Decided to start Annealing - Here's my setup

I’m not chucking at all, I used the same set up once.
Here’s a tip, not advice…
Take ten cases that you have history with to aneal and test the results by chronograph numbers, and target improvements or declines against the other cases from the same batch. Then you will have a bit of data to draw from moving forward.
Annealing softens brass and makes sizing to light neck tension a bit more consistent, if your rifle likes that then you’ll likely see improvements however if your rifle prefers increased or strong neck tension you may see declines in accuracy.
Testing is the key.
Please report back with your findings.
 
1KPerDay said:
For the ignorant among us, is there a way to visually tell when the brass has reached the proper temperature? During the process?
Click to expand...
Youll see the case mouth and shoulder just start to flash orange. Thats when you know it good.
I do set my torches to heat at the shoulder/neck junction as the neck is thinner and always heats up quicker.
Its the same results you get with 750 degree Tempilaq which is where I started. Once I seen the results vs that, I can pretty easily dial in my annealer just by eye with the lights off.
 
I've used my propane torch for decades. But I use a 3/16" SS rod in my battery drill to spin cases. Just drop the case over the rod, and squeeze the trigger on the drill lightly to slowly turn it in the flame. I keep a 5 gallon bucket of water at my feet and just point the drill towards it and cases fall into the water after annealing. Repeat until done.
I never let my cases turn color! If they turn color they're likely too soft. A couple turns in the flame is all it take to slightly soften them.
 
Do you guys direct the pencil tip flame towards the top, middle or bottom of the shoulders?
 
mm93 said:
I've used my propane torch for decades. But I use a 3/16" SS rod in my battery drill to spin cases. Just drop the case over the rod, and squeeze the trigger on the drill lightly to slowly turn it in the flame. I keep a 5 gallon bucket of water at my feet and just point the drill towards it and cases fall into the water after annealing. Repeat until done.
I never let my cases turn color! If they turn color they're likely too soft. A couple turns in the flame is all it take to slightly soften them.
Click to expand...
Doesn't dropping them into water quench/harden them? I thought the point was to get the brass malleable/soft again.
 
If I aim the tip of the blue cone so that it just touches the neck of the cartridge, I can heat it to the point where it glows a dull red in a darkened room (not totally dark) while holding the rim with my bare fingers. I have to drop the case very soon afterward because the heat starts to conduct from the mouth and neck to the web and rim, but I can get 9 to 11 seconds of flame on the neck before I drop it. I'm also spinning the case with my fingers. This is for 357 Magnum and 6.5 Grendel (PPC), so fairly short cases. Really, I don't want to heat the part of the case above the web where I'm pinching it with my fingers, so it works. But because I get my fingers stung enough doing a lot of cases, I will either wear a leather glove or use a small socket on a short 1/4" drive extension to hold the case.
 
1KPerDay said:
Doesn't dropping them into water quench/harden them? I thought the point was to get the brass malleable/soft again.
Click to expand...
No. Quenching does not harden brass like it would steel. It has no consequence. It's neither beneficial nor harmful. I don't do it because it would require me to dry the brass. In fact, I often start with semi-dry brass from the wet tumbler and annealing helps me dry it, so I wouldn't want to drop it back in water.

Often times, water sticks in the flash hole. So I'll pick up a case, hold the neck to the flame for about 9 seconds while spinning it. I'll drop it into a stainless steel bowl and about a second later the heat will conduct into the web and around the flash hole and I'll hear a hissing sound and a puff of steam will erupt out of the case.
 
1KPerDay said:
For the ignorant among us, is there a way to visually tell when the brass has reached the proper temperature? During the process?
Click to expand...

I use a machine that has an adjustable dwell time (the case stays in the flames) and set it fast to begin with and slow it down, until the (propane) flame turns from blue to orange and speed it up just enough so it indexes before the flame changes colors.

No glowing of the case, any shade.
 
jmorris said:
I use a machine that has an adjustable dwell time (the case stays in the flames) and set it fast to begin with and slow it down, until the (propane) flame turns from blue to orange and speed it up just enough so it indexes before the flame changes colors.

No glowing of the case, any shade.
Click to expand...

The telltale color change of the flame is another good method and Ive always found that to happen just as the neck starts to glow.

Brass is fairly forgiving so the important take away here is there is a wide range of methods to do this and none of them short of not getting enough temp to actually anneal or so much that you start to melt cases.
 
CoalCrackerAl said:
I use a torch too. And a drill with a socket. 13 seconds seams to be the sweet spot in the flame .
Click to expand...
This guy has his machine set to about 4 seconds in the flame (tip of the pencil flame on .223 brass) from what I can see... 13 seconds sounds like a lot, but I've never done this process before.

youtu.be

Flame control when annealing brass

*****new updated video on flame control available soon!Flame control when annealing with Burstfire 2 in 1 Case Annealer & Case Prep CenterFlame control Minim...
youtu.be youtu.be
 
1KPerDay said:
This guy has his machine set to about 4 seconds in the flame (tip of the pencil flame on .223 brass) from what I can see... 13 seconds sounds like a lot, but I've never done this process before.

youtu.be

Flame control when annealing brass

*****new updated video on flame control available soon!Flame control when annealing with Burstfire 2 in 1 Case Annealer & Case Prep CenterFlame control Minim...
youtu.be youtu.be
Click to expand...

I think his timing is about perfect. You can see the color shift in the flame, and he is dropping the brass out just as that happens.
I heat my cases a bit more, so in comparison maybe another 1/2 second in the flame would be what I personally do.
I prefer to stay a little lower on the shoulder as I want the shoulder annealed as well.
Like I said, brass is pretty forgiving. The important part is to make sure the heat isnt getting into the web of the case.
 
1KPerDay said:
Some more fuel to the fire, so to speak
youtu.be

I over annealed brass and then F/L sized it. UNEXPECTED RESULTS!!!

Visit my website: https://erikcortina.com/Support me on Patreon! https://www.patreon.com/ErikCortinaGet my shirts here:https://erikcortina.com/merch
youtu.be youtu.be
Click to expand...
Erik does a good job laying out why brass is pretty forgiving and is why I dont get too wrapped around the axle on things being perfect.
Try as we might, we are spinning a piece of metal in an open flame, and trying to be as consistent as possible.
If you want perfect consistency? You need to sort by headstamp, and use an AMP annealer.
 
jmorris said:
I use a machine that has an adjustable dwell time (the case stays in the flames) and set it fast to begin with and slow it down, until the (propane) flame turns from blue to orange and speed it up just enough so it indexes before the flame changes colors.

No glowing of the case, any shade.
Click to expand...
I was one of those curious kids that experimented. I had a shop at home and did stuff. I can't claim that I accomplished a lot in the way of producing anything, but I tried burning stuff. Thankfully, I never destroyed accidentally destroyed anything valuable. More recently, I was helping a high school kid with stoichiometry for his Chemistry class. I made some zinc chips by machining a penny. Cartridge brass is about 70% copper and 30% zinc, but a penny is mostly zinc with a little copper plating. We weighed a big 3.0 grain zinc chip and then oxidized it with the torch. When the zinc combusted, it shot off a big green flame. It gained some mass so that it weighed about 3.7 grains. Mine is the only chem lab equipped with a Redding No. 2 balance for weighing stuff. Of course, we had to do it a few times because those green flames were pretty cool. From the mass gained by the chips, we determined that the empirical formula for Zinc Oxide is ZnO.

The 3.0 grain zinc chip was 0.194 grams times 1 mole/65.38g (from the periodic table for Zn) equals 0.003 moles of zinc. We ended up with 3.7 grains or 0.242 grams of stuff after burning it, so we supposed that starting with 0.194 grams, the additional 0.048 grams was oxygen. 0.048 g times 1 mole/16.00g (from the periodic table for O) equals 0.003 moles of oxygen. Since we had an equal number of moles of Zn and O, we came to the conclusion that zinc oxide is ZnO. Had we twice as many moles of oxygen as we had zinc, we'd have concluded that it was ZnO2.

Now I suppose it would take quite a lot of dwell time before I saw the green flames of zinc in my cartridge brass oxidizing in the flame of my annealing torch, but whenever I sit down to watch the flame change, even to orange, I'll think about that.
 
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