DPMS LR 308 or Armalite AR 10 or other?

[bobhaverford]

Looking for a semi-automatic .308 AR like rifle. Am leaning towards these guns because of accuracy and value per dollar spent. What are the pros and cons of these two manufacturers and which would you recommend. Are there others that you would recommend? What about the Bushmaster? Any thoughts would be appreciated.

 

[MechAg94]

Gun Tests recently tested the Armalite, Bushmaster, and DPMS. They liked the DPMS best.

 

[thereisnospoon]

Armalite

The Bushmaster has been deep-sixed, the DPMS is very accurate and all, but your limited to 10 rnd mags (at this time).

Armalite has good qaulity and has all the mags you want (although pricey).

Enjoy whichever you choose!

 

[P0832177]

The Bushmaster has been deep-sixed, the DPMS is very accurate and all, but your limited to 10 rnd mags (at this time).

Armalite has good qaulity and has all the mags you want (although pricey).

Enjoy whichever you choose!

There are 20rd DPMS 308 mags available, or you can uses SR25 mags for the Panther 308!

 

[IMtheNRA]

Can anyone post the text of, or provide a link to that article?

 

[gunsmith]

I have been thinking about getting a .308 too

I love gun test ...I just wish I knew more about guns- I am a subscriber but you have to buy the article and they send you a pdf or something...I don't like that...I may end up with a DSA .308...
In an earlier issue they reviewed DSA .308 against similar rifles.
To folks like me FAL's seem similar to AR's ...i.e a pistol grip, a mag that holds more then 10.
I think the difference is one is a blowback & the other one isn't...

(clearly I am not a gunsmith) but I have no idea what the difference means...gas fed? blowback? ..... huh?...I aim breathe sqeeze ...gun goes bang...

 

[bobhaverford]

Tried to get the text of the GunTest.com article but was unable to do so. Even if you're a member you have to pay for the back issues. They are stooooopid not to make those available for subscribers. I would have subscribed for a year had it not been for the fact that the archive is not made available.

The DPMS looks like a best buy to me. I like the idea of the 24" barrel but the weight is about 1.5 lbs more than the 18". I'm not sure exactly what you're giving up with the 18" barrel.

 

[TIMC]

I went through several rifles looking for a good Pig gun in .308 that was semi-auto. I bought a FAL, H&K G3 and a Bushmaster AR-10 flat top. I sold the G3 even though it was more accurate than the FAL but it was a pain in the rear to clean. The AR-10 was by far more accurate than the other two shooting 3/4" groups at 100 yards with Hornady 168 grain TAP ammo. I recently took a whitetail with a neck shot at 175 yards with it. I also like the fact that the Bushmaster uses FAL mags since I already had plenty of them. They still can be found even though Bushmaster has discontinued them. Topped with some nice optics you could have a very nice semi-auto .308.

 

[jem375]

I have heard nothing but good reports on the DPMS rifle.

 

[Father Knows Best]

I think the difference is one is a blowback & the other one isn't...

(clearly I am not a gunsmith) but I have no idea what the difference means...gas fed? blowback? ..... huh?...I aim breathe sqeeze ...gun goes bang...

Blowback = the recoil impulse drives the bolt back to cycle the action. In a pure blowback action, the bolt never locks up; only the force of the recoil spring and the inertia of the bolt keeps it closed. For that reason, it doesn't work with anything but the lowest power cartridges. The only true blowback guns I know of are .22LR autoloaders. The G3/HK91/CETME use a "delayed blowback" action, in that it uses a roller locking motion to keep the bolt closed until pressures drop, and then unlocks the bolt and lets the recoil cycle the action.

Gas = expanding combustion gases are diverted from the barrel to cycle the action. Most semiauto rifles are gas operated. There are two primary variants, the "direct impingement" and the "piston" types. In a direct impingement design (such as the AR15/M16 family), the gases are ported from the barrel to the action where they act directly on the bolt carrier. In a piston design (FAL, AK47, M1/M1A/M14), the gases push on a piston or "operating rod" that is connected to the bolt carrier.

 

[Father Knows Best]

I bought a FAL, H&K G3 and a Bushmaster AR-10 flat top. I sold the G3 even though it was more accurate than the FAL but it was a pain in the rear to clean.

Why was the G3 difficult to clean? Mine (a PTR-91) is very easy to clean -- much easier in fact than my FAL or any AR I have ever used. Unlike the AR, you don't have combustion gases venting into the action and mucking everything up. And unlike the FAL, M1A, AK, etc., you don't have a gas mechanism (piston, tube, etc.) to clean. You just pop the two pins that hold the buttstock on, slide it off, and draw the bolt and bolt carrier out the rear of the receiver. Then clean from the breach, just like a bolt gun or a FAL. Nothing could be easier.

The AR-10 was by far more accurate than the other two shooting 3/4" groups at 100 yards with Hornady 168 grain TAP ammo.

My PTR-91 really likes the Hornady TAP 168, too. I'm getting 3/4" 100 yard groups with it. With Lake City M118LR, I'm getting just a shade over 1 inch. My FAL (a DSA SA58) doesn't come close.

 

[NMshooter]

To my knowledge, if you want it for the bench DPMS, otherwise Armalite.

I would feel much better about my AR-10 if Armalite would get off their butts and come up with this new wonder magazine they keep hinting about.

 

[TIMC]

Why was the G3 difficult to clean? Mine (a PTR-91) is very easy to clean -- much easier in fact than my FAL or any AR I have ever used. Unlike the AR, you don't have combustion gases venting into the action and mucking everything up. And unlike the FAL, M1A, AK, etc., you don't have a gas mechanism (piston, tube, etc.) to clean. You just pop the two pins that hold the buttstock on, slide it off, and draw the bolt and bolt carrier out the rear of the receiver. Then clean from the breach, just like a bolt gun or a FAL. Nothing could be easier.

When the bolt and bolt carrier were removed the hammer raised up just enough to not allow the bolt to slide back in. I had to bend a long screwdriver to hold the hammer down and slide the bolt past it. It was just a pain to me. Maybe it was just the one I had but it was irritating.
All was worth putting me off enough to buy the AR-10, I am truly pleased with this rifle. With it topped off with a Leupold VXIII 6.5-20 LR scope it is a great hunter at any range.

 

[MechAg94]

To my knowledge, if you want it for the bench DPMS, otherwise Armalite.

I would feel much better about my AR-10 if Armalite would get off their butts and come up with this new wonder magazine they keep hinting about.

NMshooter, your post reminded me. I believe Gun Tests said the Armalite had the best balance of the three they tested. They recommended the NM trigger job though. Said the very heavy trigger made it difficult the shoot and probabyl hurt its accuracy in their testing. Same trigger recommendation for all three rifles by the way. They gave the Armalite a Buy It rating with the DPMS having a Best Buy rating. The Bushmaster was a Conditional Buy.

 

[esldude]

Of those have only used the Armalite. Very nice rifle, very accurate. But I thought it was too big a pain to clean. Same way that AR-15's are. Guess it just depends on what you get used to doing.

 

[Father Knows Best]

When the bolt and bolt carrier were removed the hammer raised up just enough to not allow the bolt to slide back in. I had to bend a long screwdriver to hold the hammer down and slide the bolt past it. It was just a pain to me. Maybe it was just the one I had but it was irritating.

The hammer shouldn't be in the way, because it shouldn't be on the gun at that point. On a HK91/CETME/PTR, as soon as you slide the backplate/buttstock off, the lower receiver (complete with FCG) can be removed. The lower receiver is hooked over a lip at the front, and is only held on to the upper by the backplate/buttstock assembly that you just removed. On a G3, there is a pin at the front instead of the ledge, but the result is the same because you just pivot the lower and FCG down and out of the way. That gets the hammer and any other FCG parts completely out of the way of the bolt carrier assembly.

All was worth putting me off enough to buy the AR-10, I am truly pleased with this rifle. With it topped off with a Leupold VXIII 6.5-20 LR scope it is a great hunter at any range.

Sounds nice. I'd love to get an AR-10 someday, but I'm kind of tapped out after buying the PTR-91 two years ago and a FAL this year. Maybe with next year's tax refund....

 

[NMshooter]

First AR-10 I ever shot was a 10TC, the short but heavy barrel was very handy, and without a muzzle brake it was not as loud as it could have been.

Accuracy was astounding, but the owner insisted on using a Trijicon Reflex II instead of the Leupold goodness I tried to talk him into...

I have to admit I really like this .308 better than all the others I have owned.

 

[MechAg94]

Does the DPMS use unique magazines or some other type?

 

[NMshooter]

The DPMS uses SR-25 magazines, which are made of unobtainium...

This is why folks are waiting for DPMS to start making their own.

 

[hkmp5g17]

Gun Tests recently tested the Armalite, Bushmaster, and DPMS. They liked the DPMS best.

Sorry- but I have to say this. Guntest sent me a free issue several years ago. They were testing full sized 9mm handguns. They tested Glock, the Walther P99 and I believe the Sig 226- and one or two more.

Apparently the P99 was a lemon-it was the only gun tested with jamming problems.

It still won (got more points) by virtue of aesthetics. They are supposedly unbiased- but HOW can you recommend buying a (malfunctioning)tool designed to save lives- JUST BECAUSE IT LOOKS/FEELS BETTER???

Take their advice with a grain of salt.

Anthony

 

[MechAg94]

Yes, you are getting their opinion. BUT, they were open in telling you about the jamming problems. They usually are pretty good about telling of the good and bad things and why they liked a gun. You can make up your own mind on the rest. Personally, I don't like it when they favor a really expensive gun over a cheaper gun that performed just as well. They do that sometimes.

For someone that does not get exposed to a lot of different guns, that mag is a good way to get real details on a lot of models.

What you said surprised me though. They usually like the Sigs. Was the P99 only jamming on some ammo?

 

[P0832177]

The DPMS uses SR-25 magazines, which are made of unobtainium...

This is why folks are waiting for DPMS to start making their own.

DPMS does make their own 20rd magazine, I have DPMS rifle in the safe with 3 DPMS metal mags, and yeah the SR 25 mags will work!

 

[hkmp5g17]

What you said surprised me though. They usually like the Sigs. Was the P99 only jamming on some ammo?

I honestly don't remember- it's been years. I think it was with several types of ammo.This was right after the P99 came out- I'm sure it was an"early production problem"

Anthony

 

[salty]

Depends on your pocketbook - the AR10T is a tried and true very accurate rifle. Few problems appear with the new production medels and they cost about $1700. Lifetime warranty. Dpms is a nice rifle that runs about $900. IMO the AR 10 is a nicer finished rifle however field function is similar for both. AR10's appear to be more of a priority for Armalite than 308's are for DPMS. Both companies offer technical support and stand beside their products. 20 round mags are available at about the same cost for both. Bushmaster is a dead horse - I have one and Bushmaster informed dealer's limited support will be available for them in the future.

 

[MechAg94]

My past reading of Gun Tests, I seem to remember they usually picked other guns over the P99. Lately, they love the Springfield XD pistols and mention them whenever they test full size plastic autoloaders. Oh well. I like the mag and have been getting it for several years.

I have always thought I wanted the Armalite AR-10B model that was supposed to be a copy of the orginal AR10. I never went much further as I really didn't have much use for the gun, I just wanted it.