Crimp - Am I doing it right?

[Dokbrick]

Greetings all,

I am brand new to the world of pistol caliber reloading, however I have loaded .223 in the past with great success. All the steps of loading my rounds were straightforward and familiar. However, the world of roll crimps is new to me and its rather, well, subjective! So I'd like some advice.

I am reloading .357 magnum rounds for a Smith and Wesson 586 with a 4" barrel.

This is my first load and it as follows(a mid-level load, no where near max):

Starline .357 magnum brass (all trimmed to the minium trim length for uniformity)
Winchester SPP
Unique 4.0 gr
Hornady 158gr LSWC (no crimp groove or cannelure)

After a great deal of reading, I was convinced to get a Redding Profile Crimp die. I used it for the first time last night. While, I feel I have a good crimp on rounds, I want a little advice to make sure I am doing it right. Ultimately, I know that if they hold up during the shooting process, than I have done it right (for the most part). Having no experience, its hard to say if I applied too much or too little crimp.

Here are some pictures of my crimps:
Click pictures for larger images.











So, any suggestions? Did I do it right? Too much? Too little? Obviously, with a cannelure it would be a bit easier, but that's coming up with my load of rounds. I know I will have to experiment a bit with this, but I just want an overall feel if I am on the right track.

 

[murf]

with no cannelure, the bullet may be deformed. do they fit in the cylinder chambers of your gun? that and no leading in the barrel will be the ultimate test.

murf

 

[rcmodel]

Your photo hosting site is throwing free prizes at me if I click O.K.

And my anti-virus software is lighting up like a Christmas tree!!

Beware folks!
I have already reported it.

rc

 

[Dokbrick]

with no cannelure, the bullet may be deformed. do they fit in the cylinder chambers of your gun? that and no leading in the barrel will be the ultimate test.

murf

I do not have the firearm yet, as California makes you wait 30 days between picking up handgun purchases. I will have it shortly however.

Your photo hosting site is throwing free prizes at me if I click O.K.

And my anti-virus software is lighting up like a Christmas tree!!

Beware folks!
I have already reported it.

rc

Sorry about that. I was unaware that hosting site was doing that. Thanks for the info. I have switched hosting sites. Shouldn't be an issue.

 

[rcmodel]

Might be a little more crimp then you need with 4.0 Unique.

That is a Very light load.

It may help with better low pressure powder burn you are going to get.
But it is too much crimp for best brass life with very light loads like that.

rc

 

[Dokbrick]

Might be a little more crimp then you need with 4.0 Unique.

That is a Very light load.

It may help with better low pressure powder burn you are going to get.
But it is too much crimp for best brass life with very light loads like that.

rc

Thanks so much for your input.

It seemed a bit aggressive when I applied it, but I was afraid initially that I might not have enough crimp (I'm learning).

Would you say the current crimp would be better for 158gr Hornady XTP round using a mid-range load of 12.5 to 13.0 grs of Alliant 2400?

 

[Jesse Heywood]

I agree on too much crimp. And will add that it is not necessary to trim handgun brass that isn't bottle-necked. Will save you some work next time.

 

[geosigma]

I agree it appears too much. My opinion, use a case gauge and if it slides in / out easily then your good. Never like to use any gun for testing rounds.

 

[joneb]

For a real magnum load I'd say that"s about right. But for a light load I would play with the crimp, little less and see how that works for you.

 

[forestswin]

I've shot at least a thousand of those bullets over 5 grains of Unique. That combination is the most accurate round out of my 686 - 6 inch at 25 yards.
I use this round to check out how I'm shooting on range days.



darn flier

I think you'll be very pleased shooting these out of a 586
I get an avg. Velocity of 850 fps
IMO the crimp is more than whats needed for this load.

I trim my cases to 1.280 and seat the shoulder flush with the top of the case. Your Redding Profile Crimp Die will apply a taper crimp on the case as you back it off.

What COL are you using? The bullet appears a little long out of the case for 1.59"

 

[Dokbrick]

Thank you gentlemen for your excellent comments. A very good learning experience. I'll dial back the crimp on my lead loads and retain the same-ish crimp for my heavier jacketed loads.

forestswin,

Nice shooting. I'll have to work up to 5.0grs and see how that performs! I am using the specified 1.59" COL, some are seated slightly lower at 1.588.

For these initial crimped rounds: other than shortening the case life a little bit, it shouldn't cause any issues, correct?

Thanks for your time everyone.

 

[Steve C]

Your crimp is a little excessive. I've never found any need to go beyond rolling the case mouth in till it engages the bullet without bending back to flatten to the side of the bullet by forcing the case mouth beyond the roll portion of the die. The picture below illustrates why you crimp is a little too much.

Look at factory rounds. They usually have a substantial crimp but no flattening below the case mouth. If you duplicate how the factories crimp you know you are doing it right.

 

[forestswin]

Dokbrick
Correct, it won't cause any other issues
The primer energy alone will expand the case and release the bullet.
For accuracy, you want uniform seating depth and uniform crimps and make sure you don't deform the bullet.

I really like the Redding profile crimp die, it lowered my ES and SD and tightened up my groups. You really made some good choices.

One other note though, I'd wait until you can drop and test your rounds in your cylinder before loading up more. It's just good practice.

 

[Dokbrick]

Dokbrick
Correct, it won't cause any other issues
The primer energy alone will expand the case and release the bullet.
For accuracy, you want uniform seating depth and uniform crimps and make sure you don't deform the bullet.

I really like the Redding profile crimp die, it lowered my ES and SD and tightened up my groups. You really made some good choices.

One other note though, I'd wait until you can drop and test your rounds in your cylinder before loading up more. It's just good practice.

Some very solid advice. I know that lead bullets can give you some off seating depths and that variation between bullets can lead to one being seated slightly deeper than another. Is there any real way to remedy this? I spent a lot time making sure my seater was adjusted correctly, yet, many of the seated bullets were either .002 long or .001-.002 short of the COL. I'm using the Lee Carbide die set (not using the factory crimp obviously.) I like the sizer and mouth flaring dies, but the seater doesnt seem all that great. Any recommendations would be greatly appreciated as it drives me a little bit nuts!

 

[murf]

now that my brain is off autopilot:

those are swaged bullets that should not be crimped, or crimped enough to remove the bell on the neck. the reason(s) your col varies are: the seating stem deforming the nose of the bullet due to the force required to seat/crimp into a non-existent cannelure, case buckling due to the same excessive seating force.

your col is correct and the load should shoot fine as soon as you fix the crimp. also, seating and crimping separately is better in this situation, imo.

luck,

murf

p.s. welcome to the high road!