FAL Failure to feed, need help

[walking arsenal]

My FAL, an old L1A1, is having trouble stripping rounds from it's magazines.

I'm guessing it might be the recoil springs though they feel pretty strong to me.

I can't figure out what else it could be.

Even with five rounds in a mag when I pull the charging handle back and let it go . the bolt just hangs up on the round.

I have five mags for it and it does the same thing with each of them.

any ideas?

 

[Ash]

Has it always done this or is it a new phenomena? What kind of receiver does it have? Does it do it when firing, too? Does the round stay firmly in the magazine or does it jam against the feed-ramp?

Ash

 

[walking arsenal]

CIA/Imbel reciever

Does it less on firing.

Doesn't look like the feed ramp has anything to do with it.

 

[Bwana John]

Any problems feeding before this?

If new, have rails been polished? Are the cases scratched longatudally?

What does bolt face look like?

Does the round stop with the bolt still behind it, or are you gettind a bolt over base stoppage?

Doesn't look like the feed ramp has anything to do with it

That is where I would start.

 

[walking arsenal]

Any problems feeding before this?

Some

If new, have rails been polished? Are the cases scratched longatudally?

No, the rails have not been polished. yes the cases are scratched lengthwise, I'm assuming from the mag feed lips.

What does bolt face look like?

Looks normal.

Does the round stop with the bolt still behind it, or are you gettind a bolt over base stoppage?

With the bolt behind it.

 

[Deer Hunter]

My STG58 does that occasionally with some mags. But usually it's just me "riding the bolt" forward with my hand. If I don't let it go completely, it wont go into battery completely.

 

[Bwana John]

Check to make sure both recoil springs and the recoil spring plunger are present first, BUT...

I think you will find that the underside of the feed rails need to be radiased.

Run your finger on the underside of the rails, if they are sharp or square they need to be polished.

This is normal on most new receivers, normal wear does it after a couple of thousand rounds.

Some folks will go as far as changing feed rail geometry, check out Giilliiee's suggestions on the FAL files for letting the rounds feed without ever hitting the feed ramps.

I would suggest just polishing the rails first.

I use a popcycle stick that I glue wet-dry paper to. Mask all surounding surfaces to prevent hitting anything other than the underside of the feed rail.

Hopefully W.E.G. will come along with some pictures of what you need to do.

 

[walking arsenal]

Pics

 

[Vic303]

Have you replaced the magazine springs? Maybe they are a bit weak...

 

[Bwana John]

double tap, see next post

 

[Bwana John]

First of all, the rails look sharp. Look at the underside of the rails in the top picture, see the brass?

Second of all, if that is a Imbel receiver then sombody Bubbaed the feed ramp. Imbel feed ramps should have two ramps on either side which create a "widows peak" look. Yours has a "unibrow", and by the looks of it a aftermarket unibrow.

 

[Ash]

If the rounds are not being stripped from the magazine and not jamming against the feed ramp, it isn't that - though the Imbel feed ramp is as Bwana says. This seems to have the unibrow which does cause feeding issues (but that assumes the rounds make it at least partially out of the magazine).

Ash

 

[walking arsenal]

Hmmm.

yeah, your right.

I noticed that too, after i bought it.

It didn't look like that was the problem at first but I've been playing with the gun since I started this thread and I think that the "unibrow" may be causing the problem after all, or at least part of it maybe.

Think there is a way to fix it?

 

[Bwana John]

Polish the underside of the rails first. Many Century receivers have the unibrow and they work just fine. I believe even the Issy receivers had a unibrow.

If that dosent help find Giilliiees posts on FAL Files about changing feed rail geometry. Im warning you now he is the worst writer there is. But he does know how to make a FAL feed and eject well.

 

[walking arsenal]

HA!


Ok, I'll check it out. I think I still remember my password over there.

 

[AndyC]

I didn't have the feed-problems you have, but widening the rails slightly (the thin, flat section directly above the mag-lips) allowed my rounds to pop up from the mag sooner - making them go almost directly into the chamber with no need to hit the feedramps.

File & test, file & test - it's not easy to put metal back.

 

[walking arsenal]

I tried widening the rails today.

It seems to have helped.

Now when I pull back on the charging handle and let it fly I get a positive sounding "Sclack" instead of a "scha-schlack".

Meaning, the bolt doesn't seem to be pausing on the way forward.

I also put some JB bore cleaner on the slide rails and cycled the bolt carrier a bunch.

This cleaned up the rails a bit too.

I'll test fire it later this weekend and report back then.

 

[goon]

If it persists, check out the mag catch.
I just had to have one custom fitted to a FAL in "perfect" working order that I bought on here a couple months ago to make it run.
Seems OK now.

 

[WinchesterAA]

If I understand the problem right, the bolt stops at trying to push the round into the chamber?

Sounds like the recoil spring is on the weak side, and maybe the magazine spring is on the strong side...

 

[AndyC]

I tried widening the rails today.

It seems to have helped.

Now when I pull back on the charging handle and let it fly I get a positive sounding "Sclack" instead of a "scha-schlack".

Meaning, the bolt doesn't seem to be pausing on the way forward.

That's what I experienced too when I did it to mine. I also polished off most of the parkerizing on the rails to remove anything which could cause drag - now the bolt flies forward freely, making a "Ching!" sound instead of "Grrrrr...chunk"

Full credit to member ggiillllieeee (or however the heck he spells it) over at FALFiles.com

 

[iamkris]

Is that a TAPCO top cover? Does the rifle have issues feeding with the top cover OFF?

I had a buddy that had a R1A1 from Century that has given him no end of trouble...biggest issue was the out of spec top cover that bound up and dragged on the bolt. Take it off it worked fine.

We replaced the top cover with a standard one and 75% of his problems went away.

 

[El Tejon]

In which position is the gas?

 

[Bwana John]

If it persists, check out the mag catch.

He is not getting BOB stoppages which many times are caused by ejector blocks being installed too low(Entreprise), making the mag sit too low, and fixed by building up the tip of the mag catch, and/or replaceing the bolt because bolt face is worn on the bottom.

Sounds like the recoil spring is on the weak side, and maybe the magazine spring is on the strong side...

The cause is too much friction in the system, the springs "are" causing the problem because they are not helping the friction, but I will bet they are not the fix, the fix will be eliminating the extra friction the sharp rails are causing as the round slides aganst them and the bullet nose on the ramp. I find just radiasing and polising the lower side of the rails and polishing the feed ramp(s) eliminates most of the problem. Some other things that will elimanate friction is making sure the recoil springs raceway and the inside of the mag body is free of of old grease and dirt.

Is that a TAPCO top cover?

The FAL was not designed for a scope mount and aftermarket scope mounts are known for tying up the action.

In which position is the gas?

As friction is elimanated from the system you will find you need less gas to operate the action reliably.

I tried widening the rails today.

I am a little leary of opening the rails all the way to match the magazines feed lips, I know it will run faster and I have had to do it to one FAL to get it to work (Entreprise). Go very slow, sombody on the FAL files just used this method and went too far, bubbaing up a brand new DSA receiver.

I do like GGGiiillliiieeessssssss(?) method of changing the angle on the ejector to make ejecting brass not smack the receiver, but eject strait out with out "kissing" anything.

 

[walking arsenal]

Is that a TAPCO top cover? Does the rifle have issues feeding with the top cover OFF?

Yes it is a tapco cover. But I dont think it's causing any problems. There are no wear marks on the cover to indicate that it's dragging on the bolt carrier.

In which position is the gas?

Currently it's set on 4.

 

[powermad]

Are the cartridges scratched up?
On mine the cases were actually creased from the rail. Even after rounding and polishing them the cases were still getting marked up. So I took ggiilliiiee's advice and opened up the rails. Now I can rest the bolt against the the base and release it and it will chamber.

http://community-1.webtv.net/ggiilliiee/GGIILLIIEESRAIL/

Here is mine. With 20 rounds in the mag it doesn't take much pressure to get the round into the chamber.



Feeds soft point ammo now too.