Crooked case necks/shoulders?

[119er]

I'm doing a large batch of .223 and I decided to check concentricity and found the runout to be .008-.010". If I roll the loaded round on a pane of glass, the bullet wobbles and it is clear that the neck is out of line. Some of them even appear to be off at the shoulder.

Brass is once fired military and I resized with a Redding standard FL die on a LNL AP to fit minimum on a case gauge. Sizing was done as a separate operation. I have set up the same sizer die in my Forster Co-ax press and set the die to size the same; to the gauge. After resizing the brass again, it still has this runout! Loaded ammo slips into the gauge no problem and chambers in a rifle as well.

This is the first time this die has been used. I loaned my RCBS AR series die that I typically use for FL sizng .223. Is it possible the Redding die is machined improperly? I don't have another .223 die to try currently.

Could it be tolerances in the progressive torquing the case in a certain direction as it is forced into the die? The cases (esp. 223) on my LNL AP like to tilt inwards when between stations.

Any help is appreciated.

 

[119er]

Ok, I tried the die on the SS with LC and commercial RP and it sized normally without and wobble.

So, same die in the progressive = crooked cases?

Looks like I'll now be resizing .223 SS from now on too. I tried .308 ONE time before I ditched that but I guess .223 is going down the same road. Maybe out of spec shell plate or something.

Real question now is; why doesn't the same die fix the error on the crooked brass? Not able to size far enough w/o making head space too great?

This sucks.

 

[Rangemaster]

Check your sizing die.
If the decapping pin is off center just a bit, it will cause runout as it exits the neck of the brass.

 

[Walkalong]

I just grabbed a handful on my mixed brass 55 Gr FMJ plinking/blasting ammo I loaded on the LNL and I am gseeing .002 to .005, with most being about .003.

I do not take any precautions with this ammo, and don't remember checking concentrically on it before.

It is weird that it is straight on the SS and crooked on the LNL. Perhaps the plate is pulling the case out a bit crooked when the expander plug pulls through the neck. Do you lube the necks?

 

[119er]

I spray the cases with One Shot and resize them. I'm using a carbide expander ball.

The reason I decided to check concentricity was that I am using a new Forster Benchrest seater. When I got the large numbers, I could clearly see that it was originating at the the case. This ammo is for plinking/blasting but that amount of wobble seems excessive. It is as if the neck is off axis from the case body several degrees.

 

[gamestalker]

I've had a couple problems over the years with this because of a dirty shell holder. Did you clean your's and see if it makes a difference? I don't know much about the presses you load on, but if a shell holder doesn't allow the brass to completely align with the die due to a build up of crude, I would think it could create a problem like this with any type of press. It doesn't take much build up either. The first time I encountered this problem, and based on the apparent lack of crude, I honestly didn't expect to have discovered the cause as being a dirty shell holder. But it has made all the difference in my experience, so I now make sure my shell holders are cleaned prior to, or following each loading session. This holds true in all steps that utilize the shell holder too, not just resizing.

Just a thought.

GS

 

[Bailey Boat]

Progressives do not properly align with the dies until ALL stations are involved thus causing a certain amount of torque until that time. The first few of the run, as well as the last few could experience a degree of misalignment. This becomes apparent more so with longer rifle cases than with shorter pistol cases.

 

[ironworkerwill]

Are you crimping the bullets? If so you may be going to far on the LNL.

 

[119er]

I clean the shell plate and entire press before I start. I do end up with some corncob on the press from the case feeder, but I keep it dusted off with the keyboard cleaner most of the time. I probably got lazy and didn't check. I was only resizing after all!

Does anyone see a problem firing this ammo as is? I can't get them straight without too much headspace.

Will this misalignment wear the throat of my barrels unevenly?

I have a DPMS I've been wanting to rebarrel. Maybe I'll use them to help that barrel leave this world.

 

[gamestalker]

As long as they chamber, I wouldn't worry about them harming your barrel, they'll reform after being fired through it.

GS

 

[bluetopper]

Yes, they will fireform back straight.

 

[119er]

Thanks, everyone. My grandfather, a machinist for many years after WWII, told me when I was a little boy; "You can have quality or you can have quantity, but never both at the same time." It certainly rings true today, at least at this level of investment. I tend to learn my lessons in big ways!

 

[Walkalong]

Did you check the brass before sizing? Dies tend not to straighten out crooked brass.