig, I don't own one and since it pretty much duplicates one of my favorite rounds the 38 Super, I probably never will."
That's the point that always stumps me (this isn't a shot at schrompf, either, I pretty much agree with what he says). The .357 Sig is hotter than most .38 Super factory loads, more inherently accurate than most .38 Supers, more inherently reliable than most .38 Supers, available in more makes and models than the .38 Super and available in a smaller package than most .38 Supers, yet people bend over backward to crap on the .357 Sig while still singing the praises of the .38 Super.
The .38 Super is a good round and if you already have one, it makes sense to ignore the .357 Sig. I just don't get why the .357 Sig is automatically rejected while there's a lingering "wow" factor with the .38 Super. Maybe somebody needs to build a .357 Sig 1911?
That's the point that always stumps me (this isn't a shot at schrompf, either, I pretty much agree with what he says). The .357 Sig is hotter than most .38 Super factory loads, more inherently accurate than most .38 Supers, more inherently reliable than most .38 Supers, available in more makes and models than the .38 Super and available in a smaller package than most .38 Supers, yet people bend over backward to crap on the .357 Sig while still singing the praises of the .38 Super.
The .38 Super is a good round and if you already have one, it makes sense to ignore the .357 Sig. I just don't get why the .357 Sig is automatically rejected while there's a lingering "wow" factor with the .38 Super. Maybe somebody needs to build a .357 Sig 1911?
Sean Smith
Member
- Joined
- Dec 28, 2002
- Messages
- 4,925
The .357 Sig is hotter than most .38 Super factory loads
-This is true. The hottest .38 Super factory ammo I've seen is Cor-Bon, which at 125gr @ 1,350 ft/sec matches the low end of .357 Sig self-defense ammo.
more inherently accurate than most .38 Supers
-Based on what? People claim their caliber is more "inherently accurate" all the time, but nobody can back this up with actual evidence.
more inherently reliable than most .38 Supers
- Depends on the platform. .357 Sig in a 1911 (or any other platform designed for .45 ACP) is much LESS reliable by design than .38 Super. And short bottlenecks have potential reliability problems all their own.
-This is true. The hottest .38 Super factory ammo I've seen is Cor-Bon, which at 125gr @ 1,350 ft/sec matches the low end of .357 Sig self-defense ammo.
more inherently accurate than most .38 Supers
-Based on what? People claim their caliber is more "inherently accurate" all the time, but nobody can back this up with actual evidence.
more inherently reliable than most .38 Supers
- Depends on the platform. .357 Sig in a 1911 (or any other platform designed for .45 ACP) is much LESS reliable by design than .38 Super. And short bottlenecks have potential reliability problems all their own.
I think two factors are the .38 Super is one of the best running cartridges in the 1911 platform. The other is what a .38 Super can be with gunsmith tweaking, change out the barrel to a fully supported and an accuracy package, and the .38 Supercomp is an awesome package. For those interested I provided a link to what it is capable of below:
http://home.columbus.rr.com/jmaass/documents/hl38sup.pdf
1450 fps with a 124-125 gr bullet. Not too shabby and really does duplicate the 357 Mag ballistics.
BOATS: check out the 180gr .38 supermag loads above, 1000+ fps in the .38 Supercomp. Actually I think your numbers could be bettered a little by handloads in the 357 Mag.
I really think if the 357 Sig fans want to have the cartridge looked at in a more favorable light they should quit trying to compare it to other cartridges. It is a good enough round it can stand alone on its own merits: the hottest practical 38 in a short auto, it doesn't NEED to be any more, and when comparisions get added it just muddies the waters.
Like I stated intially I have a couple of .38 supers, and the 357 Sig wasn't even a glint in the designers eye when I got mine ( actually the 40 S&W didn't exist then either ) so for me it is a non issue. I load for my 38 Supers and the 1911 platform is my favorite so even if I was in the market for another handgun in this category it would be another 38 Super. I was honest up front my 1911 38 Supers are some of my favorite guns, one of mine is a Commander length pre 70 Colt, the other is a 80 series tricked out to be a supercomp, and since I like them so well I am unarguably biased.
If I want performance in excess of these levels, that is why I own 10mm's and 41 Mags, Sean Smith is right 100% the 38's are never going to match these energy levels.
38 super accuracy
Sean,
I would think that accuracy statement would be just about impossible to substantiate, I think a NRM series 80 Colt, with a Schuemann AET barrel, accuracy work and a trigger job , done by either Dane Burns or Ted Yost would be a very tough platform to beat. I wouldn't bet any of my dollars against it.
As for small packages my Commander is almost the same size as my sons Glock 19, unless Khar is making 357 Sigs I don't see a smaller package, the only real advantage is a couple of extra rounds.
Sean,
I would think that accuracy statement would be just about impossible to substantiate, I think a NRM series 80 Colt, with a Schuemann AET barrel, accuracy work and a trigger job , done by either Dane Burns or Ted Yost would be a very tough platform to beat. I wouldn't bet any of my dollars against it.
As for small packages my Commander is almost the same size as my sons Glock 19, unless Khar is making 357 Sigs I don't see a smaller package, the only real advantage is a couple of extra rounds.
Sean Smith
Member
- Joined
- Dec 28, 2002
- Messages
- 4,925
Did someone say AET? 
The top extremity (and, really, the only end) of .357 Sig performance is essentially equal to the bottom side of .357 magnum performance. There is nothing wrong with that; but, PLEASE, do not suggest the .357 Sig and the .357 magnum are fundamentally equal -- they are not!
"-Based on what? People claim their caliber is more "inherently accurate" all the time, but nobody can back this up with actual evidence."
Point taken. I base that on what I've seen with stock .38 Supers versus the stock Sig P-series, which isn't relevant to anyone else. You can tweak the .38 Super very nicely.
I'm just saying I don't really get why every discussion of .357 Sig ends up being, "Well, it ain't a .357 mag!" while every discussion of .38 Super ends up being, "Neat round, it's a shame it never really caught on." Again, not slamming .38 Super.
I compare my P239 to my SP101, not to my six inch 586. And it compares pretty nicely.
Point taken. I base that on what I've seen with stock .38 Supers versus the stock Sig P-series, which isn't relevant to anyone else. You can tweak the .38 Super very nicely.
I'm just saying I don't really get why every discussion of .357 Sig ends up being, "Well, it ain't a .357 mag!" while every discussion of .38 Super ends up being, "Neat round, it's a shame it never really caught on." Again, not slamming .38 Super.
I compare my P239 to my SP101, not to my six inch 586. And it compares pretty nicely.
Sean Smith
Member
- Joined
- Dec 28, 2002
- Messages
- 4,925
Maybe just nostalgia. .38 Super has been around for a long time.
cratz2
Member
I don't count myself among 357 SIG fans, but to me it's pretty silly to dismiss the cartridge because of how it compares to other .355"/.357" caliber cartridges. It is what it is and that's all that it is... and it is a formidable service cartridge, primarily for modern pistols originally intended for 9mm or 40S&W cartridges.
As for use in the 1911... I just don't know. I don't really see the reason. I mean, what exactly can a 357 SIG do that a 9x23 can't do? And the 9x23 will hold more rounds and I really doubt the 357 SIG would be inheirantly more accurate than a 9x23 in a relatively loosely-fitted pistol intended for combat.
And speaking of Dane Burns, I'd be willing to bet that if you approached him with the idea of building a carry 1911 in 357 SIG, he just might possibly try to persuade you to consider the 9x23.
As for use in the 1911... I just don't know. I don't really see the reason. I mean, what exactly can a 357 SIG do that a 9x23 can't do? And the 9x23 will hold more rounds and I really doubt the 357 SIG would be inheirantly more accurate than a 9x23 in a relatively loosely-fitted pistol intended for combat.
And speaking of Dane Burns, I'd be willing to bet that if you approached him with the idea of building a carry 1911 in 357 SIG, he just might possibly try to persuade you to consider the 9x23.
The part I don't get about 357 Sig is why it even exists when the 40 was already there. It does nothing the 40 can't, and the 40 will do things the 357 can't like use heavy bullets. Why drop down .040" in bore to be limited in available bullet weights to 115-147grains and have to hunt for factory ammo? With the 40 you have 135- 200 grain choices.
'357 Sig' sounds cool, and the P-series guns it first came in are nearly without peer, but the only thing going for the 357 sig is marketing. The 40 does it all and more.
9mm cartridges that are equal to or more powerful than the 357 sig are plenty .
The 357 sig was a solution to a problem that didn't exist.
'357 Sig' sounds cool, and the P-series guns it first came in are nearly without peer, but the only thing going for the 357 sig is marketing. The 40 does it all and more.
9mm cartridges that are equal to or more powerful than the 357 sig are plenty .
The 357 sig was a solution to a problem that didn't exist.
AGGHHHHHHH!!!!!
Sean,
That is cruel and unusual punishment posting your 10mm, especially when my Delta is in the shop. I was so bummed about it I didn't take any Auto's to the range last weekend and only took wheel guns. If I don't get it back soon I am going to go from occasionally grumpy to a whole season of Grump.
Sean,
That is cruel and unusual punishment posting your 10mm, especially when my Delta is in the shop. I was so bummed about it I didn't take any Auto's to the range last weekend and only took wheel guns. If I don't get it back soon I am going to go from occasionally grumpy to a whole season of Grump.
i like the idea of bottlenecked pistol rounds, and I've thought a lot about the SIG round a personal defense choice, but to call a spade a spade it's really a hot 9mm, and the ".357 SIG" is just good marketing.
If you like velocity, the SIG is a good choice, and i've heard Texas Dept. of Public Safety has had a good track record with it.
still it's no .357 magnum.
If you like velocity, the SIG is a good choice, and i've heard Texas Dept. of Public Safety has had a good track record with it.
still it's no .357 magnum.
ny32182
Member
The 357 sig is the hottest 38 caliber available in normal size modern autoloaders, period. What will it do that the forty won't? Not a whole lot, given some of the current very hot .40 loads. But then, I do like the forty more than most.
This is simply not true by any stretch. The hottest 9mm SD factory loads on the market can barely match normal 357sig range ammo. 357sig SD loads can EXCEED 1400 fps... 150 fps hotter than the hottest 9mm.
This is the exact reason I'm considering a 357sig barrel for my P226, which came with the .40 barrel from the factory. I like what both rounds can do, and the 357sig comes with less recoil in my experience.
This is simply not true by any stretch. The hottest 9mm SD factory loads on the market can barely match normal 357sig range ammo. 357sig SD loads can EXCEED 1400 fps... 150 fps hotter than the hottest 9mm.
This is the exact reason I'm considering a 357sig barrel for my P226, which came with the .40 barrel from the factory. I like what both rounds can do, and the 357sig comes with less recoil in my experience.
- Status