ZeroJunk
Member
I asked my long time outfitter years ago if you could shoot off of the horse I was riding. He replied in a quite dead pan voice, "Sure you can, Once".
Do any of you use horses as part of your hunting transportation?
- Thread starter Sheepdog1968
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I asked my long time outfitter years ago if you could shoot off of the horse I was riding. He replied in a quite dead pan voice, "Sure you can, Once".
35 Whelen
Member
A few years ago my Dad had a riding mule for sale and was showing her to a potential customer. The would-be buyer asked " Can you shoot off of her?", Dad replied, "Yeah...but I wouldn't shoot while I was on her...."
35W
grubbylabs
Member
My brother in law did that too my wife's horse on a late cow hunt. He had the horse running and chasing elk and somewhat distracted, when he fired the two or three shots before the horse even know what happened. The horse was the type of horse that if you did something new like it was an every day event, then she was fine with it. If you made a big thing about it she was going to make sure that's what you really wanted to do.
Art Eatman
Moderator In Memoriam
Not knowing any other way, I began training by shooting a .22 rifle to the rear. Sorta worked on up with the noise level. But, he always was a pretty laid-back horse from the git-go. I got the idea because he'd wander up and stand right close to me when I was shooting .45 auto, messing and plinking. The only thing that sorta bothered him was the ejected empties occasionally hitting his face. So, one thing led to another.
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Horses have been a huge part of my hunting success over the years. Quite simply they will get you to places that you aren't going to be able get to on foot and be able to get your game out.
I am also a mounted patrol/search and rescue member locally and use horses year round for back country SAR and patrol work. Of the thousands of folks who ride in the back country the injury ratio is really pretty low. Most of the injuries that we attend to and have had even on our own team have been either a combination of inexperienced horsemen or horse or both. The other big issue we have in this area is rich inexperienced chicks/buying WAY more horse than she needs.
That sounds sexist I know but the majority of serious horse wrecks we get in the area are rich city girls living out their childhood horse fantasy. And invariably they buy some high powered warm blood champion jumping horse or one of the more fiery European breeds they have no business on, like an Alsatian or most recently a 65 year old beginner on a $85,000 Frisian Stallion, it cost her a broken arm and several cracked vertebrae.
That horse was so high and so hot I was barley able to lead him back to the trail head. The SOB tried to kill me twice on lead.I was sorely tempted to turn him into 1,200 LBS of coyote bait.
Obviously you are taking a risk anytime you get on a horse. But I've got to tell you that the better you know your animal and the more you expose him to and the more you work with him the safer you are going to be. I always hear about these "experienced" riders getting hurt on a horse and it happens. But just because a guy has been riding for 20 years doesn't mean they actually know jack about horsemanship.
I thought I was pretty savvy until I took a confident horsemanship clinic with some local mounted LEO's. Talk about exposing your horse and yourself to outside and unusual situations and stimulus!
I am also a mounted patrol/search and rescue member locally and use horses year round for back country SAR and patrol work. Of the thousands of folks who ride in the back country the injury ratio is really pretty low. Most of the injuries that we attend to and have had even on our own team have been either a combination of inexperienced horsemen or horse or both. The other big issue we have in this area is rich inexperienced chicks/buying WAY more horse than she needs.
That sounds sexist I know but the majority of serious horse wrecks we get in the area are rich city girls living out their childhood horse fantasy. And invariably they buy some high powered warm blood champion jumping horse or one of the more fiery European breeds they have no business on, like an Alsatian or most recently a 65 year old beginner on a $85,000 Frisian Stallion, it cost her a broken arm and several cracked vertebrae.
That horse was so high and so hot I was barley able to lead him back to the trail head. The SOB tried to kill me twice on lead.I was sorely tempted to turn him into 1,200 LBS of coyote bait.
Obviously you are taking a risk anytime you get on a horse. But I've got to tell you that the better you know your animal and the more you expose him to and the more you work with him the safer you are going to be. I always hear about these "experienced" riders getting hurt on a horse and it happens. But just because a guy has been riding for 20 years doesn't mean they actually know jack about horsemanship.
I thought I was pretty savvy until I took a confident horsemanship clinic with some local mounted LEO's. Talk about exposing your horse and yourself to outside and unusual situations and stimulus!
wyohome
Member
I agree with your assessment above. The 3 people killed that I referred to were killed on their own property. Two were horse trainers, one the mother of the Asay boys of the pro rodeo circuit. The other fatality was a 75 year old guy that rode every chance he got. The paralyzed guy was a horse trainer going on a pleasure ride. The horse stepped in a hole and rolled over on him, breaking his cervical spine.
watergun
Member
Horses
Those pics of horses bring back memories of elk and mule deer hunts out west. Oh, for those days again. Too old now for that, 83.
Those pics of horses bring back memories of elk and mule deer hunts out west. Oh, for those days again. Too old now for that, 83.
bad_aim_billy
Member
Nothing against those that use horses on this forum, but by far the biggest idiots I've met in the backcountry have almost always been on horseback. Maybe it's the "I'm up higher than you" thing, I don't know. Around here, horses tear up the trails and just basically get in the way. I'd never consider using one in the mountains, I'll take my own two feet any day. YMMV.
35 Whelen
Member
Hate to hear that. Can you no longer ride at all anymore? My Dad was 77 last year when we took our annual elk hunt. Ever since our first trip to NM when he was 71, he's said he doubts he'll be able to do it the next year due to age. So far, so good though. I've told him that as long as he can ride, I can get him to a hunting spot. He rides a big mare mule that's 16-1, so he has to get her positioned right to get in the saddle, but most times he can do it without my help. Sometimes I might have to give him a little boost or help him get his offside toe in the stirrup, but not very often. But, he isn't able to walk as far as he used to especially at the elevations we hunt.
I think the quickest way to get hurt on a horse is to stop paying attention. I'm not all that experienced with them, but having ridden quite a bit over the last few years and especially having ridden LOTS of miles in the mountains, I sometimes find myself becoming complacent and repaxed; taking in the scenery and admiring God's creation when I should be watching the animals ears or feeling for tension, etc.
35W
35 Whelen
Member
Interesting. My experience has been just the opposite in the form of ATV riders leaving the trails and roads. As an example, there's a beautiful alpine lake in northern New Mexico that's accessible by vehicle by a road that's a series of very, very tight switchbacks. The ATV-er's have have driven straight up and down the mountain crossing the road perpendicularly which of course has started severe erosion.
Regarding trails in the back country, the Forest Service maintains these trails for foot and horseback travel.
35W
bad_aim_billy
Member
I hunt and backpack in no-wheels wilderness areas, so atv's aren't an issue. Mountain bikers aren't even allowed, which makes no sense to me considering horses are. But I guess us Plebians don't make the rules...
Art Eatman
Moderator In Memoriam
ATVs vs. horses for damage? Probably a numbers and behavior thing. Lots more people on ATVs than on horses. And wheelspin is a Bad Thing.
FWIW, all hooved animals do some pushing of grass seed down into the dirt where birds don't find them--which makes for new grass. Deer, elk, bison, sheep, goats, cows, horses...
Seems to me that a horse for use in hunting isn't much different from one used in plowing: A work animal, not a high-bred high-performance animal. One which does what it's told and doesn't get all excited about it.
I'm not old enough to remember--really I'm not--but I have read that cavalry horses were more preferred if they were older. Less excitable. However, back in the 1930s my father broke horses for the US cavalry at Camp Mabry in Austin. Rough-broke horses + city-bred soldiers = entertainment at the "rodeo".
It was explained to me that many cavalry horses had lost part or all of their left ears. Trainee troopers: "Draw...Sabers!" Oops.
Feisty horses are fine in open flat-land country, but I wouldn't want one in rough country.
FWIW, all hooved animals do some pushing of grass seed down into the dirt where birds don't find them--which makes for new grass. Deer, elk, bison, sheep, goats, cows, horses...
Seems to me that a horse for use in hunting isn't much different from one used in plowing: A work animal, not a high-bred high-performance animal. One which does what it's told and doesn't get all excited about it.
I'm not old enough to remember--really I'm not--but I have read that cavalry horses were more preferred if they were older. Less excitable. However, back in the 1930s my father broke horses for the US cavalry at Camp Mabry in Austin. Rough-broke horses + city-bred soldiers = entertainment at the "rodeo".
It was explained to me that many cavalry horses had lost part or all of their left ears. Trainee troopers: "Draw...Sabers!" Oops.
Feisty horses are fine in open flat-land country, but I wouldn't want one in rough country.
grubbylabs
Member
Having worked in an ER for several years I can tell you that at least in our area there were more horse wrecks than ATV wrecks and that the people on horses who were injured varied greatly from beginners to well seasoned horse people. I have ridden horses for several years and will be the first to tell you that the most I know about them is that they eat a lot of hay and that when you sit on one, you and the horse should face the same way.
While they are a useful hunting tool and a pleasure to be around most of the time, they are upwards of a 1,000+ pound animal with a mind of its own, that should be respected. If I had to guess as to the major reason for horse wrecks I would guess from my own personal experience is that it is a combination of asking what a horse is not willing or able to give or understand, and an inexperienced rider.
But it is a great feeling knowing that you are getting your elk out in one trip and the elk is not riding on your back.
As far as ATV use goes I think that I have run into far more jerks on ATV's than I have on horses. In fact I can't think of a single time I have run into a jerk on a horse. I don't have any thing against ATV's I like them a lot and hope to own them again some day soon but that is just my personal experience.
While they are a useful hunting tool and a pleasure to be around most of the time, they are upwards of a 1,000+ pound animal with a mind of its own, that should be respected. If I had to guess as to the major reason for horse wrecks I would guess from my own personal experience is that it is a combination of asking what a horse is not willing or able to give or understand, and an inexperienced rider.
But it is a great feeling knowing that you are getting your elk out in one trip and the elk is not riding on your back.
As far as ATV use goes I think that I have run into far more jerks on ATV's than I have on horses. In fact I can't think of a single time I have run into a jerk on a horse. I don't have any thing against ATV's I like them a lot and hope to own them again some day soon but that is just my personal experience.
TwoEyedJack
Member
I use horses for hunting the rugged back country that is pretty much inaccessible by foot. I mean, you could hike in, but getting an elk on the ground would be the beginning of the worst day of your life. Thousands of vertical back to the road. Guys try it during archery season, most times they get a quarter out and then give up.
Here is my best hunting horse. Later on the day this picture was taken, she hauled out a whole elk in one trip.
Here is another nice shot. The horse packing is so broke he doesn't care if you are loading a deer or Styrofoam on him.
They can be dangerous, no doubt. It is not like a 4-wheeler. You have to get them used to being around spooky things and not use horses that won't settle down.
I have been training the mare in the first picture to tolerate gunfire from the saddle. They started up a cowboy mounted shooting chapter near my that looks like a lot of fun. Plus I would get to buy two more revolvers
Here is my best hunting horse. Later on the day this picture was taken, she hauled out a whole elk in one trip.
Here is another nice shot. The horse packing is so broke he doesn't care if you are loading a deer or Styrofoam on him.
They can be dangerous, no doubt. It is not like a 4-wheeler. You have to get them used to being around spooky things and not use horses that won't settle down.
I have been training the mare in the first picture to tolerate gunfire from the saddle. They started up a cowboy mounted shooting chapter near my that looks like a lot of fun. Plus I would get to buy two more revolvers
Sheepdog1968
Member
Thank you all for the stories and the wonderful photos. I didn't know when I posted the thread if I would get many responses. I'm grateful for what you have posted.
I used to ride horse quite a bit in my youth, as my cousin had a horse. The first lesson my cousin taught me was how to mount safety. The most important lesson my cousin taught me was how to dismount in an emergency.
My cousin wasn't of the mind-set that the horse had to be ridden regardless of what it wanted. His view was if a typically calm horse is bucking and throwing a fit, something's wrong. Get off ASAP, and start to figure out what's wrong. If the horse is falling over, "exit" the opposite side. It worked for me. I think a lot of people get injured because they try to ride-it-out, rather than dismount.
Last time I rode was when I lived in Chile. <<<sighs>> I miss riding. And one of my bucket-list items, go hunting with horse transportation and companionship. Add to that a good dog and a good fellow hunter... Some day.
Thanks for the pictures all, and all the posts. This is a great thread!!!
Geno
My cousin wasn't of the mind-set that the horse had to be ridden regardless of what it wanted. His view was if a typically calm horse is bucking and throwing a fit, something's wrong. Get off ASAP, and start to figure out what's wrong. If the horse is falling over, "exit" the opposite side. It worked for me. I think a lot of people get injured because they try to ride-it-out, rather than dismount.
Last time I rode was when I lived in Chile. <<<sighs>> I miss riding. And one of my bucket-list items, go hunting with horse transportation and companionship. Add to that a good dog and a good fellow hunter... Some day.
Thanks for the pictures all, and all the posts. This is a great thread!!!
Geno
PoserHoser
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tie a dead coyote near their water works every time
buddyemily
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Thanks for sharing such beautiful pics 35.
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It's official. I've now heard it all!!
Internet=WOW!!
BY far and away the most experienced serious and knowledgeable hunters I meet are mounted. It takes a whole different and unique outdoors skill set ride, care for, and know how to use horses for hunting in the back country. Heck just knowing how to ride in rough country forget the whole hunting element.
Now as far as horses "tearing up" trails? Really, horses are tearing up trails? REALLY? That is simply not correct. I've spent WAY to much time in the back country to even start to entertain that one. As has been mentioned the USFS maintains back country trails for foot and horse traffic so I guess you need to get yourself a big ole cup of get over yourself dude.
What's next no aggressive treaded hiking boots on your precious trails? Might leave a scuff mark on a rock you know..
Art Eatman
Moderator In Memoriam
H&H, being correct isn't quite as good as ignoring foolish comments.
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TwoEyedJack,
I notice in your picture that you are using saddle panniers. I am a big fan, I consider them to be my secret weapon in the back country.
BTW,
That strawberry roan with in the picture with the deer on his back...Does he have a little Morgan or perhaps some mustang in him? He's a sturdy looking mountain horse.
Freedom_fighter_in_IL
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I was wondering the same thing. That horse has the "shoulders" of a mule. Stout looking to say the lest.
CoRoMo
Member
Getting there.
We've always done the backcountry hunting on foot alone, but it's getting old. This past fall we broke the tradition by bringing along a donkey. I don't see a point in turning back either. We'll use animals from here on out.
Okay, so here's a good story:
Back in October, I was making my last hike out of the backcountry, and taking a route that I've never taken. A few miles to go, I hear a couple rifle shots and can tell that it was relatively close. Keep hiking. A little while later, here comes a saddled paint horse running flat out towards me. I'm on a horse trail after all, so he's got something to follow. When he sees me he hits the brakes and begins to settle down. No rider though and we're a long ways from anywhere. So I figure that if he won't try and bite me, I'll grab him and lead him out, not knowing what I should do with him afterward. By the time I get down to him, he's grazing and copacetic, so I take his reigns and we start out. A mile or more back out that horse trail we go, before... here comes a huffing/puffing hunter trying to maintain a fast pace. He was extremely glad to see me and thanks me over and over. I simply tell him that, "I've got a horse for sale".
Turns out that he had just killed a little bull elk between me and the trailhead. He dismounted to take a finishing shot and when he turned to get his horse, his rifle barrel hit the paint in the face... and off he went.
I helped him dress out that bull, and he promised me a quarter for my trouble, but I declined and headed out with nothing but the story. Dang it; if I had only been a little quicker on the foot, I'd have been in that spot where that little bull flushed out.
We've always done the backcountry hunting on foot alone, but it's getting old. This past fall we broke the tradition by bringing along a donkey. I don't see a point in turning back either. We'll use animals from here on out.
Okay, so here's a good story:
Back in October, I was making my last hike out of the backcountry, and taking a route that I've never taken. A few miles to go, I hear a couple rifle shots and can tell that it was relatively close. Keep hiking. A little while later, here comes a saddled paint horse running flat out towards me. I'm on a horse trail after all, so he's got something to follow. When he sees me he hits the brakes and begins to settle down. No rider though and we're a long ways from anywhere. So I figure that if he won't try and bite me, I'll grab him and lead him out, not knowing what I should do with him afterward. By the time I get down to him, he's grazing and copacetic, so I take his reigns and we start out. A mile or more back out that horse trail we go, before... here comes a huffing/puffing hunter trying to maintain a fast pace. He was extremely glad to see me and thanks me over and over. I simply tell him that, "I've got a horse for sale".
Turns out that he had just killed a little bull elk between me and the trailhead. He dismounted to take a finishing shot and when he turned to get his horse, his rifle barrel hit the paint in the face... and off he went.
I helped him dress out that bull, and he promised me a quarter for my trouble, but I declined and headed out with nothing but the story. Dang it; if I had only been a little quicker on the foot, I'd have been in that spot where that little bull flushed out.
I have hunted elk using horses because it was the only way, short of a helicopter, to get into the mountains. We spent 7 days out and most of the time was taking care of the horses. The alternative was to stay at camp and not hunt so I will just live with taking care of horses.
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