entropy
Member
I concur. Everything currently in our store's inventory is same-same with anything you'd get at Gander Mountain or Crusty Fred's Gun and Live Bait.
Nice to see another "Associate" on the forum, Crosshair!
Does Wal-Mart have special versions of guns made for them?
- Thread starter albanian
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I concur. Everything currently in our store's inventory is same-same with anything you'd get at Gander Mountain or Crusty Fred's Gun and Live Bait.
Nice to see another "Associate" on the forum, Crosshair!
Lupinus
Member
I think they are the same.
Considering if they make a product that is crap it is the maker that has to fix it and not the wally world I don't see them doing it.
Considering if they make a product that is crap it is the maker that has to fix it and not the wally world I don't see them doing it.
mathewsman99
Member
- Joined
- Feb 8, 2006
- Messages
- 21
i bought a m70 300wsm and couldent be happier and than i also bought a mossberg 695 which sits in my gun cabnit that i dont ever shoot
Husker1911
Member
Nalapombu said:
I beg to differ. I worked in a gunstore in a small town. Probably about 1996, we purchased six 870 Expresses from Walmart. Quite frankly, they were for resale, since the price was LESS than dealer price. In three of those Express boxes, we found Remington repair tickets. At least in that case, those shotguns were clearly "seconds".
The Walmart 10/22 has a birch version of the walnut sporter stock normally found on the sporter 10/22's. The rifle isn't on Ruger's website. It is is a nice looking stock and there are supposedly accuracy advantages to not having a barrel band. Why it commands a higher price than a birch stocked carbine, I am not sure. Checkering and a few inches of barrel cost a lot I guess.
I was always under the impression that walmart's demand for cheap stuff caused gun makers to make them special "cheap runs" since they are big enough to buy the whole run. I guess I am not sure where exactly I got that impression from.
Weren't the Remington 700 ADL's walmart guns not sold anywhere else?
I was always under the impression that walmart's demand for cheap stuff caused gun makers to make them special "cheap runs" since they are big enough to buy the whole run. I guess I am not sure where exactly I got that impression from.
Weren't the Remington 700 ADL's walmart guns not sold anywhere else?
CajunBass
Member
I think the ADL's were just a lower priced version of certain guns. I remember seeing them, long before I ever saw a Wal-Mart.
22-rimfire
Member
Walmart, an amazing retailing story really. I remember complaints by taxpayers about an airport with the extra long landing field being built in what seemed like the middle of nowhere Arkansas. (Gov. Bill Clinton days). There was no major city nearby. It was built specifically for importing stuff from overseas via 747/767 sized jets for Walmart, and probably Tyson (chicken)-exports. The US tax payers paid for this airport with a little add in to the budget. Even then, Bill Clinton was one of the chosen.
Guns: Back in the 60's and 70's it was quite fashionable for the major retailers to have their own name brand firearms. The easy examples are JC Higgins, Westernfield, Ted Williams, Revelation distributed specifically by a retailer chains such as Montgomery Ward, Sears, and Western Auto. These generally were economy versions of the regular firearms produced by such companies as Savage/Stevens, Mossberg, High Standard, Winchester and I believe H&R. The pricing advantage came for them came from being an economy model and large DIRECT contracts between the retailer and the manufacture. The guns were typically pump shotguns, single shot 22's, single barrel shotguns, and 22 autos. These guns were manufactured and sold directly to the retail chain and did not go through distributers as we know them today. Hence, the price was lower and from a gun company perspective-they were large sales contracts which I'm sure helped to keep them in business.
As mentioned, the Remington Model 700 ADL predated the Walmart phenomena and I don't recall Remington ever making firearms specfically for a retailer where the Remington name is not on the gun. I do seem to recall that the Nylon 66 Mohawk version was distributed exclusively by a store chain. (I could be wrong.)
I believe the Ruger name is viewed as a marketing plus for Walmart and being the astute retailer they are, they use the name and purchase large quantities of firearms for resale. Walmart probably buys them directly from Ruger also (hence no middleman distributer). I believe they are the same guns and these are not "seconds". Walmart sells many of the Ruger guns on their internet catalog not just for example the birch wood or synthetic stocked versions that you see in their stores typically.
Are the Weatherby Vanguard rifles "seconds"? I doubt it. Are the Leupold scopes "seconds"; I doubt it.
Guns: Back in the 60's and 70's it was quite fashionable for the major retailers to have their own name brand firearms. The easy examples are JC Higgins, Westernfield, Ted Williams, Revelation distributed specifically by a retailer chains such as Montgomery Ward, Sears, and Western Auto. These generally were economy versions of the regular firearms produced by such companies as Savage/Stevens, Mossberg, High Standard, Winchester and I believe H&R. The pricing advantage came for them came from being an economy model and large DIRECT contracts between the retailer and the manufacture. The guns were typically pump shotguns, single shot 22's, single barrel shotguns, and 22 autos. These guns were manufactured and sold directly to the retail chain and did not go through distributers as we know them today. Hence, the price was lower and from a gun company perspective-they were large sales contracts which I'm sure helped to keep them in business.
As mentioned, the Remington Model 700 ADL predated the Walmart phenomena and I don't recall Remington ever making firearms specfically for a retailer where the Remington name is not on the gun. I do seem to recall that the Nylon 66 Mohawk version was distributed exclusively by a store chain. (I could be wrong.)
I believe the Ruger name is viewed as a marketing plus for Walmart and being the astute retailer they are, they use the name and purchase large quantities of firearms for resale. Walmart probably buys them directly from Ruger also (hence no middleman distributer). I believe they are the same guns and these are not "seconds". Walmart sells many of the Ruger guns on their internet catalog not just for example the birch wood or synthetic stocked versions that you see in their stores typically.
Are the Weatherby Vanguard rifles "seconds"? I doubt it. Are the Leupold scopes "seconds"; I doubt it.
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Nimble1
Member
Mannlicher laminated stainless 10/22
I was walking through my local W/M about 4 years ago and spotted a Mannlicher 10/22 in the rack. Having a fondness for the mannlicher style rifle, I picked it up for $155.00. The birch stocked model was a little higher I believe. I have since seen on the rimfire forums that this was a special model made for W/M and is now commanding quite a higer price.
Nice looking little gun.
I was walking through my local W/M about 4 years ago and spotted a Mannlicher 10/22 in the rack. Having a fondness for the mannlicher style rifle, I picked it up for $155.00. The birch stocked model was a little higher I believe. I have since seen on the rimfire forums that this was a special model made for W/M and is now commanding quite a higer price.
Nice looking little gun.
Optical Serenity
Member
Every time I go to a gun shop, they want to lecture me about how Walmart is the devil. I hate to think how expensive guns would get if Walmart didn't exist...or ammo for that matter.
Nalapombu
Member
Think about this. In this day and age of a Lawyer behind every buggy and the firearms insdusty, wholesalers, FFL's and retail outlets have been under attack like never before, would it make a whole lot business sense for a gun company AND the Worlds Largets and most successful retailer to take in and sell guns that were SECONDS or blems? There is NO WAY that Wal-Mart would be that dumb where they would be on the phone with the Distributor or gun company and tell them "hey no problem, send us all of the factory SECONDS you want to, we'll sell 'em and make a ton of money on 'em." It just doesn't pass the smell test.
If somone that bought one of those "seconds" done something stupid and got hurt with those 870's and called a lawyer to sue Remington and Wal-Mart, any lawyer that SLEPTthrough law school could get an award of MULTI-MILLIONS from a jury when the piece of paper came out showing that the gun had been rejected off of the production floor and Wal-Mart bought it anyway when it was "fixed."
Does that sound feasable to you?
Nala
If somone that bought one of those "seconds" done something stupid and got hurt with those 870's and called a lawyer to sue Remington and Wal-Mart, any lawyer that SLEPTthrough law school could get an award of MULTI-MILLIONS from a jury when the piece of paper came out showing that the gun had been rejected off of the production floor and Wal-Mart bought it anyway when it was "fixed."
Does that sound feasable to you?
Nala
Derby FALs
Member In Memoriam
Ohen Cepel said:
If you see a SS standard barrel with laminated stock it came from Wal-Mart. The mannlichers are especially nice looking. All others will have a bull barrel.
Remington made rifles for K-Mart at a discounted price but the weren't as nicely finished. They might have fake "checkering" pressed into the wood intead of cut, etc.
They have some propiatary guns in their inventory, which is actually quite common throughout the history of large retailors selling firearms. They certainly dont lack in quality for the simple fact that the firearms manufactures have to put their name on the side of the weapons.
You can order any gun direct through the manufacturer from Wal-Mart. They are the same guns anyone else gets. You may here different at your LGS because they are in a bad way against Wal-Mart. I like to give my dough to LGS, but these days, they all seem a bit rude. Rather go to the local Wally World, where they usually don't know squat, but have really good deals. Someone posted about quality from Wal-Mart, that is due to the poor ass quality coming direct from the manufacturers these days.
superhornet
Member
- Joined
- Nov 16, 2005
- Messages
- 78
How do you tell if it is a Wal-mart gun ?? It will be the one that has a little sticker on it saying, "NON-Union Made" ho ho ho ho.....
CajunBass
Member
All this talk about the Wally World Special Ruger 10/22 SS Rifle, got me to go down to my local Wally World to see if they had any. They didn't have any on the rack, but the young fellow working there checked his computer, and said, "Well, this says we have one." Sure enough he checked and they did.
He got out the paperwork, explained it to me just like they do everywhere, called it in to the state police, got the OK back, and the manager checked the paperwork to make sure it was all done properly. In and out in one hour, and most of that was (1) waiting for the state police "instant" background check, (2) waiting for my wife to stop shopping. Yep, the manager carried the gun to the door, (same as they do at Gander Mountain) and thanked me for my business. No worse than any other place I've bought a gun lately, except for having to wait on my wife buying "stuff."
Picked up a couple value packs of 9mm's too.
He got out the paperwork, explained it to me just like they do everywhere, called it in to the state police, got the OK back, and the manager checked the paperwork to make sure it was all done properly. In and out in one hour, and most of that was (1) waiting for the state police "instant" background check, (2) waiting for my wife to stop shopping. Yep, the manager carried the gun to the door, (same as they do at Gander Mountain) and thanked me for my business. No worse than any other place I've bought a gun lately, except for having to wait on my wife buying "stuff."
Picked up a couple value packs of 9mm's too.
Correect me if I'm WRONG but that sounds fishy... #1 Walmart, nor ANY gunshop accepts NO refunds on guns and ammunition... anything wrong with a shotgun had to be returned to the factory for service, right? Even if you found 'repair tags' in the boxes there is no way you could prove they started at Wal-Mart and came BACK to Wal-Mart. It would be stupid for Remington to sell them to Walmart as "used" or "seconds" just due to liability.
Unlike the "Sears" and "Montgomery Wards" brand of firearms, Wal-Mart may offer 'package deals' on Winchester and Savage and other mfg's products, but doesn't put their name on the rifles and shotguns themselves.Even if it said "Wal-Mart" on the stock you'd have to send it back to Remington for repairs.
Walmart is a really different company. They are all about cheaper cheaper cheaper, regardless of the quality of the final item. A few examples.
Levi-Strauss used to make hell of good pants. Walmart contacted them, wanted to sell their pants because they had a good rep for durable goods. Levi jumped on. Problem was, they checked Levi's catalog, and NOTHING levis had was inexpensive enough. So Walmart helped levis find cheaper materials, cheaper methods, chinese labor, etc etc. So in the end you had 'walmart' pants, which were identical to 'generic Kmart' or any other cheap generic pant, except it had a Levi-Strauss label on it. What's worse, now ALL levis sold are this 'generic' model, not the quality product taht used to be around.
See, walmart requires the producer to cut the price of the product by 5% per year. True, in years 1-3 this can be done pretty easily. Year 3 is pretty tough, the company is already running lean. Years 5+ the ONLY way to keep on going cheaper to sacrifice quality.
Snapper or Toro, don't recall wich, was in a similar spot. Walmart approached them sell lawnmowers at walmart, because they were known for high quality product. Then what happens? Everything Snapper has is too expensive, so walmart wants Snapper to make a 99.99 walmart snapper, to be sold ONLY at walmart, snapper can sell the 229.99 push mowers at ace hardware, bob's hardware, joes lawn and garden, etc etc. Snapper said no, no way would they make a supercheap lawnmower and slap on a Snapper label just so walmart could have somethig to advertise and cash in on Snapper's good name, which wouldn't be all that good for all that much longer.
So, if there are walmart only guns made by a company, walmart is getting them cheaper than the standard version. SOMETHING happened. maybe barrelmaker A had a bunch of stainless steel 20 inch barrels and the original buyer went bankrupt, so ruger buys them cheap, makes a special walmart model with them. Not necessarily lower quality than normal rugers, but definately cheaper to produce.
However, mostly, if you see a gunmaker 'retire' an older model and come with a new model that is advertised as 'just as good, even better in fact, but cheaper!' taht is walmart. That new remington boltaction 710 to me stinks of wallworld influence. especially with the bushnell 'sharpshooter' (<--again, specially made for wallyworld) scope that comes with it.
also, if you are seeing what you generally regard as cheaper made firearms overall, that's because those gunmakers that are selling firearms to walmart are also required to cut 5% a year. They make everything cheaper and less well made, not just the ones they intend to sell to walmart.
Otherthings walmart does.
-either requires companies to put in a dedicated walmart line, or has that company sign a form saying they will accept collect calls from walmart
-walmart people who travel for work are required to take pens from the hotels they stay at. Walmart offices do not buy their own pens, they take em from other places.
Levi-Strauss used to make hell of good pants. Walmart contacted them, wanted to sell their pants because they had a good rep for durable goods. Levi jumped on. Problem was, they checked Levi's catalog, and NOTHING levis had was inexpensive enough. So Walmart helped levis find cheaper materials, cheaper methods, chinese labor, etc etc. So in the end you had 'walmart' pants, which were identical to 'generic Kmart' or any other cheap generic pant, except it had a Levi-Strauss label on it. What's worse, now ALL levis sold are this 'generic' model, not the quality product taht used to be around.
See, walmart requires the producer to cut the price of the product by 5% per year. True, in years 1-3 this can be done pretty easily. Year 3 is pretty tough, the company is already running lean. Years 5+ the ONLY way to keep on going cheaper to sacrifice quality.
Snapper or Toro, don't recall wich, was in a similar spot. Walmart approached them sell lawnmowers at walmart, because they were known for high quality product. Then what happens? Everything Snapper has is too expensive, so walmart wants Snapper to make a 99.99 walmart snapper, to be sold ONLY at walmart, snapper can sell the 229.99 push mowers at ace hardware, bob's hardware, joes lawn and garden, etc etc. Snapper said no, no way would they make a supercheap lawnmower and slap on a Snapper label just so walmart could have somethig to advertise and cash in on Snapper's good name, which wouldn't be all that good for all that much longer.
So, if there are walmart only guns made by a company, walmart is getting them cheaper than the standard version. SOMETHING happened. maybe barrelmaker A had a bunch of stainless steel 20 inch barrels and the original buyer went bankrupt, so ruger buys them cheap, makes a special walmart model with them. Not necessarily lower quality than normal rugers, but definately cheaper to produce.
However, mostly, if you see a gunmaker 'retire' an older model and come with a new model that is advertised as 'just as good, even better in fact, but cheaper!' taht is walmart. That new remington boltaction 710 to me stinks of wallworld influence. especially with the bushnell 'sharpshooter' (<--again, specially made for wallyworld) scope that comes with it.
also, if you are seeing what you generally regard as cheaper made firearms overall, that's because those gunmakers that are selling firearms to walmart are also required to cut 5% a year. They make everything cheaper and less well made, not just the ones they intend to sell to walmart.
Otherthings walmart does.
-either requires companies to put in a dedicated walmart line, or has that company sign a form saying they will accept collect calls from walmart
-walmart people who travel for work are required to take pens from the hotels they stay at. Walmart offices do not buy their own pens, they take em from other places.
Husker1911
Member
Dr.Rob said:
Doc, I don't have an agenda here. I'm relating a true, personal experience. Do you care to insult my integrity any further?
Aguila Blanca
Member
I have no first-hand knowledge or inside information. But I do have a gut feeling.
Several years ago I saw a Henry .22LR lever action in a local Wal-Mart for a fantastic price. However, since I prefer to support my local gun shop, I went over and asked the guy if he could come close to the Wal-Mart price. He dug out his pricing books, shook his head, and told me the Wal-Mart price was less than what he would have to pay for it.
I don't think he was kidding. Just a few days ago I asked him what he could o on anew Colt 1911 Series 70 in blue. He said $850 -- if he could find any (which he couldn't). Today a friend of mine and I were cruising gun shops and I saw the same pistol I had asked about -- new Colt Series 70, blued -- "on sale" for $999.95.
I know Wal-Mart has their own line of "Winchester" knives (made in China -- where else), so it's not hard to believe they would also have their own line of guns.
Several years ago I saw a Henry .22LR lever action in a local Wal-Mart for a fantastic price. However, since I prefer to support my local gun shop, I went over and asked the guy if he could come close to the Wal-Mart price. He dug out his pricing books, shook his head, and told me the Wal-Mart price was less than what he would have to pay for it.
I don't think he was kidding. Just a few days ago I asked him what he could o on anew Colt 1911 Series 70 in blue. He said $850 -- if he could find any (which he couldn't). Today a friend of mine and I were cruising gun shops and I saw the same pistol I had asked about -- new Colt Series 70, blued -- "on sale" for $999.95.
I know Wal-Mart has their own line of "Winchester" knives (made in China -- where else), so it's not hard to believe they would also have their own line of guns.
akodo said:
is there any company doctrine on that? or other written proof?
or is it just one of those things that they wont give the employees pens to go to a seminar...
much like my job wont give me pens and pencils to go to school or to a conferance. however they are available for office use. its to prevent fraud waste and abuse which is one of the biggest shortfalls of any company.
Stiletto Null
Member
Wait a minute, the Camo 597 was a Wally World special?
Like that one? (Disregard the M48 for now)
Like that one? (Disregard the M48 for now)
ulflyer
Member
Ala Dan....you afraid of showing your age? How about a guy buying his first handgun for $29.95, at age 12, with .50 cents down and .50 cents a week, no parental approval required. We call that the "good old days". Whoops, this thread is about WalMart.
ulflyer
Member
Good Old Days
Ala Dan....you afraid of showing your age? How about a guy buying his first handgun for $29.95, at age 12, with .50 cents down and .50 cents a week, no parental approval required. We call that the "good old days". Whoops, this thread is about WalMart.
Ala Dan....you afraid of showing your age? How about a guy buying his first handgun for $29.95, at age 12, with .50 cents down and .50 cents a week, no parental approval required. We call that the "good old days". Whoops, this thread is about WalMart.
Technosavant
Member
Stiletto-
Mine looks exactly like that. Remington's site says they made a special run of them back in 2000, but I am guessing that all current production ones are Wal-Mart only, but they don't even show in WM's online gun catalog. I highly doubt it is of any lower quality though- maybe a cheaper stock, but that doesn't really bother me at all. Just so long as it shoots well (too cold to try it out).
Mine looks exactly like that. Remington's site says they made a special run of them back in 2000, but I am guessing that all current production ones are Wal-Mart only, but they don't even show in WM's online gun catalog. I highly doubt it is of any lower quality though- maybe a cheaper stock, but that doesn't really bother me at all. Just so long as it shoots well (too cold to try it out).
JMusic
member
I doubt that Walmart would sell seconds as we know the word. Problem with Walmart is with their buying power. They can quickly become your largest customer. They are a demanding group. The tend to brow beat their venders for lower and lower prices. If a company allows Walmart to become aa large part of their buisness they quickly fall into Walmarts purchasing power and dictation. My bet is Ruger has to cheapen products sent to Walmart to keep the buisness. You get what you pay for. Many companies have been forced to bow to Walmarts wishes eventially going under.
Jim
Jim
- Status
