I was asked the other day if it is possible to convert a Mossin-Nagant to a "modern" caliber such as 308 or something. I don't know enough about the subject to answer, so I turn here. Is it possible, and what all would have to be modified?
Convert Mossin Nagant?
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iamkris
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Heresy! BTW, don't tell the Russkies they're not shooting a modern caliber in some of their medium MG's.
To your question, I can imagine with money, you can do anything. Rebarrel / chamber shouldn't be that much problem, seems like the real expense would be for accomodating a rimless / rebated cartridge in a bolt / magazine created for a rimmed cartridge.
Rifle = $69
Gunsmithing = $500
WECSOG certificate = priceless
To your question, I can imagine with money, you can do anything. Rebarrel / chamber shouldn't be that much problem, seems like the real expense would be for accomodating a rimless / rebated cartridge in a bolt / magazine created for a rimmed cartridge.
Rifle = $69
Gunsmithing = $500
WECSOG certificate = priceless
Sylvilagus Aquaticus
Member
A long, long time ago in a store called Bannermans some rocket surgeon converted M-N's to 30-06. They tended to come apart in a loud, grotesque military fashion in no time at all.
They're just fine for my purposes in 7.62x54R...especially when I can buy them by the train car load for under $100. and ammo by the case lot at price per pound.
For what you'd spend on the conversion to a 'Western' cartridge you could buy several previously-owned, lightly used rifles of commercial manufacture. I don't mean to rain on your parade, but to save you grief I'll pass along that this wheel has already been invented and it turned out square.
Besides, it did just fine for the Russians for all this time just as it is.
Regards,
Rabbit.
They're just fine for my purposes in 7.62x54R...especially when I can buy them by the train car load for under $100. and ammo by the case lot at price per pound.
For what you'd spend on the conversion to a 'Western' cartridge you could buy several previously-owned, lightly used rifles of commercial manufacture. I don't mean to rain on your parade, but to save you grief I'll pass along that this wheel has already been invented and it turned out square.
Besides, it did just fine for the Russians for all this time just as it is.
Regards,
Rabbit.
DMK
Member
7.62x54R is probably the cheapest full power rifle cartridge you can buy.
Also, the bore on these is 3.11 instead of .308. I don't think a 30.06 or .308 conversion would work all that well.
Also, the bore on these is 3.11 instead of .308. I don't think a 30.06 or .308 conversion would work all that well.
Mike Irwin
Member
In two words, why bother?
You're MUCH better off getting a Mauser and converting it. You don't have the issue of the funky magazine for a rimmed cartridge or an action that is, on it's best day, clunky.
You're MUCH better off getting a Mauser and converting it. You don't have the issue of the funky magazine for a rimmed cartridge or an action that is, on it's best day, clunky.
I can see the appeal of a 308 Mosin Nagant.
But IMO, the Mosin-Nagant is sort of outdated for trying to modernize.
Don't get me wrong. I love mine. They are accurate, powerful and inexpensive to shoot.
I would trust my life to one any day.
But modern is one thing they ain't.
If ammo availability bothers you, stock up on components.
But IMO, the Mosin-Nagant is sort of outdated for trying to modernize.
Don't get me wrong. I love mine. They are accurate, powerful and inexpensive to shoot.
I would trust my life to one any day.
But modern is one thing they ain't.
If ammo availability bothers you, stock up on components.
Sunray
Member
"...They are accurate, powerful and inexpensive to shoot..." Rule number one. If it works don' t fix it.
carpettbaggerr
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Tell that to all the guys with the custom 1911's
DMK
Member
Oh, heck. You can't surf the web without tripping over the stuff.
(BTW, 7.62x54R and 7.63x54R is the same thing. The Finnish call it 7.63 and the Russians call it 7.62)
Here's a few to get you started:
www.dansammo.com
www.aimsurplus.com
www.jgsales.com
www.southernohiogun.com
www.ammunitionstore.com
www.outdoormarksman.com
NOTE: All surplus 7.62x54R has corrosive primers. Don't get all worked up about that though. It's super easy to clean up in a bolt action. After shooting, remove the bolt. Point the muzzle down and liberally squirt some Windex with ammonia down the bore and on the bolt face. That will disolve the corrosive salts and wash it out. After a few seconds, dry patch the bore and wipe off the bolt face. Now clean normally.
An alternative to Windex with ammonia is to mix a few capfulls of ammonia in a cup of hot water then mop the bore with that.
Cosmoline
Member
You have to respect the 7.62x54R. It's the oldest continuously used military cartridge in service today to my knowledge. It's an odd duck compared with modern cartridges, but it works. It's the classic Russian approach. They seem to take the same approach in other fields, as well. So while our multi-billion dollar Space Shuttle is grounded, their clunky little Soyuz capsules are running like clockwork.
You can get it in mass quantities for next to nothing, both in the form of surplus East Block stuff and good new production ammo from Wolf and other Russian companies. S&B makes excellent boxer-primed 7.62x54R and of course Norma makes a range of loads. It does very well with heavy 180 and 203 grain bullets, and it has a surprising powder capacity and short overall length. It can be cranked up to .30'06 power levels without much difficulty.
I noticed one other advantage the other day when I was loading up my Finn M-39 in ten below weather, shooting out some icy spruce snags. The "primitive" big rims make them much easeir to manipulate with gloves on.
You can get it in mass quantities for next to nothing, both in the form of surplus East Block stuff and good new production ammo from Wolf and other Russian companies. S&B makes excellent boxer-primed 7.62x54R and of course Norma makes a range of loads. It does very well with heavy 180 and 203 grain bullets, and it has a surprising powder capacity and short overall length. It can be cranked up to .30'06 power levels without much difficulty.
I noticed one other advantage the other day when I was loading up my Finn M-39 in ten below weather, shooting out some icy spruce snags. The "primitive" big rims make them much easeir to manipulate with gloves on.
In the WWI period, Remington and Westinghouse contracted with Russia to make Model 1891's in the U.S. Many thousands were not delivered due to the revolution in Russia; to fill a need (and to bail out the companies), the U.S. bought them and used them as training rifles in WWI. When they were sold on the market, several companies converted them to .30-'06, and the major ammo companies also made the 7.62 Russian cartridge. The father of a good friend used one in .30-'06 for deer hunting for years and usually got his deer.
There were many scare stories later, and assorted rumors, but I do not know of any conversions actually blowing up or coming apart. AFAIK, the barrels were set back and rechambered. As for the bore/groove diameter, it was generally believed that it was the same as .30-'06, but no one seemed to care much, since the rifles were all of $2.50 or something like that. I have not seen a conversion for years, and simply don't remember any details, but they seemed to work OK.
Jim
There were many scare stories later, and assorted rumors, but I do not know of any conversions actually blowing up or coming apart. AFAIK, the barrels were set back and rechambered. As for the bore/groove diameter, it was generally believed that it was the same as .30-'06, but no one seemed to care much, since the rifles were all of $2.50 or something like that. I have not seen a conversion for years, and simply don't remember any details, but they seemed to work OK.
Jim
Snowman92D
Member
The 7.62X54R round does a pretty good imitation of a .308 Winchester rounds as it is...not sure that a critter, two-legged or four-legged, could much tell the difference between it and a "modern" cartridge when it hits.
I keep a Mosin M91/30 in the trunk of my patrol car for euthanizing road-injured deer and livestock. Does a first-rate job and didn't cost much. Clunky-looking and the M-N action is clumsy by Mauser standards, but that's part of it's charm. Gets a lot of use and has yet to fail if I do my part.
I keep a Mosin M91/30 in the trunk of my patrol car for euthanizing road-injured deer and livestock. Does a first-rate job and didn't cost much. Clunky-looking and the M-N action is clumsy by Mauser standards, but that's part of it's charm. Gets a lot of use and has yet to fail if I do my part.
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