Do you think this .380acp round would be good as a defensive round?

[Orion8472]

There has been a lot of discussion in what .380acp round would be "best" for defense. Some say a hollow point, others say a FMJ for better penetration.

I came across the following 94gr JHP at Academy [Monarch brand] that looks like it probably wouldn't expand reliably, . . . but could. I don't know, really. But from the looks of it, what do you think?

 

[FMF Doc]

Michigan State Police used to mandate that troopers carry a back-up, but would let them carry anything they wanted. Then, a trooper was shot in the hand at a traffic stop and had to draw his backup, a Ruger LCP in .380 ACP. When his shot back with it, the rounds did not penetrate the motorcycle jacket the, and the trooper died. As a result, the state police mandated that all troopers would carry a S&W .357mag back-up. Now, all that being said, anything is still better than nothing. If it was warm out, and you did not expect to have to shoot through layers of clothes, then a good JHP in .380 will probably get the job done. It actually looks like a pretty good round, just be sure that it feeds well in what you are shooting. That, I have found, is the biggest challenge with .380 JHP ammo.

 

[rswartsell]

Can't tell a thing from how it looks, test it.

 

[skt239]

Well, I don't know much about the .380 but that cavity looks like it could be bigger.

FMF,

Is that something you read/saw in the news? Are you a Michigan state trooper? Is that just something you heard from a friend? I ask because I did some googling and turned up nothing. This is the first time I've heard this story. Got a link or source? Not calling you out, just interested...

Thanks.

 

[19-3Ben]

Do you think this .380acp round would be good as a defensive round?

Any bullet that comes out of the muzzle reliably and hits to POA accurately is going to be adequate.
As for what's good... tough to tell. It probably is not a great JHP in that it is probably made cheaply and will either not expand, shed its jacket, or both. (total speculation here with no basis other than pricepoint and the look of the bullet in the pics.)

I carry FMJ in my .380 but if I did carry a JHP I would want one that would reliably expand (Gold Dot or similar).
Carrying a lousy JHP means that you get all the reliability risks of JHP, but without the benefits of a good quality JHP to overcome the downsides. It's a lose-lose.

 

[Orion8472]

I'd like to see tnoutdoors9 try this one out, just to see what it would do. I don't have the place to do ballistics testing.

 

[MICHAEL T]

Michigan State Police used to mandate that troopers carry a back-up, but would let them carry anything they wanted. Then, a trooper was shot in the hand at a traffic stop and had to draw his backup, a Ruger LCP in .380 ACP. When his shot back with it, the rounds did not penetrate the motorcycle jacket

I would like to see proof of this. Google search turned up nothing. How about a new release or police report.

 

[heeler]

My experience with Academy branded Monarch,which I am pretty sure is really Prvi Partisan,in both 38 Special as well as .380 was pretty damn abysmal.
The 38 had so many misfires out of both my Smith model 37 as well as my Ruger Service Six,and this was two boxes mind you,that I never bothered to buy it again in 38 Special.
So one day during the great 380 ammo drought I came across a fresh delivery of the Monarch in 380 and bought two for a fair sum of money,close to $50 for both.
I go to the range and load up and fire and I see these white particles floating in the air.
What???...Next shot was a poot.
It was so quiet I doubted the bullet had even cleared the barrel but upon checking found it did.
Next shot was a load bang with more white snow.
Next shot another Poot!!!
Checked the barrel again and it did exit.
Grabbed the other box and experienced some misfires,low key pooting rounds and just finally went to the counter guy and asked them to please dispose of these pitiful cartridges.
The guy at the counter carried a Bersa Thunder and told me he too had bought some of these and had similiar issues.
YMMV,but I for one will never again buy that Serb crud.

 

[mdThanatos]

It may not be the best but it would be better than nothing. You could try shooting a wet phonebook to see how it expands. I have had good luck with Academy's Monarch brand ammo. in terms of functioning through the firearms I shot it with, haven't had to worry about shooting anyone or anything.

 

[Biggerhammer]

Better than a knife.

 

[76shuvlinoff]

I carry FMJ in my LCP

I live in Michigan, I can not recall or find anything yet on-line about a State Trooper being killed at a traffic stop recently.

 

[Nicky Santoro]

Then, a trooper was shot in the hand at a traffic stop and had to draw his backup, a Ruger LCP in .380 ACP. When his shot back with it, the rounds did not penetrate the motorcycle jacket...

I, also, would need to see documentation on this. I have a .380 and understand its capabilities and its limitations. I often wore a motorcycle jacket when I rode years ago. I can assure you that a jacket will not stop a .380, nor will it stop a .32, .25, or .22 for that matter.

 

[One_Jackal]

Read this article and the interesting links. You will have totally different view of .380 ammo. If FBI criteria isn't good enough for you I sure can't help you. http://www.firearmstactical.com/wound.htm

 

[Shear_stress]

Can't tell a thing from how it looks, test it.

That is the correct answer. Amazingly, a lot of what passes for peoples' assessments of cartridge "effectiveness" (however that's defined) relies on "visual ballistics"--simply what the round looks like(!)

More than likely ballistics testing wouldn't reveal any big surprises anyway. I'm of the opinion that, by and large, the .380 can give you penetration or expansion but not both.

 

[Orion8472]

heeler, thank you for your relaying your experience. I only purchased one box. I'll be extra careful when trying them out.

 

[Pilot]

My current summer carry is a Beretta M85FS in .380. I don't feel under armed. I use Cor Bon +p JHP in it.

 

[verdun59]

Well I have to say my motorcycle jacket is for defeating bugs, and hopefully to prevent road rash. It's pretty thick but there is no way it would stop any bullet ....... I'm just no buying it.

 

[Robert101]

My approach to the 380 is two fold. FMJ for penetration and more reliable. So for me Part of the answer also must consider that the bullet must function in the gun. Sorry if I didn't answer you directly but thought you might want to test for feeding too.

 

[M7]

Well I have to say my motorcycle jacket is for defeating bugs, and hopefully to prevent road rash. It's pretty thick but there is no way it would stop any bullet ....... I'm just no buying it.

Same here.

I doubt that the fabrics used in clothing has the tensile strength needed to stop a bullet. Might plug up and stop a JHP from expanding, but that'll make it act more like an FMJ.

 

[788Ham]

I know this is detracting from your question/comments. I have a 1935 Beretta .32 {browning 7.65} pistol, I've never been pleased with HP ammo in this pistol. I shoot nothing but FMJ out of it. I've tried .32 APC rounds, the HP's, they are just a small difference in case neck configuration from the Browning round, thus negating feeding properly.

Use what you can afford, I know the .32 round isn't a .44 caliber, but the FMJ pill will penetrate better than the HP round, full of cloth, leather or whatever.

 

[Okie45]

Looks like they should of kept that hollow point full of lead and made it a jacketed soft point. I'd be interested to see how one would perform in .380. Might penetrate as deep as a fmj, and if it did expand, prob wouldn't be as dramatic as a hollowpoint, allowing it to go in deeper. Just some random thinking.

 

[brnmuenchow]

It's better than a BB gun!

 

[Orion8472]

Okie, when I saw it, that was my first thought. Probably wouldn't expand much if any, so it would STILL be like a FMJ in penetration [almost], . . . but if it DID mushroom a little, it would be a "best of both worlds" sort of thing [perhaps].

 

[Leadinmyboot]

My summer EDC and winter BUG is a Bodyguard .380. I keep it loaded with Winchester Supreme Elite, and have a spare mag of Remington JHP's in my weak side pocket, always. The Supreme elite has better expansion properties, and the Remmy's offer better penetration. (From the homework I have done). I have often considered carrying FMJ's in my spare mag, and may do so this winter, at which point I would probably keep her loaded with the Remington JHP's. I have fired 500+ FMJ's and about 250 of each of carry ammo without a malfunction (yet...)

 

[MedWheeler]

According to The Officer Down Memorial Page, the Michigan State Police has had one trooper killed in the line of duty since 2005 (prior to the introduction of the Ruger LCP), and that was in a motor vehicle crash.
Like many others, I'd have no qualms carrying a .380 round that fires reliably, and can find its mark. That round actually does look like a decent compromise between JHP and FMJ, but when I did carry a .380 (Bersa Thunder, which gives the round a little more push than the LCP), it was loaded with a semi-jacketed flat-nosed round.