Do heavier bullets drop faster than lighter bullets....

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Two rounds fired from different guns, example: one a 220 swift and the other a .45 LC. Both with identical trajectory, fired over a flat surface and fired at the exact same time, will hit the ground at the same time.
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:banghead: NO! NO! NO! the entire point of this thread was to debunk this misconception. Things DO NOT FALL AT THE SAME RATE THROUGH AIR! For bullets of different sizes the variable "b" must first be found, then it can be determined which will hit the ground sooner....I give up, I guess some people also believe that the earth is still flat :rolleyes: For such a short distance, they hit at nearly the same time, so close that you can not notice the difference with the naked eye, but they do hit at different times
 
GarandOwner said:
NO! NO! NO! the entire point of this thread was to debunk this misconception. Things DO NOT FALL AT THE SAME RATE THROUGH AIR!
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Repeat...

Vertical air resistance is of no consequence where this topic is concerned. We are talking about bullets. Not feathers. There is no meaningful difference between a .22LR and a .50BMG where vertical movement is concerned.

Sheldon J said:
Two rounds fired from different guns, example: one a 220 swift and the other a .45 LC. Both with identical trajectory, fired over a flat surface and fired at the exact same time, will hit the ground at the same time.
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All other factors being equal (shot angle, wind, ect.), that's exactly right.


-T.
 
"...Do heavier bullets drop faster than lighter bullets..." No. Lighter bullets lose velocity faster, hence they drop faster.
"...Things DO NOT FALL AT THE SAME RATE THROUGH AIR!..." Yes they do. Gravity acts upon all things at the same rate. You could dig up Galileo and Newton and argue it over with them though. Or drop a 100 grain bullet and a200 grain bullet and watch them hit the ground at the same time.
 
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Sunray said:
"...Do heavier bullets drop faster than lighter bullets..." No. Lighter bullets lose velocity faster, hence they don't go as far.
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Fixed it for ya. ;)

Regardless of velocity or weight, both bullets will move vertically at the same rate. They will differ in their horizontal movement only.

That is to say, they hit the ground at the same time, but at two different distances.


-T.
 
Hi Jimmy Dean,
I'll still have to disagree,as it is impossible to separate the bullet from the air. The bullet pushes air out of the way as it exits the barrel. The shape of the crown will affect the bullets path to some extent due to how the gases behind the bullet interact with the 'outside' air, and finally, the rotation of the bullet whilst traveling through the air is affected by the friction of the air molecules acting on the now "rifled" projectile. Now, I realize I am in the position of having to prove a negative :eek: so, I'll leave it at that. Back to the original question, and disregarding any aerodynamic effects, e.g. boat tail HP. Two projectiles, regardless of weight, leaving barrels at the same height above ground, at the same angle relative to the earth and at the SAME velocity will strike the earth at the same time and place. Meaning, the horizontal velocity and the vertical velocity due to gravity, are equal in speed and direction for each bullet.
Best,
Rob :)
 
Got tired of reading all the answers. Possibly some or most have some educational factors. However, all is just a probability and almost not able to be proven factually. Way to may variables. For example a bullets traveling through air at different elevations travel differently due to the density of the air. Bullets traveling through damp air versus dry air also travel at different speeds. Bullets traveling through air in motion towards or away from the path of the bullets also will have different speeds. If the weight of the bullets is even a thousandth of a gram different, there is a possibility of effect. If one bullet is soft and expands from the heat of movement from friction, that too could have an effect on the rate of speed of that bullet making it either fall faster or fly all over the place. A hollow point, ball point, flat point on one bullet versus another also play a part in speed and falling. Dropping a bullet at exactly the same micro second a bullet is fired from a gun is another just imaginable probability.
Just to many variables.
 
rob, the other things that you are missing is this, bullets, heavy or light, are normally the same density as well, which means that despite their actual size, the effect of air resistance on them will be the same, since their size/weight differance will beproportional, so AR will act on them equelly
 
The original poster and several others who agreed are correct, although I did not check all the formulas. Posters who noted that there is no practical difference in drop in air are also correct, as for a typical horizontal shot, we are talking about a drop of less than 5' from an initial vertical velocity of zero.

I would like to see a knowledgeable discussion of the effect of inertia on gravity-induced drop. Bullets in flight have considerable inertia, more so for higher velocities and faster twist rates. This inertia resists any change in motion. Stationary objects also have inertia, but not nearly as much. Like a gyroscope, a fast moving bullet is much harder to move off course than is a stationary one. Therefore, moving bullets should resist gravity more so than will stationary ones.

Comments by physicists/engineers?
 
The gravitational pull is the same no matter what the weight. It does not matter wether the bullet weighs 50gr. or 500gr. you shoot or drop them at the exact time and they BOTH will hit the ground at the same time!!!!
 
Please refer to the INGALLS tables.

Everyone is right, and wrong.

All objects drop at the same rate IN A VACUME in our atmosphere a pound of lead will definitely fall faster than a pound of feathers, unless those feathers are compressed to a density of lead.

Heavier bullets have higher sectional density then lighter bullets of the same diameter. It is possible to streamline bullets of high sectional density with long pointed ogives and long boat tails like Berger does and others. These bullets suffer less velocity loss over long ranges allowing them to reach distant targets sooner and thus drop less.

In the real world anecdotal evidence is contradicting and confusing.
The same rifle, shooting the same weight and shape bullets can place its shots higher on a 100 yard target with a slower (less powerful) loading. This is due to longer barrel time and the rise in the muzzle during the bullets trip down the bore causing the slower bullet to launch at a higher angle of elevation or vertiacl azimuth. Downrage, at three or four hundred yards the slower bullet will impact lower as expected due to the flight time.
 
Scientific revolution
Modern work on gravitational theory began with the work of Galileo Galilei in the late 16th century and early 17th century. In his famous (though probably apocryphal)[citation needed] experiment dropping balls from the Tower of Pisa, and later with careful measurements of balls rolling down inclines, Galileo showed that gravitation accelerates all objects at the same rate. This was a major departure from Aristotle's belief that heavier objects are accelerated faster. [12] (Galileo correctly postulated air resistance as the reason that lighter objects may fall more slowly in an atmosphere.) Galileo's work set the stage for the formulation of Newton's theory of gravity.
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this means that the weight of a bullet DOES effect how fast it drops.

Well, yes, but that doesn't have any appreciable meaning until you start reaching vertical speeds approaching the terminal velocity for the projectiles involved.
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Alrighty then! Lets put in another twist. Say you're on a cliff and you can fire a 170 gr boat-tail spitzer straight out, and drop a 170 gr LSWC at the exact same time. Say a 15000 ft drop. This should be enough to get bullets falling at terminal velocity. Do they both hit the ground at the same time? Does anything change if both are spitzers? Both LSWCs?

Personally, I always thought that bullet design was to keep it in the air longer AKA aerodynamics. Then I hear that bullets don't have aerodynamics, but simple ballistic coefficient, as they produce no lift. I used to think that producing something akin to lift was the general idea in bullets like the BTS, to "ride on a cushion of air" so to speak. But then, I'm no scholar of any of the above sciences. Please explain, guys, this is fascinating.:cool:
 
I always thought that bullet design was to keep it in the air longer AKA aerodynamics.
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They don't stay in the air longer due to aerodynamics or coefficients of friction aka "Ballistic Coefficient" at all.

Let's compare apples to apples for a minute. Two .30 caliber bullets. One is a boattail spitzer, and the other is a plain based, round-nose bullet. Both bullets exit at the same velocity, and...if they're fired at the exact same instant...both bullets hit the ground at the same time. The boattail bullet will travel farther because it sheds velocity at a slower rate, so it's ahead of the round-nosed bullet when they hit the ground simply because it outruns it...and it's further downrange for a given unit of time in the air.

While there may be a difference in vertical acceleration between the two different bullet shapes...it would be so infintessimal that it would be of no practical matter.

Step up to two bullets of identical ballistic coefficient...but one is heavier than the other. If both bullets are fired at the same instant, and the exit velocity is identical...the heavier bullet will shed velocity at a slower rate due to its greater momentum, and it will outrun the ballistically identical, but lighter bullet...and they'll both hit the ground at the same time again.

Two identical bullets in every way...but with 500 fps difference in muzzle velocity. The faster bullet will travel farther than the slower one...but they'll hit the ground at the same time. One will just be farther downrange when it hits.

So, it's not a matter of dwell time in the air. It's the flight time to the target...the amount of time that gravity has to act on the bullet...at a given range that determines the amount of drop.
 
Hold a heavy bullet in your left hand, and a light bullet in your right hand. Hold you hands out in front of you and drop them both at the same time.

/thread
 
Folks remember your physics, all objects drop at the same rate.

ALL THINGS.

Now where it drops along it's trajectory, well now we can have a discussion. But they all will hit the ground at the same time. Just different places.

There used to be a physics experiment to prove this. It was called the monkey gun experiment.

Here read this link and learn.

http://www.fas.harvard.edu/~scdiroff/lds/NewtonianMechanics/ShoottheMonkey/ShoottheMonkey.html

Sheesh!

Go figure.

Fred
 
False, except in a vacuum. The accelerational pull of gravity is the same, roughly 32.2 feet per second squared, but the rate of drop varies due to air resistance and ballistic/friction coefficient. Again, if you don't believe it, drop a muzzleloader ball and a plastic bag full of feathers (of the same weight if you wish) off your roof and see what happens. The fired bullet vs. dropped bullet thingy may work IF one can drop an identical bullet oriented in the same direction as the fired one (sideways) such that both drag coefficients are the same for a vertical fall.
 
The horizontal component has no effect. If it did the bullet would "sail" and not be accurate. Both a heavy bullet and a light bullet fall at the same vertical rate.
Therefore, FIRED HORIZONTALLY, from any height, they both hit the ground at the same time.

The fired bullet vs. dropped bullet thingy may work IF one can drop an identical bullet oriented in the same direction as the fired one (sideways) such that both drag coefficients are the same for a vertical fall.
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The terminal velocity of both bullets is the same. That eliminates the air as a factor. Bullets falling orient themselves sideways. Mythbusters did this trying to see if a bullet fired straight up had enough energy to kill someone under them. They built a tube with a moving air column and the bullets fell sideways at about 150 mph, no matter what caliber.
 
Gross oversimplification of course. But lets make it realistic.

Take a frisbee of 2 ounces and a 2 ounce round ball. Spin the frisbee on a horizontal axis and the round ball on a verticle forward axis and launch them at the same rate of speed through air. Which hits the ground first....

Ever seen a golf ball slice through the air, or a overspun round ball out of a musket ~ same effect. The air current effects the float. Musket balls can slice up, sideways, or down through the air.

But that 2 ounce frisbee can actually catch verticle lift and stay up there hanging for a good long while, often confusing the Border Collie waiting on it's return to earth:D

Giz
 
Ignoring air resistance, fat people fall at the same speed as skinny people. Now apply that to bullets.
 
Good point,

For much of the theory given, you have to ignore air resistance.

Give either the fat person or the skinny person a parachute, and the results change dramatically.....

Can we all at least assume one given....
We do not live in a vacuum.....(well except for my wifes' checking account);)

Giz
 
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