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Defence with antique firearms

Discussion in 'General Gun Discussions' started by monotonous_iterancy, Feb 7, 2013.

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  1. monotonous_iterancy

    monotonous_iterancy Member

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    I remember skimming through a book in a store once, I don't remember what it was about, or what the title was.

    The book recommended that people who lived in areas with strict gun control get an antique weapon to defend themselves with. The book specifically mentioned a break-action .44 Russian.

    How feasible is this? Are there loopholes in places like NYC that would allow that? I'd imagine that if someone had to ever actually use it to defend themselves, they'd be charged. That's assuming you could find an antique that was safe to fire.

    Also, on a similar note, have any of you ever carried or used an antique or a reproduction as a defensive weapon?
     
  2. Equestrian

    Equestrian Member

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    What about a modern manufacture black powder revolver, fairly reliable and in NC technically not a gun?
     
  3. Steel Horse Rider

    Steel Horse Rider Member

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    I have several antique black powder weapons I would prefer to not be shot with. They may have moved at lower velocities but they made up for that with bulk....
     
  4. monotonous_iterancy

    monotonous_iterancy Member

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    It's close. Is there a story go along with this?
     
  5. Fryerpower

    Fryerpower Member

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    Take a look at the Curio & Relic list...There are some VERY good firearms on that list. I even heard some talk on this site about how the C&R designation might exempt such wonderful CCW weapons as the CZ-82. I believe the C&R designation exempts them from the 7 round limit!

    Here is a list of C&Rs for sale at one companies website:

    http://www.classicfirearms.com/c-r-eligible

    Jim
     
  6. silicosys4

    silicosys4 Member

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  7. goon

    goon Member

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    A Ruger Old Army would also work as a suitable HD weapon. But no one should have to ever use one for that, and against a couple attackers armed with Glocks, you are outgunned. There is no getting around that.
    IDK if conversion cylinders are available for them, but with others that can take standard pressure .45 Colt in a conversion cylinder, that at least opens up the ability to get a decent JHP defensive round to minimize over penetration. Best plan on having two of them around though... because you're not going to have time to reload.

    And against those two guys armed with Glocks... how about a Broomhandle Mauser with a shoulder stock?
     
  8. Solo

    Solo Member

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    I wouldn't mind having a Tokarev around for self-defense.
     
  9. monotonous_iterancy

    monotonous_iterancy Member

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    I will add that .44 Russian is a metallic cartridge, although the gun that fires it is from the late 1800s.
     
  10. Pat C.

    Pat C. Member

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    1858 Army Remington Rep. Loaded with 4# shoot . Only problem is the smoke!!
     
  11. Tommygunn

    Tommygunn Member

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    BE VERY CAREFUL!
    Antique guns may be technically "not guns" in accord to federal law but if you are carrying them or using them for self defense then your local police dept. and other law enforcement officials (such as district attorneys) will not treat them that way. They will consider them to be loaded guns, just like a modern Glock 19 or Sig.
    This is a legal matter and I suggest asking a qualified attorney if you don't understand how this could be.
    I'm not that nor have I played Hamilton Burger in any TV series.
     
  12. splattergun

    splattergun Member

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    Technically, yes, as long as the antique or reproduction gun fires safely it is capable of stopping a bad guy.

    Legally, please check with a legal professional before proceeding.
     
  13. Manco

    Manco Member

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    As long as they're fully functional, they'll do the same job they had always done. Maybe that's a bit too obvious a statement? :)
     
  14. PRM

    PRM Member

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    The Uberti New Army 1858 is one of my favorite C&B pistols - but what the heck is 4# shoot???
     
  15. ball3006

    ball3006 Member

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    Early pre 1898 Mosin Nagant M91 rifles come to mind.....1891 Argentine Mausers too....chris3
     
  16. MattShlock

    MattShlock Member

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    Ignore that.

    Plenty of useable antiques. Sold my BIL and sis in NY City a refinished Trapdoor Springfield he wanted at family prices, lent him five .45-70's in a glass display case with a sign that said "in case of emergency break glass" I didn't get back even when I gave them a box of 25 #4 shot .410's. That'll have to be good enough for them in their fully attached house...
     
  17. Kaeto

    Kaeto Member

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    In NY you may own a black powder handgun, but if you have the means to shoot it it must be registered.
     
  18. ApacheCoTodd

    ApacheCoTodd Member

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    I figure nearly all the antiques of quality were at one time state of the art and as such should be equally effective today.

    Note though that I'm not one who believes that multi reload engagements with armored up opponents is the norm or even likely.
     
  19. Hardtarget

    Hardtarget Member

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    I actually knew a man that could not leagally own a firearm. So, he bought a black powder revolver for home defense. Then one day he got into an argument with his brother in law...and shot him. He will be in prison for a while.

    Mark
     
  20. PRM

    PRM Member

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    I was into single action guns before the current SASS interest. The one gun that I have always regretted selling was a New Model #3 S&W in 44 Russian. This was truly one of the most accurate and fun guns to shoot I ever owned.

    Currently, I have a Colt 2nd Generation SAA in .45LC that I sent back to the custom shop and had a .45 ACP cylinder fitted to it. Makes a nice combo and the .45 ACP cylinder has more than paid for itself in ammo cost. I also have a custom built Colt Bisley with pre-ban elephant ivory grips in .44 Special that fits the bill for most any shooting need. I would not feel outgunned in the least with either of these. When concealment is more of a concern, I do carry a Perfected Model S&W in .38 S&W.

    C&B guns are great fun. When I'm out around the farm, I occasionally have one of them with me. Although slow to reload, this type of weapon has been doing the job for well over 150 years. My pocket models have also been stocked with pre-ban ivory.
     

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  21. Roadking Rider

    Roadking Rider Member

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    I protect my home with a CZ82 quite often. It really is a great pistol and Hornaday makes some very nice HP's for it. If I need to reach out and touch someone at a greater distance I always have my old M1 Garand or Mosin Nagant or Yugo SKS. :D
     
    Last edited: Feb 8, 2013
  22. MedWheeler

    MedWheeler Member

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    Okay, but what's being asked here is about the possession of the "antique" gun where/when others are prohibited. Is he in prison for the gun, its unlawful use, or both? In other words, would he still be in prison if he had shot his brother-in-law under the same exact circumstances, but while using a legally-possessed modern firearm?
     
  23. brickeyee

    brickeyee Member

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    Many states have no 'antique' exception, and most will be glad to consider even a BP revolver or single shot a 'deadly weapon' whose possession is also verboten.

    Trying to slice out an exception to a state law can get very dicey.

    Statute law is NOT the only law.
    You will have to check case (common) law.

    Do you think you want to stand in front of a judge in an anti-gun state and try to explain that your BP revolver is not a gun?
     
  24. silicosys4

    silicosys4 Member

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    Also,
    You can legally purchase with no FFL paperwork, a replica blackpowder pistol.
    You can then legally purchase with no FFL paperwork, a new conversion cylinder to put in it, that will allow your pistol to take .38s&w, .38 spcl, or .45 colt metallic cartridges.
    You now have a cartridge firing revolver, with no FFL paperwork.
    Its pretty much just as difficult to reload as the blackpowder version, as some conversions don't have a loading gate and the cylinder must be taken out of the gun to be reloaded.
    Some do have a loading gate though. I believe the colt navy replica conversion cylinders can be had with a loading gate for .38S&W.

    Although, there is no great loophole there, since you can get many antique firearms that do not require FFL paperwork, that will take metallic cartridges still available today.
     
  25. gamestalker

    gamestalker member

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    I knew a guy that was on federal parole for bank robbery, and he was legal to own and operate his C&B wheel gun, so he said. I've been curious about this particular for some time now concerning convicted felons in Arizona.

    GS
     
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