Concealed carry at work

[9rant]

So baisically i work for a power company who told me no guns. They said that it paints a bad image for the company if im seen with a firearm. As a utility worker i work in busy towns and all over bad neighborhoods. Knocking on maybe 50 doors a day. And most of the times they see a bucket truck pull in they instantly think im there to shut their power off and they go right for threatening. Anyways i want to carry, i live in the great state of maine where it is now legal to conseal carry. I also took all my classes and hold a permit. But where im lost and not sure of legalites is the fact that i dont work in a office or public building or anything. I work outside. The only company owned property im around is the commercial truck. Which even still i only spend maybe an hour a day in. I understand if they said no guns in there office building and posted it that i couldnt carry in that building, but does the same fall true for a company truck? So I have 2 questions

1: can they tell me i cant conseal carry in the company truck? And if so are there any alternatives to transport the firearm in that truck?

2: if i never have to get in a company truck, can they still tell me i cannot carry while im on company time?

Also take into consideration, I dont have job sights i work on, its just powerline right-of-ways, or telephone poles along the side of the road

 

[david58]

Most basically, if the boss says no carry on the job, and you do carry on the clock, he can fire you. So your decision has to be based upon your risk on the job out in the field, versus your desire to risk a change of employer.

 

[wicked251]

Im lucky, my company is very gun friendly. Several of us carry daily.

 

[Red Wind]

Maine is basically an "at will" state.. See these highlights:

At-Will Employment - Under Maine law, an at-will employee
may be terminated for any reason not specifically prohibited
by law. In most instances, you are an at-will employee unless
you are covered by a collective bargaining agreement or other
contract that limits termination. If you have questions about at-
will employment, contact your human resources department or
the Bureau of Labor Standards

Almost forgot. Welcome to THR, 9rant!

 

[hawkeye216]

What does your employee manual state?

 

[bikemutt]

Unless the employer has metal detectors how would they know you are carrying concealed?The less said about the matter the better, loose lips sink ships etc. Now, if it's discovered by accident then another job may be in your future. That's the risk, only you can decide if it's worth it.

 

[Frank Ettin]

....how would they know you are carrying concealed?...

Notwithstanding that, if they do find the OP carrying a gun on company time, he can be fired. It's also possible that it could be treated as a "for cause" termination of employment possibly affecting his right to unemployment and potentially an issue when he looks for another job.

There are all kinds of ways someone could find out one is carrying a gun concealed.

 

[buckhorn_cortez]

Notwithstanding that, if they do find the OP carrying a gun on company time, he can be fired. It's also possible that it could be treated as a "for cause" termination of employment possibly affecting his right to unemployment and potentially an issue when he looks for another job.

Yes, all of that is totally factual. However, one has to consider the circumstances and make up their own mind as to which is worse - being fired, being severely injured, or in the worse case - being dead.

I had to make that exact choice after an attempted assault in a parking lot. After filing a police report and talking with the ineffectual building security manager - I took the advice of the police officer who took the report.

She said, "If you keep your gun concealed, how would they know you have one?"

So, I carried a gun to work and in the office in the side pocket of my soft-sided briefcase for the last three years I worked for the company.

There are all kinds of ways someone could find out one is carrying a gun concealed.

Frank - you're better than that specious comment. If you know how they can find out - say it - don't allude to some mysterious method of them finding out.

In reality, the only way they can find out is if you tell someone and / or don't keep it concealed. Or, in my case, if they demanded to search my private property (briefcase) which I would not allow them to do if they had asked.

Part of being a smart employee is knowing the work environment.

In my case, I knew they would never ask to search my briefcase because the company never did things like that - especially with a senior engineer with 17 years seniority.

I carried every day for three years. No one knew I had a gun in my briefcase as I never told anyone, and you couldn't tell there was one in my bag from looking at it.

It can be done, if you're very careful.

 

[Frank Ettin]

...If you know how they can find out - say it - don't allude to some mysterious method of them finding out....

For just a few examples -- bumping into someone, one's cover garment gets displaced in some way (e. g., it get caught on a obstacle, or blown by the wind, or one falls down), one gets injured on the job and needs medical attention (perhaps he's even unconscious), one has some other medical emergency (e. g., fainting or a heart attack), one says the wrong thing to the wrong person (or is overheard by the wrong person), etc. All sorts of other things could happen. The point is that one can't always count on things working out they way they'd like.

 

[buckhorn_cortez]

The point is that one can't always count on things working out they way they'd like.

My...that almost qualifies for the "keen sense of the obvious" award. That statement is true for everything you do in life - gun related or not.

In fact, I never count on anything working out the way I'd like - that includes things as simple as the level of browning on a piece of toast...

Again, in my case, and on purpose to avoid the things you've postulated - I carried the gun in the back compartment of my briefcase.

Even if you picked up the briefcase you would never know there was a gun in it unless you opened the back compartment and moved the Rand McNally Road Atlas out of the way.

While tactically, that was not the best situation, I could easily zip open the back compartment and keep my hand on the gun in the compartment, and pull it as rapidly as I can pull a gun from a concealed holster.

The only time I had to made alternate arrangements with the gun was when I went to one of the two National Laboratories I worked with as they had very strict rules on guns, and, most importantly - metal detectors at specific entrances I had to use.

I had a way of dealing with that, which I won't get into on a public forum.

 

[Frank Ettin]

...in my case, and on purpose to avoid the things you've postulated...

Everyone has his own set of rationalizations about why he has the particular uncertainty beat. That still leaves other uncertainties -- e. g., someone picking up your briefcase by mistake, realizing it and looking for identification (another reason off-body carry can be a bad idea).

In the OP's case, because of his line of work an an injury on the job or a hazardous material spell requiring the discarding of contaminated clothing would be within the realm of possibility.

 

[heyjoe]

The OP's job is a dangerous job with much more risk of serious injuries from falls, burns etc. than an office job. His risk of his concealed carry of a firearm being discovered in the event of incapacitation or loss of consciousness
is thus much greater.

 

[9rant]

Thank you all for the input. I havent carried at work but me and other workers always try pushing for it to be allowed. And i always just wondered since i strictly work outside. And not in the companys actuall owned property, how they could tell me no. So think you Red wind for shetting light on the at-will comment, i dont carry a bag/ briefcase. Just show up to work with my pants shirt and boots, and without a doubt someone someday would catch a glimpse as my job requires constant lifting and reaching, and bending over to pick things up. Maybe find a back pocket holster and lc9 for conceal carry rather then the alien gear and sig p938. Lol

 

[Red Wind]

You are welcome, 9rant. Stay safe.

 

[RetiredUSNChief]

Hmmm...

First thing's first: Will you be breaking a law by carrying? If so, then carrying on the job is out the door as an option.

Second: Company policy is company policy. Don't follow it and you automatically create terms for termination if caught, even if there isn't a specific law in your jurisdiction which says it's a crime.

Third: Maybe this should be first...you gave an example where people make assumptions and "they go right for threatening". If this happens, then you should "go away".

You're not being paid for that.

Granted, someone COULD actually attempt to use deadly force against you, but that's not what you said. First rule of personal safety is situational awareness...and when things start going South, your next action is to figure out how to avoid an encounter, if possible.


Yeah, it's easy to armchair quarterback this. But honestly, we each have to utilize effective operational risk management every day of our lives...and on the job is no different.

If it's not illegal, and you carry, then realize that you accept full responsibility for any administrative actions and other consequences that may involve with respect to your job.

 

[Shaq]

Thank you all for the input. I havent carried at work but me and other workers always try pushing for it to be allowed. And i always just wondered since i strictly work outside. And not in the companys actuall owned property, how they could tell me no. So think you Red wind for shetting light on the at-will comment, i dont carry a bag/ briefcase. Just show up to work with my pants shirt and boots, and without a doubt someone someday would catch a glimpse as my job requires constant lifting and reaching, and bending over to pick things up. Maybe find a back pocket holster and lc9 for conceal carry rather then the alien gear and sig p938. Lol

"someday would catch a glimpse as my job requires constant lifting and reaching, and bending over to pick things up."
That's exactly what I was thinking when I read your OP.

You might get away with it in an office environment, but even there, as pointed out, it would be risky.

 

[sdlsaginaw]

If your Kel Tec P32 in its FIST K5 ultrathin Kydex pocket holster is printing then you should stop wearing leotards....

 

[Frank Ettin]

...not in the companys actuall owned property, how they could tell me no....

Because you're an employee, and an employer has very broad authority to tell an employee how to conduct himself and what to do when on the job -- even when the job takes the employee away from the company's property.

 

[pintler]

Just FWIW: if I was on the job and felt even a little bit threatened, I'd just leave, and tell my employer it didn't seem safe. Let the employer deal with it from there (involve the police, whatever).

Is body armor legal in Maine? If so, you might consider that, to minimize the chance of a bad outcome while rapidly egressing.

You wouldn't deal with a live high voltage line w/o the proper training, equipment, and backup. Why should you treat a potentially violent situation any differently?

 

[njl]

In an "at will" employment state, they can fire you for any non-discriminatory reason, like violating company rules/policy.

 

[Derry 1946]

This issue comes up time and again, along with other classics such as "what gun should I buy for my girlfriend/wife/daughter," "why doesn't 'shall not infringe' end all discussion," "how can I ship guns out of state (USPS, FedEx, UPS, Pony Express)," and the ever-popular "when can I shoot someone." I'm constantly amazed at Frank's patience in explaining the law again and again. Stickies?!? Maybe we should pool our shekels and hire someone to create a compendium of FAQs. Other hits include: carrying on federal property, army bases, national forests, postal facilities, college campuses, bars and restaurants, sports stadiums, airports, the car, the parking lot, the private employer's property, the brother-in-law's barbecue ...

 

[Shaq]

This issue comes up time and again, along with other classics such as "what gun should I buy for my girlfriend/wife/daughter," "why doesn't 'shall not infringe' end all discussion," "how can I ship guns out of state (USPS, FedEx, UPS, Pony Express)," and the ever-popular "when can I shoot someone." I'm constantly amazed at Frank's patience in explaining the law again and again. Stickies?!? Maybe we should pool our shekels and hire someone to create a compendium of FAQs. Other hits include: carrying on federal property, army bases, national forests, postal facilities, college campuses, bars and restaurants, sports stadiums, airports, the car, the parking lot, the private employer's property, the brother-in-law's barbecue ...

What about carrying on chicken ranches?

 

[Derry 1946]

Another classic.

 

[27hand]

company carry

"Things not working out as planned".

Before I retired, I worked for a company about 12 years. They implemented a "no gun" policy during this time.

I decided for myself that, if discovered and fired (or laid off), the risk was worth it for me.

I worked construction and ankle carried as this was the most concealable alternative for me.

I was flat out asked by my immediate supervisor once if I was, as he put it, "hot" when he and i went to look at a job in an area I didn't really want to be, (nor did he).

I answered that I was and he said "good". I knew he was a gun guy from before he was promoted to that position.

Anyway, the things not working out as planned came to be a couple times. During random drug testing, they have you pull up your pant legs. I knew it was coming and was lucky to have a lock in my bag that enabled me to put my own lock on a gangbox I decided to hide my gun in. As all of us went at the same time, I doubted someone would get back much before me to try to remove that lock. I was able to place it where someone would have to be looking to find it. It worked out the couple times this occurred.

The one time it really came unexpected was my first day on a job. Instead of carrying onto the site, I left my gun in my car safe anticipating a new job drug test which happens a lot on larger projects.

I was there an hour and had a pipe fall and crush my dominant hand. Ambulance to ER.
Gave my keys to the same supervisor, let him know about the safe but knew he would bring my car to the hospital. At the ER, I was asked if I had any weapons on me and surrendered 2 knives I carry all the time.

So, life does come at you sideways unexpectedly sometimes.

That hand crush was step one to retirement as 3 doctors said I would never do my job again.

It is a matter of your own risk assessment and what you personally do to handle it.
Everyone has different levels of what they might do given the circumstances they have.

 

[Blackbeard]

The company certainly has the right to protect their image. They can tell you how to dress when you're not on company property. They can tell you not to have your tattoos showing. They can tell you not to wear your skull ring. They can tell you you must be clean shaven. They can certainly tell you not to carry a gun while you're representing the company in the field.

It's legal to have tattoos, wear skull rings or beards, and to carry a gun. But they can fire you for it.