Ethics......

[1911Tuner]

Brain Rot

Yep. That ol' Brain Rot/Reduced Mental Capacity thing is a fact. That's why when a 20 year-old says" Watch this!" the old codger stands back and says:
"Okay. You go ahead and I'll watch."

 

[sm]

I have fired folks in my life, and I have walked away from folks.

People don't always understand what I mean.

-Well known family, with OLD money. They did business with me, and I mean some big tickets for cash. Invited to hunt the properties. Plural.

Okay so I go to shoot doves in September, and one morning I head out, I see two farm truck heading down the road with fellas in the back, then I see the deer and the shots fired. I take my doves, and call this rich fella, and he says he'll take of it.

Then comes duck season, well I changed blinds after having a loaded 10 ga pointed at me by this rich fella, and all these folks in a HUGE blind were passing around fifths.
I did not have 4wd and had ridden in with another fella, so I waded to his blind and I'll be damned if a shot was fired and a deer is taken by that fella - out of season.

I let it be known I was not in agreement with this...
In return it was explained to me I was in the wrong...

Come to find out, rich fella being as "we got OLD money, and "My property" , just liked to ride around, drinking, and chasing whatever game, day or night, in season or not...and invited friends to do the same. Some of these folks were in politics, and well known business folks and ...

I got pissed. It was two hard miles of trudging in waders in that mud, but I made it back to where my vehicle was and changed clothes - that cold air felt good, I had worked up a sweat.

I never went back, and the next time he came in - it was like ice. Oh I took his cash, I was polite to his wife. She later divorced him after she found out about him and some what all he was doing, on the side, and not all legal either.

--Another rich fella, I will not say what he owned, would give him away. I cannot say how he was involved in game laws either...
He and his bunch, including game and fish, and leos took a huge amount of ducks, way over th elimit, did not use non-toxic shot, and all.
I had been invited, again as he was a customer of mine, and had been out to this high dollar duck club a week earlier.
He kept being a customer, and I never really said why I would not accept another invite from him. This had made papers all...
He invited to fly me to another state for hunting...I felt it best to decline that too.

These are the kinds of folks I fire and walk away from.

Now.

First dove hunt for some folks, first hunt too. Ladies and kids, a set of grandparents and parents.

Gotta 4 almost 5 y/o that needs assiting with a shotgun. I was determined this kid was going to fell a dove. We did the fun stuff and promises early in the hunt as I shared elsewhere.

"There is a dove in that tree". -kid
"Yeah, what do you think". - me
"Well this is exciting , different than just seeing them in the yard and everything. I wish he would fly , supposed to be flying to be ethical and all - right?" -kid
"Got any idea?" -me
"SHOO...SHOO" - kid

"He didn't fly off" - kid
"Must be a girl bird, girls don't pay attention to boys" - me

<bop! seems his mom heard that, laughing, still bopped me>

Grandpa fires a shot over that-a-way, safe shooting, just to get this dove to fly.

Now "In flight" means not being on a tree branch in my book, because that kid with me assisting took his first dove. Kinda like the dove spring-boarded and "bang".
Later...
Now the kid waited, and waited and this low incomer was coming straight at us, he did a perfect wait until last moment, and got that gun up and with me assisting popped that dove. He took about 7 steps and picked it up. Grin longer than the shotgun.

I have teased and warned the kids about giving dogs beef jerkey. Dog farts in a vehicle are worse than un-ethical, all the kids and moms agree on that.

 

[Rob1035]

At a public dove shoot yesterday (opening day here)[my first], my father and I got really frustrated with some shooters continuously shooting birds flying towards the treeline, who when hit would be carried by momentum in the ultra thick woods that would make a pro dog choke...wasted birds, highly questionable ethics. I held off on many many shots I probably would have made, but I'd rather have a lower "count" and no wasted birds.

 

[sm]

I like being at the "treeline" and having them suckers fall at my feet.
Actually...the idea is shoot them so you catch them.

I mean if'n yall want to walk out and look for birds and all fine...them farm roads near treelines were built for a reason...dat's where the doves are supposed to fall.

Might explain why I am outside of a duck blind too...you want to have 2 guys in a blind next to you spill coffee, have a greenhead fall on top of the blind 3 feet to your left.

They will also throw a perfectly good do-nut at you if you do it again

I best not type what-all they said , besides " would you quit doing that!"

Not my fault some folks can't shoot a shotgun...his dawg thought it was funny though...

 

[Dave McCracken]

Dove shoots are a place where the Bozo Factor rules. If there's a jackass in the lot, he'll be where he can sprinkle shot all over me.

Thanks, Ed for the explanation on chromosomes. We were talking about ethics, right?....

 

[Art Eatman]

Awful lot of "mosts" and "somes" in these talks about age and abilities.

I've "mostly" seen older guys do better with shotguns and rifles in claybird and hunting-style efforts. Younger guys, generally, do better in IPSC pistol stuff.

Until the advent of telemetry, older racecar drivers were usually the winners at Indy and Daytona. Older guys generally win on the pool table, too.

Seems like there are two curves at work. The first is supportive of Ed's claim, showing a decline (physical and mental) to begin at some age or ages. The other, however, considers knowlege, training and overall experience and really speaks to a person's effectiveness in, e.g., shooting or racing. This latter curve extends the "useful lifespan" of most people. Sure, the physical part degrades, but the mental part maintains.

Personal example: A Big Boss ordered a study done for a major engineering project, but it was to have a minimal environmental impact. I was about 43 at the time. It involved a canal of some twelve miles' length in coastal wetlands. I wandered by the office of the environmental geologist who was tasked with determining the least-impact route. I looked at his topo map, and pointed and said, "There's your route." Three months later, he showed up, puzzled. "How in hell did you come up with that, in ten seconds, and it took me three months?" I sez, "Simple. I know how to read a topo map, and I know something about the inter-relationship between flow of water and environmental impacts."

A lot of this hoo-hah about old folks ignores the aspect of memory of experiences through all those years and miles. And that while "some" old folks get old sooner than other old folks, "some" don't.

And "some" young folks encounter more experiences than others, which is why in later years "some" of us Old Farts can legitimately say, "Sonny-boy, I've forgotten more than you'll ever know..."

As long as you're interested in lifeitsownself and in continuing to learn, and as long as you can avoid boredom from excessive exposure to immature BS, your mind will do okay...

, Art

 

[sm]

Art,

You don't realize how sincere I am when I say "Thank You" for posting as you just did.

--

One of our members loaned me his copy of The Lost Classics of Robert Ruark

Ruark's works mean a lot to me. Art reminds me of the "Old Man" , and I mean that with a LOT of respect.

Ruark shares how the "Old Man" said he could tell a lot about a Man's ethics and character playing pool.

I was a wee brat when a Mentor and I were in another small town, one with the "town square" around the Courthouse, and the Geezers playing checkers.

"Checkers tells a lot about a man's self, see that fellow over on the bench, whittling, off to himself?"

"Yes sir" I replied.

"Before you were born, he got caught taking a deer out of season on another man's property. Now times were bad with his wife sick having just had another baby, one of the others kids sick and he just needed meat. Had he just fessed up, admitted wrong, and been humble about it, property owner and others might have pitched in to assist.

Instead he try to deny, and got all rowdy and punched the property owner.

Wife was shamed, kids too, folks did not shun them, they didn't know. Kids got bigger and moved off, Wife died, and that old boy is so lonely, just a matter of time before he just falls off that bench one day dead of a broken heart".

I still remember hearing them words, seeing that lonely old guy, and the others having such a fun time with 'serious checkers'.

 

[ezypikns]

Thanks Dave......

.....for a very timely post.

I don't want to hurt anyone's feelings, but has anyone seen those recent outdoor shows depicting dove hunting in South America. I realize the shooters may be hunting completely within the laws of their host country, but shooting 100 to 200 birds in an afternoon seems a bit greedy.

 

[sm]

ezypikns,

Others that have gone can better explain than I. It is my undertstanding, there are "too many" birds for habitat. It is being ethical to take those limits as they are overrun with birds and it does support the economy.

I want to go so bad. I want to get into it where I melt the barrels off a shotgun the wood stock catches fire and I have to use another shotgun to continue on and repeat.

 

[IDriveB5]

good post dave, i always appreciate reading them.

be sure and lemme know if you have a thursday or saturday off; been a while since ive seen you out at PGC.

 

[Dave McCracken]

You're welcome,ezy. A note about Argentina....

I've not been there, but a number of people I know have. Universally, they talk about clouds of birds that eat the crops. One estimate was 25 million in the area around Cordoba where lots of those shows are done.

Universally, the meat gets used. Lots of Argentines live near the poverty line.

As for the ethics, it may be less ethical to NOT shoot as much as possible IF the birds are that dense.

Ted Kerasote is both a hunter and a Buddhist. His book, "Bloodties" has lots of stuff about ethical predation and balancing populations. I recommend it.

Some of those hunters in Cordoba take 1K birds a day. Sounds to me like work, not fun....