Hey guys still pretty new to THR and I need help choosing between the 2 rifles above. This is going to be my first rifle and I dont want to mess it up lol. I have done alot of research on THR and also other places. I am leaning towards the FAL because im a lefty and I heard alot of good things about it, and more people choose the FAL over the PTR. But my main worry is the price I want to get the DSA SA-58, but my limit is $1,220 and not a penny more. I know they have a STG-58 which is the Austrian version but I heard parts are hard to come by. I also know that Century but I had bad experience with them. I like the PTR but a little more difficult to use for a lefty. I really need help choosing, and if yall know a site where I can get a SA-58 for around $1,220? Thank yall for the help I really appreciated it.
FAL OR PTR-91 Please Help
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Mikee Loxxer
Member
Do you plan on reloading? If so I would choose the FAL, but then again I have two SA58s and really like them.
W.E.G.
Member
I believe you will find parts for either gun to be relatively abundant right now.
Between the two, FAL parts are probably more abundant.
I think the FAL is more user-friendly in every regard, from shooting, to cleaning, to servicing and to customization.
The only advantage the CETME-pattern guns have right now is cheap magazines.
There are so many HK-built CETME mags on the market, they can hardly GIVE them away.
Price for CETME-pattern mags is 99 cents apiece.
Between the two, FAL parts are probably more abundant.
I think the FAL is more user-friendly in every regard, from shooting, to cleaning, to servicing and to customization.
The only advantage the CETME-pattern guns have right now is cheap magazines.
There are so many HK-built CETME mags on the market, they can hardly GIVE them away.
Price for CETME-pattern mags is 99 cents apiece.
I've always been a fan of the PTR's, the manufacturer is practically in my back yard...but more than that I feel the rifles are very solid and a better than the original reproduction. I haven't been able to cough up the ching for one yet but anyone I know that has is happy with there's. That said, I feel the PTR prices are getting too steep especially for the accessorized versions.
Mikee Loxxer
Member
The only reason I asked whether or not you planned to reload is because of what the PTR-91 will do to cartridge cases. Sounds like you like the FAL. In my opinion the only thing the PTR-91 has over the FAL is less expensive magazines. Go for the FAL you won’t be disappointed.
Is a .308 semiauto really the best choice for a first rifle? Before you drop $1200 on what you think is what you want, buy something cheap and get the hang of things. You may decide you want a different gun or caliber. Nothing wrong with the guns you're looking at, but it seems like overkill for a first gun. Even a $100 Mosin or a 10/22 will keep you busy for a while.
@ zhyla Your right on getting a cheaper rifle and moving up and i might get a .22 in the future. But I want to get a reliable .308 if the SHTF rifle. Also I'm getting this rifle as a gift and want to take this opportunity to get it while I can.
Maverick223
Member
I like the PTR-91 pretty well, but it isn't balanced well, so I prefer the FAL. Both are very good designs, and generally exhibit excellent reliability and ruggedness (though the advantage in this category probably goes to the FAL). OTOH if you are striving for better than average accuracy the PTR is probably a better choice.
iamkris
Member
Here's my synopsis of your choices
FAL
Pro
HK91/G3/PTR91
Pro
Based on my experience
FAL
Pro
- reliable design
- full power cartridge
- extremely good ergonomics
- cheap mags
- extraordinarily easy to break down, field strip, clean
- adjustable gas system
- sights are adequate but better A2 style sights exist
- triggers not known to be great but they can be improved
HK91/G3/PTR91
Pro
- reliable design
- full power cartridge
- cheap mags
- somewhat easy to break down, field strip, clean
- sights are adequate
- no bolt hold open
- abysmal ergonomics - safety selector is near impossible to reach, cocking handle is in terrible place, mag release is hard to reach
- Triggers are absolutely horrible but they can be improved
Based on my experience
Z-Michigan
Member
I owned a PTR-91 for about a year, traded it and have never once missed it. I have posted my complaints with the design numerous times and will be accused of having a vendetta if I do so again.
I own both an STG-58 and an SA-58. While it's cool that DSA makes an SA-58 with all new parts, the STG-58 models are terrific shooters with comparable parts quality (the Austrians know a thing or two) and I would not hesitate for one millisecond to get a DSA-built STG-58 as a really nice FAL.
Having said that, as of about 3 weeks ago, DS Arms had a limited batch of FALs built from IMBEL parts kits (VG to excellent) with IMBEL hammer-forged barrels, on DSA type I receivers, for under $1000 dealer cost. Assuming they still have some, that would be an even better deal than their STG-58 if you have a friendly dealer who will order one and not mark it up too much.
If after reading these comments you are still thinking about a PTR-91, please go to their website, the technical info page here:
http://ptr91.com/techinfo.html
And read their warranty and repair policy and their statement about ammunition. Then compare their statements about ammunition with comments you may find here and elsewhere on the net. That should finalize your decision for you.
I own both an STG-58 and an SA-58. While it's cool that DSA makes an SA-58 with all new parts, the STG-58 models are terrific shooters with comparable parts quality (the Austrians know a thing or two) and I would not hesitate for one millisecond to get a DSA-built STG-58 as a really nice FAL.
Having said that, as of about 3 weeks ago, DS Arms had a limited batch of FALs built from IMBEL parts kits (VG to excellent) with IMBEL hammer-forged barrels, on DSA type I receivers, for under $1000 dealer cost. Assuming they still have some, that would be an even better deal than their STG-58 if you have a friendly dealer who will order one and not mark it up too much.
If after reading these comments you are still thinking about a PTR-91, please go to their website, the technical info page here:
http://ptr91.com/techinfo.html
And read their warranty and repair policy and their statement about ammunition. Then compare their statements about ammunition with comments you may find here and elsewhere on the net. That should finalize your decision for you.
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'Note: If a rifle is returned to us for feeding and extraction issues and it is determined that the cause was due to use of the above listed ammunition, gunsmithing, ammunition, and return shipping will be charged to the customer,,,'
"We only provide warranty work. If you have a rifle in need of repair and it is out of warranty, you should contact a gunsmith who specializes in H&K rifles."
The new owners are certainly not the old owners now are they,,,
DSA reworked and rebarrelled a less than stellar Century Arms L1A1 rifle I owned several years ago.
The work was quickly and expertly performed and the rifle became a reliable and accurate shooter.
While I didn't keep the weapon, I have continued to do business with DSA and can recommend them as a top notch outfit.
"We only provide warranty work. If you have a rifle in need of repair and it is out of warranty, you should contact a gunsmith who specializes in H&K rifles."
The new owners are certainly not the old owners now are they,,,
DSA reworked and rebarrelled a less than stellar Century Arms L1A1 rifle I owned several years ago.
The work was quickly and expertly performed and the rifle became a reliable and accurate shooter.
While I didn't keep the weapon, I have continued to do business with DSA and can recommend them as a top notch outfit.
I forgot to add,
My PTR is an A prefix numbered gun.
All the guts on my gun are US made including the cocking handle.
I replaced the crap US made stocks and handguard with good quality German made H&K furniture.
If you do this, check your fire control parts and change anything "Furrin" with American made parts.
The US made cocking handle is kind cheesy and I would prefer to have an H&K, Portugese, or Reinmetall cocking handle but alas, my gun would become an illegal and evil weapon if i were to do that.
Same thing goes for replacing the PTR barrel with a German made barrel.
I bought my PTR back when they were $750 and before the company became greedy and annoying.
My PTR is an A prefix numbered gun.
All the guts on my gun are US made including the cocking handle.
I replaced the crap US made stocks and handguard with good quality German made H&K furniture.
If you do this, check your fire control parts and change anything "Furrin" with American made parts.
The US made cocking handle is kind cheesy and I would prefer to have an H&K, Portugese, or Reinmetall cocking handle but alas, my gun would become an illegal and evil weapon if i were to do that.
Same thing goes for replacing the PTR barrel with a German made barrel.
I bought my PTR back when they were $750 and before the company became greedy and annoying.
PsychoGlory
Member
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After handling several PTR 91 rifles and months of researching different rifles pros and cons I decided to get a PTR 91. The only problem with them is you might have problems with the lowest quality surplus ammo that has tar sealant that makes the ammo water proof, gums up the flutes. All commercial and most surplus work flawless through them. Accuracy is very good through the ones I fired about 1-2 moa. Fit, finish and assembly quality is excellent. All I need is a little bit more money and I will order one for myself.
I have handled and fired both and the G3 type(PTR 91) rifles are better balanced. G3 type have a center balance to them where the FAL are more forward balanced, but I am biased I loved my fathers Sar 8 but he sold it several years ago.
I have handled and fired both and the G3 type(PTR 91) rifles are better balanced. G3 type have a center balance to them where the FAL are more forward balanced, but I am biased I loved my fathers Sar 8 but he sold it several years ago.
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If you have your heart set on a .308 I would go to a gun store or gun show and handle each for starters.
Then I would research it some more.
$1200 for a FAL??
$775 shipped.
not my ad
http://www.falfiles.com/forums/showthread.php?threadid=293020
Then I would research it some more.
$1200 for a FAL??
$775 shipped.
not my ad
http://www.falfiles.com/forums/showthread.php?threadid=293020
#61 on my list of 100 FAQs.
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FAL vs. HK91
61. The question of which is better frequently comes up. IMO both are good designs and either will do what most shooters want to do with a military-style 7.62 rifle. I own both and like them both but there are some differences. To me the FAL feels sleeker and faster handling but this is subjective. The 91 seems sturdier but again this could just be my perception. The 91 is hard on cases, battering them during ejection. Also, for some reason the 91 is horrendously loud with a real sharp report. The FAL is a tad longer and to me the grip angle is not as natural as that on the 91. The bottom line is that all of the differences are relatively minor and I could happily live with either if limited to one. If I had to choose, I would likely pick the FAL but it would be very close. I have no experience with any of the various “clones” of these rifles as mine are genuine FN and HK products so I cannot comment on the quality of the other makes.
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FAL vs. HK91
61. The question of which is better frequently comes up. IMO both are good designs and either will do what most shooters want to do with a military-style 7.62 rifle. I own both and like them both but there are some differences. To me the FAL feels sleeker and faster handling but this is subjective. The 91 seems sturdier but again this could just be my perception. The 91 is hard on cases, battering them during ejection. Also, for some reason the 91 is horrendously loud with a real sharp report. The FAL is a tad longer and to me the grip angle is not as natural as that on the 91. The bottom line is that all of the differences are relatively minor and I could happily live with either if limited to one. If I had to choose, I would likely pick the FAL but it would be very close. I have no experience with any of the various “clones” of these rifles as mine are genuine FN and HK products so I cannot comment on the quality of the other makes.
Uncle Mike
Member
Having both, I seem to prefer the FAL 10 to 1!
Maverick223
Member
Good choice, though I wouldn't discount an Imbel kit from a well reputed builder, especially if that option leaves you some cash for optics, accessories, and/or ammunition.
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