Defense Against Home Invasion--And More

[shafter]

They shot at an angle away from the other door, toward a concrete wall. I can't imagine a better backstop short of a berm. Even if it's block, handgun bullets aren't generally going to go through it, and if they do, have probably lost enough velocity to leave a bruise. I didn't see anything in the video showing they did.

What do people in wood houses do? Even if you shoot at someone inside your home, there isn't anything stopping that bullet from going through a layer of OSB board and vinyl and traveling across town.

And besides this- if you're in an apartment, and the neighbor across the hall has someone trying to kick in a door with a gun in his hand (much less at some point firing 2-3 rounds into the apartment!) are you going to stand at the door looking out the peephole? Just going to sit on the other side of the door on your couch and turn the TV up over the noise? Probably going to be doing anything you can to get away from the door and calling 911.

An innocent person outside getting hit? You see someone up the stairwell kicking in a door with a gun in his hand, and you're just going to say excuse me, and step past him on the way to the third floor?

If I see someone up a stairwell with a gun and kicking in a door I would at least have a target to aim at and a visual on weapons, demeanor, etc.

I just can't see justification for firing when the homeowner did. There was no way to know if the assailants were armed, the door hadn't been broken or even partially broken yet which means it would be hard to sell immanency of the potential threat. Who's to say they didn't give up on the last kick and turn to walk away just as the homeowner opened fire?

There was also no way of knowing if any other residents heard the voices and the pounding and had come out into the hall to investigate and put themselves in the line of fire. Knowing that the walls were concrete would make me feel a little better but not knowing exactly where the threats were and who else may have been in the vicinity while firing blindly is not good. The homeowner would not have placed himself at any serious disadvantage by waiting until the door was breached.

I live by the principles of target identification and knowing what's in front of and behind my target. If I see my target I can assess for weapons and intent and line up my sights. Blind fire, even returning fire blindly, is almost never a good idea.

 

[wayneinFL]

If I see someone up a stairwell with a gun and kicking in a door I would at least have a target to aim at and a visual on weapons, demeanor, etc.

I just can't see justification for firing when the homeowner did. There was no way to know if the assailants were armed, the door hadn't been broken or even partially broken yet which means it would be hard to sell immanency of the potential threat. Who's to say they didn't give up on the last kick and turn to walk away just as the homeowner opened fire?

There was also no way of knowing if any other residents heard the voices and the pounding and had come out into the hall to investigate and put themselves in the line of fire. Knowing that the walls were concrete would make me feel a little better but not knowing exactly where the threats were and who else may have been in the vicinity while firing blindly is not good. The homeowner would not have placed himself at any serious disadvantage by waiting until the door was breached.

I live by the principles of target identification and knowing what's in front of and behind my target. If I see my target I can assess for weapons and intent and line up my sights. Blind fire, even returning fire blindly, is almost never a good idea.

No way to know if they were armed?

There was a camera that showed the home invader pointing a gun at the door, before the occupant fired. The police who responded saw shell cases on the floor outside the door, from the intruder firing into the apartment.

They don't have to knock down the door or enter the apartment to shoot the occupant. If it's not already obvious from the video, bullets go through doors.

I can't guarantee that the occupant was still watching the video in his Ring app when he shot through the door. I can't tell for sure whether the first shot was from the home invader or occupant.

If he saw the gun pointed at him in the camera, and he and his brother don't have anywhere to retreat behind cover, this is absolutely 100% justified. If he fired after hearing the shots coming through the door into apartment, this is absolutely justified.

If you know for sure he didn't see the gun or hear shots, it's still likely justified, with as long as they were beating on the door, and how hard they were beating it.

 

[Kleanbore]

If you know for sure he didn't see the gun or hear shots, it's still likely justified, with as long as they were beating on the door, and how hard they were beating it.

In terms of the provision of defense of habitation laws, that depends on the jurisdiction.

 

[shafter]

No way to know if they were armed?

There was a camera that showed the home invader pointing a gun at the door, before the occupant fired. The police who responded saw shell cases on the floor outside the door, from the intruder firing into the apartment.

They don't have to knock down the door or enter the apartment to shoot the occupant. If it's not already obvious from the video, bullets go through doors.

I can't guarantee that the occupant was still watching the video in his Ring app when he shot through the door. I can't tell for sure whether the first shot was from the home invader or occupant.

If he saw the gun pointed at him in the camera, and he and his brother don't have anywhere to retreat behind cover, this is absolutely 100% justified. If he fired after hearing the shots coming through the door into apartment, this is absolutely justified.

If you know for sure he didn't see the gun or hear shots, it's still likely justified, with as long as they were beating on the door, and how hard they were beating it.

Camera footage doesn't aways mean that someone is watching it at that moment. If he was watching the shooter in the camera at that moment and knew there were no innocent bystanders out there then that makes it alot more reasonable.

I'm still not shooting through walls or doors in that type of situation until shots are fired though. I'll take my chances.