Cougar/Panther Comments

[Art Eatman]

"...since there are literally thousands of claimed/reported sightings nationwide..."

Ah, Flintknapper, little grasshopper, let us not have concern about the "everybody knows" problems of the great unwashed. Let us merely seek to clarify our own understanding. Enhance our erudition and knowledge!

 

[srkavanagh6621]

here is kind of a funny story about a mountain lion here in SD. http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2010/11/12/chad-strenges-jack-russel_n_782730.html

This guy lives about 3 miles from where I do all my hunting and its the second one shot in the last month. There was always rumors of people seeing these critters but no one ever actually got solid proof of one until this year. We have noticed in some of our river bottom type stuff that there was fresh giant paw tracks that looked like there are more around. I hope I dont stumble upon one when Im pheasant hunting this weekend!

P.S. the article doesnt tell the whole story that he personally told us. I guess after he shot it trying to protect his dog it fell from the tree and ran across the road. But the kicker of the story is the dog was latched on the side of the cat. so the owner of the dog ran across the road after the lion to confront it in the slough. I guess he hit it in the face with the shotgun initially so the lion couldnt see but came running at him a few times, and it took 5 shots to finally take the lion.

 

[KodiakBeer]

KB, to repeat, folks aren't saying that there are actually-black cougars all over the place.

Art, actually they are. The "black panther" has become a cryptid that rivals bigfoot for the number of sightings.

 

[jimmyraythomason]

Art, actually they are.

No,we are saying that people are seeing "big black cats" not cougars specifically. You are the one insisting on the cougar claims.

 

[KodiakBeer]

No,we are saying that people are seeing "big black cats" not cougars specifically. You are the one insisting on the cougar claims.

I don't think people are seeing any large black cat, cougar or otherwise. I think people have a predisposition to believe such animals exist and so when seeing something else (perhaps in poor light), they make a mistake.

Here's pictures of a red fox taken in my driveway. It's a black red fox and most people don't even know that red foxes can be black. So, seeing one partly obscured in low light at unknown distance... it would be easy enough to mistake it for something else.

So, whether people are seeing labrador retrievers or foxes or black bobcats or darkish cougars is hardly the point. The one thing they aren't seeing is black panthers.

 

[Flintknapper]

jimmyray wrote:

To avoid any further mistake/confusion, "Panther" is a term used genericallythroughout the Southland to describe any and all long tailed wild cats. The name panther is to distinquish between the long tails and other cats,i.e.,bobcat(aka wildcat) or ferals

I’m pretty current on Texas Colloquialisms (which would not include your example) but was unaware of the “panther” thing in your part of the country. Interesting.

Is it similar to saying…… “ I’m from L.A”. (to mean Lower Alabama).

 

[Flintknapper]

Art Eatman wrote:

Ah, Flintknapper, little grasshopper, let us not have concern about the "everybody knows" problems of the great unwashed. Let us merely seek to clarify our own understanding. Enhance our erudition and knowledge!

Forgive me Master if I have offended. I am not worthy. May the fleas of a thousand camels torment me the rest of my days!

 

[jimmyraythomason]

The one thing they aren't seeing is black panthers.

Well,no need to waste time on a made up mind. I have no idea how you can make such an emphatic statement but okay.

Colloquialisms

Flintknapper, come to my neck of the woods and order a "coke" you will be asked "what kind?" As for black phased animals,I have seen a black phase(silver)red fox,a black coyote and a black fox squirrel here. No I didn't mistake any of them for anything other than what they were.

 

[KodiakBeer]

Well,no need to waste time on a made up mind. I have no idea how you can make such an emphatic statement but okay.

Science, history and a lifetime of experience with the failings of human observation?

 

[jimmyraythomason]

Science, history and a lifetime of experience with the failings of human observation?

Neither science nor knowledge is advanced when the end result is pre-determined.

 

[KodiakBeer]

Neither science nor knowledge is advanced when the end result is pre-determined.

In 500 years of recorded history, nobody has dragged a dead black panther back to the homestead. After all, we aren't talking about the deepest reaches of the Amazon, but populated areas in the southern US. I'd be delighted to learn an unknown species or sub-species of hitherto unknown large black cat is inhabiting the US, but until a shred of evidence shows up I'm going to remain unconvinced.

 

[jimmyraythomason]

In 500 years of recorded history, nobody has dragged a dead black panther back to the homestead.

You have no way of knowing that. Our history is loaded with anecdotal evidence of black cats. If one was killed the hide was likely untanned and tacked to the barn wall where it rotted leaving no trace of it ever being there. The absence of evidence isn't proof of anything. It is also possible that what folks are now seeing is new to the scene not having been here before. We are covered up with armidillos. They have only been here for about 10 years. They are non-native to this area and were not artificially introduced.

 

[KodiakBeer]

Our history is loaded with anecdotal evidence of black cats.

Actually, it isn't. The "black panther" phenomena is a very recent thing. The old records, newspaper articles, journals, etc, only mention "panthers" (cougars) and it's only recently that these "panthers" have been thought of as black.

If you think I'm wrong, then use your google-fu to find old references to black panthers. You'll be disappointed... The people that lived in those times had plenty to say about panthers, but those panthers weren't black.

The references to black panthers begin in the 20th century, after the cougar was largely extirpated. People no longer had any first-hand knowledge and began to think panthers were black - again, blame Rudyard Kipling - if the family tradition was that G-G-Gramps killed a panther in the barn, and the only picture you have of a panther shows it to be black, then the oral tradition changes to G-G-Gramps killed a black panther in the barn.

 

[countertop]

Enough with the black panthers. What about pink panthers????

 

[countertop]

In other news, this is a telling interview.

WM: Many reports are of "black panthers". Is there really a black panther?

DR. SHROPSHIRE: To our knowledge, no black Florida panther has ever been confirmed in North America, either in the wild or in captivity. As stated above, the vast majority of panthers are light brown in color. The jaguar, a close relative of the panther which is found in Mexico and Central America, does have a black phase, as does the leopard which is found in Asia and Africa. The black panther is a myth, however, largely perpetuated by novelists, the movies and by those who confuse the jaguar or leopard with the panther.

A great source of information on cougars generally, and the effort to track their re population , is the Eastern Cougar Foundation . They have a good page on the history of cougars and man's relationship with them - including touching upon the origins of the Black Panther myth (which predates Kodiak Bears alleged 20th century rise by a few centuries)

Cougars (along with wolves) were the top predators throughout the forests of eastern North America. The European settlers that began arriving in the late 1500s were familiar with wolves but had no knowledge of cougars, because cougars live only in the New World. Nonetheless, cougars were quickly viewed with the ancient prejudice that Europeans had against all predators. At first, settlers thought cougars were African lions or leopards (the black phase of which is called panther). Only gradually, over a period of about a century, did Americans realize that the cougar was a distinct species. Cougar folklore combined European ideas about predators with Native American knowledge, inextricably mixing psychological fantasy with biological fact. Not until about the mid-twentieth century were scientific methods used to study cougars and determine their true nature.

 

[Art Eatman]

KB, apologies for not being clear: People here in this thread are not claiming that there are coal-black cougars running all over the countryside.

Enough. It's getting repetitive, as multi-page threads do.