"European" Mag Release vs Button-On-Grip

[w_houle]

To me, the best design is the H&K P-30

Agreed, it's a true ambi system that is rather intuitive , although the "1911 style" is probably simpler to manufacture. I don't know about durability. The problem with the "European system" appears to be that it takes to hands to swap magazines. It also looks to work best with magazines lengths that allow the bottom of the magazine to engage the catch; making higher capacity magazines either impractical to impossible.
Then there's the magazine button at the bottom heel of the grip. I only have seen them on some Berettas and Lorcins, but they are the most annoying of all systems. Oh, and if you're left handed

 

[Pilot]

I can relaod my HK P7 PSP just as fast as other guns and I know where my mage is, (in my hand). Same with the Makarov. I prefer the heel release on my P7 for carry over my P7M8's release.

To each his own. To bash this system and pistols that use this system is really not very classy.

 

[Sam1911]

To bash this system and pistols that use this system is really not very classy.

Is there bashing going on? The OP asked:

Has anybody taken the time to drill like crazy with both styles and then compare their speed etc? What kind of problems might one encounter with re-deployment?

He's getting some very good answers, too. I think we can give factual (and even subjective) statements of positives and negatives without resorting to "bashing."

 

[SwampWolf]

Quote:
The heel release is undoubtedly slower and more fumble-prone.

Correct on the first. Not on the second.

You're exactly right, earlthegoat2.

 

[dovedescending]

Fight One: Speed
Winner: 1911-style release

Fight Two: Reliability
Winner: European release

Fight Three: Ambidextrous-ness
Winner: European release

Fight Four: ??????
Fight Five: ??????

Best 3 out of 5 wins my undying affection

 

[stu454]

(this should put the cat among the pigeons)

I see no downside to pistols with the Euro magazine release for the armed civilian. You're not kicking down doors to crackhouses or raiding an Al Queda stronghold. If you think that any civilian who is competant with a firearm and carrying an original P7 or SIG 220 is undergunned then you're deluded.

Most folks don't need to be as highspeedlowdrag as they think they do.

 

[dovedescending]

Most folks don't need to be as highspeedlowdrag as they think they do.

But the highspeedlowdrag-er you are the better, I would think.

 

[earlthegoat2]

I see no downside to pistols with the Euro magazine release for the armed civilian.

I agree here. It all comes down to getting used to it though. The majority of pistols today have the side release button so that is predominantly what American are used to. Id does not take long to get used to a bottom mag release but it is undoubtedly slower.

The HK P7 style is nice because you actually make a motion of pushing into the grip with your thumb as your curled index finger is pulling down in the (extended and serrated) mag floorplate. This is faster than the heel release of say a Ruger MKII or Walther P38 where you have to actuate a lever on the bottom of the magazine itself and push it away from the grip of the gun to the rear and then try and pull out the magazine.

The P7 release is more ergonomic and faster and is really in a league of its own in the world of the European heel mag releases.

The two pistols I commonly use are the P7 and Browning Hi Power. If you have experience with the Hi Power and the dreaded magazine safety then you know that the mag safety rides along the magazine as it is in the mag well and hinders it from dropping free when it is empty. Since I used the P7 first and grew accostomed to using both hands to release the magazine I quickly warmed right up to the Hi Power and its inability to drop its magazine in the fashionable way. ( I have my magazine interlock in place on my Hi Power).

This is just an example of being able to readily transfer from one pistol to another with different magazine detachment methods. Given your choice of pistols, your mileage is certain to vary.

 

[w_houle]

Isn't there two types of mag drop: One that lets the mag free fall, and the other drops it a certain length and then you have to pull it out the rest of the way.

 

[SwampWolf]

A few pistols have magazine "brakes" (the stock CZ being an example) which keeps the magazine from falling freely after the mag disconnect (regardless of its location) is depressed. Most shooters don't like this "feature" and, fortunately for them, it's easily defeated. Personally, it doesn't matter that much to me either way. A reload is accomplished a little faster with a pistol having no brake. The magazine has less of a chance of being inadvertently ejected and lost with a pistol having a brake.