Entry level bolt action question

[1948CJ2A]

I know the OP asked for entry-level guns but let me throw this thought out there.

A first deer rifle is special like a first girlfriend. I'm not sure how old the OPs nephew is but here's what I would do. Find a nice gently used example. I'd opt for a wood stock but different strokes for different folks. Something like a post 64 Winchester M70, Rem 700 ADL or BDL, or a Ruger M77. These could all be had for close to the same price as a new "cheap" rifle. IMO these are better rifles in terms of fit and finish.

I've heard the Axis rifles have such cheap plastic stocks to where they touch the barrel at times, which can certainly affect accuracy. I don't have anything negative to say about the Ruger American other than the style is not for me.

I do have 3 pre series 2 Vanguards and have been generally pleased with them, though their fit/finish is not quite up to the level of the aforementioned used rifle's I listed. They do seem to shoot quite well though.

 

[VoodooMountain]

Where can you find a Howa for $350? I will take 2. I know my sales reps don't cut me any breaks, but Howas wholesale more than $350

cheap howa 1500

Buds gun shop, dfw shooting sports and lord of war firearms, all have it at around $370. A few months ago there were more places selling them including mr gun dealer and sf armory.

 

[cdb1]

A Vanguard's action is a Howa, but the Vanguard has a different stock, trigger and barrel.

 

[highlander 5]

Friend bought a Savage not sure which model but paid $300 for it. Was there when he sighted it in 1 inch groups at 100 yds with factory ammo and 3 different handloads.

 

[Captcurt]

https://shop.whittakerguns.com/product/170

$329. They have other chamberings for the same price too.

Thanks. I need to find new distributors.

 

[Geno]

Walkalong:

Just an example from a quick local search of quality, used rifles:

Savage M111
.30-06 Sprg
Simmons 3-9
1 magazine
$319.00

http://shop.williamsgunsight.com/moreinfo.aspx?pid=029527&cs=/products.aspx&ai=M

Geno

 

[Arkansas Paul]

Would he be opposed to a used rifle?
I would certainly keep that option open.

As far as budget rifles, I hunt with a Weatherby Vanguard in .30-06 and it is the best $390 I've ever spent on a rifle. I think they are a little higher than that now though.

Also, I picked up a tang safety Ruger M77 in .243 Win used for less than that (I believe it was $359 IIRC). It had a cheap Bushnell scope that was replaced in short order with a Leupold VX1, but we actually killed a few deer with it with the cheapo on it. It is a great shooter and was an absolute bargain IMO.

 

[gamestalker]

Tell ya what, I've been working with a bunch of Ruger Americans, Rem. 770's, and Savage Axis's, and the Ruger gets my vote hands down.

I wouldn't touch a 770, they are what I consider a disposable gun, literally. And although the Axis has a very good action and barrel, the stock is straight up junk.

The entry level Wally World Mossberg isn't terrible, don't know what model number those are. I shot a couple though, and they will group pretty decently, good hunting rifle IMO. A buddy got his elk last year at almost 400 yds. with one chambered in .270 win..

But ya, an American will do the job very well. I've probably shot a dozen of them in various calibers over the last couple years, all grouped very well.

GS

 

[Walkalong]

He asked about new, no frills rifles. I can ask him about used rifles. They can definitely be a good option as you all know.

 

[maxxhavoc]

I'll go off thread a little, and suggest what I would do if any of my nephews were interested in the shooting sports.

Go into your collection, pick one with some meaning to it, and give it to him. If he still wants to buy one, fine. In 20 years though, that one will still be with him and as he gets older, it will mean more to him. Just make sure you get first refusal if he decides he needs money later. Chances are, you have an old girl in the safe who has not been used in many years that deserves to be a guy's first rifle.

Then buy yourself something nice to replace it.

On topic...Ruger American, T/C, Savage, good cheap bolt actions are everywhere these days. Just stay away from Remingtons...I used to love them, but I have 1 too many lemons in the safe.

 

[aubie515]

Howa makes the Vanguard for Weatherby...doesn't matter if they put a different stock on it, it's still a Howa.

Whoever said Savage/Stevens with accutrigger...the Stevens is not offered with accutrigger.

Savage Axis II is great option since it does come with accutrigger, but even if you get regular Axis, you can upgrade trigger down the road.

I say RAR if you want to keep it factory.

If your nephew wants to upgrade down the road Savage/Stevens 200 is best action to get started. Marlin X7 or XL7 copy Savage nut system, so you can use Savage pre fit barrels to caliber/barrel swap down the road. I believe Marlin X rifles use Winchester stocks though.

 

[CraigC]

I would probably opt for the Ruger American in a new rifle but would prefer to find a more traditional rifle on the used rack. CDNN has some really good deals on new Rugers.

http://www.cdnnsports.com/firearms.html?SID=los20oe8tuo2klqbhvkumqjf13&brand=2118&cat=14&limit=60

 

[Captcurt]

Patriot is nice.

I have had a few new Mossberg Patriots to check out. The synthetic models are decent. The triggers are adjustable but all have had some creep. Accuracy has been pretty good. The only thing that I don't like is the sloppy bolt. In the long actions the bolt has enough play that it could contact the comb of the stock. It doesn't do it on the short actions. The walnut stocked guns are really nice. If I wanted a wood stock the Patriot would be it. The Ruger American gets the vote for a plastic stock.

 

[Paladin7]

Very exciting times...a first hunting rifle!

I've personally found that most if not all entry level rifles need some TLC to get them shooting to my standards, again YMMV.

These manufacturers generally make a very competitively priced high quality action, but skimp on the stock, finishing and trigger.

If you buy a new rifle at the lower price points mount a good aftermarket stock, pillar bed it, free float the barrel, put in a Timney Trigger and invest in a good scope, like a Leupold, and you will have a very fine rifle that produces repeatable accurate groups.

If you don't want to invest in doing the work, then go for a used rifle that originally sold for more money. There are a lot of great deals out there, esp. at local gun stores.

As to caliber...for deer and varmints, a 7mm-08 or 243 Winchester would be a good first choice for someone younger.

Hope that helps!

 

[goon]

Yep, .243 is an under-appreciated round. I used to think anything less than .30 was for sissies, but it turns out I was an idiot about many things in my youth.

 

[greenmtnguy]

I've been considering selling or trading my old, early 70's vintage Savage 110 in 270 Win - not that it is a bad rifle, but mainly that it doesn't feed several of my favorite 150 gr factory loads well without jamming up or chewing the bullet point feeding from the magazine into the chamber. Other than that, it is a nice shooter, not in bad shape but won't win any beauty contests. If I did it, it would be with a Savage Axis with an accutrigger, or maybe a Ruger American. The only drawback I find with new bolt rifles these days is that so few of them have iron sights anymore - which is a good backup to have if your rifle drops or slides and puts your scope out of commission, and you are in the deep woods at deer camp for another day.

 

[Walkalong]

I talked with him last night, linked him to this thread, and he said used with a scope would be best for him, preferably around $350. *Sigh*

Yea, that's doable if he keeps an eye out, but gun season starts this weekend. Nothing like putting something off till the last minute.

I'll try to get him to borrow my .308 or .35 Rem and be patient looking for a rifle, although this is the wrong time of year to look for a bargain in a hunting rifle. I already gave my .44 Mag 94 to one son and my .30-30 94 to the other one. I have given my nephew an XD and an AR, but am down to two rifles suited to deer around here. The .458 would be a bit much.

Thanks for the ideas.

 

[SCgman]

My experience with buying a kid their first rifle is that they most likely will maintain a sentimental attitude toward the gun, one that they plan on keeping forever. So why not make it a quality choice that will serve as a standard of performance? Find a makers entry level rifle that offers the best reputation and value.

I tend to agree with the Howa/Vanguard recommendations, these are solid offerings for sure. I own each and have highly recommended these to first time buyers. I like the gripping texture of Hogue stocked Howas. The TC venture is a fine rifle and comes with scope bases, but I've never cared for the stock it comes in-too slick. I wonder if Hogue makes a replacement stock for it. My Icons came with Hogue stocks and handling has never been a problem.

 

[goon]

The reasons I'd suggest the Vanguard over others are little, yet important details.
It has a hinged floorplate and a steel magazine, with the follower being the only plastic part. The triggerguard is machined aluminum, not plastic. The stock is good and stout with no wobbling like the Savage bargain rifles. It is plain, but it's also not cheap. They are a quality rifle. I've had a few Savages, a Remington 700 ADL, an early Mossberg 100 ATR, and a Ruger Gunsite Scout. Of all of those, I think the vanguard is the best value. But I do wish it also had open sights and it is just a little heavy.

And I kind of want to try the .375 H&H Vanguard out next.

And I also want a .308 Ruger M77 at some point - blued, walnut, open sights. Passed on one and I've been kicking myself since.