I have a FAL- Imbel receiver from Pacific Armament Corporation I bought 2 years ago. I like the cartridge, ease of disassembly, cheap magazines, and reliability. However, I am considering getting rid of it. Why? Everytime I shoot it, it batters my cheek bone. The gas setting is at 1, so it cannot get it any lower. Now for anyone who may think I am too weak, I regularly shoot 375 H&H, 416 Rigby, 458 Win Mag, and 458 Lott and can hit what I aim at. Because of the recoil, I tend to jerk the rifle to the right and as such, most shots go in that direction. I find it hard to believe that all FAL's do this. So, is this common for you other FAL shooters out there, or is this unique to my rifle? I hate to get rid of it, but if shooting 100 rounds feels like getting punched in the cheek 100 times, forget it!
FAL problem
- Thread starter GI Joe
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Is it an M444 sporter?
Some of the early models had a really bad muzzle brake (made by Hesse--who else?) that, by all accounts, actually increased the felt recoil considerably.
I don't have a link, but there is a forum called the FalFiles. If you post this question there, they should be able to help you out.
Some of the early models had a really bad muzzle brake (made by Hesse--who else?) that, by all accounts, actually increased the felt recoil considerably.
I don't have a link, but there is a forum called the FalFiles. If you post this question there, they should be able to help you out.
Post your ? at http://www.falfiles.com , click on the message board, and you can find your answer.
Nightcrawler
Member
I don't like a wood stock on a FAL because unless you have a perfect cheek weld, it's like getting smacked in the face.
But It's not nearly so bad as you describe. I'd suggest the FAL Files for a good info.
Considered a cheek pad of some kind? It might help.
But It's not nearly so bad as you describe. I'd suggest the FAL Files for a good info.
Considered a cheek pad of some kind? It might help.
My FAL had a straight combed STG-58 stock that battered me. Really uncomfortable. A Penguin stock helped a lot, much more ergonomic.
The brake that John mentioned would push the muzzle down sharply on each shot, levering the stock up into the shooter's cheekbone. Ouchie.
A gas setting of "1" directs the most gas against the piston, causing the greatest felt recoil. Turn the gas regulator up until the bolt fails to lock open on an empty magazine, then turn it back down 2 clicks. If your gun won't function reliably at a higher gas setting, there's probably a leak somewhere in the system.
The brake that John mentioned would push the muzzle down sharply on each shot, levering the stock up into the shooter's cheekbone. Ouchie.
A gas setting of "1" directs the most gas against the piston, causing the greatest felt recoil. Turn the gas regulator up until the bolt fails to lock open on an empty magazine, then turn it back down 2 clicks. If your gun won't function reliably at a higher gas setting, there's probably a leak somewhere in the system.
standingbear
Member
if it wont cycle on any of the other settings,you might also consider a dsa piston.i have the very same gun as mentioned and the dsa muzzle brake and dsa gas piston cured the problem(also the same problem..lol)
re: gas setting
Thanks for the replies. I assumed just the opposite about the gas setting- the lower the better. I will adjust it the next time at the range. Like I said before, the recoil is not bad at all on the shoulder, just against the cheek bone. The stock is synthetic so that should not be too bad. Hopefully, that will make a huge improvement in accuracy too if I can concentrate on shot placement rather than bruised jaw!
Thanks for the replies. I assumed just the opposite about the gas setting- the lower the better. I will adjust it the next time at the range. Like I said before, the recoil is not bad at all on the shoulder, just against the cheek bone. The stock is synthetic so that should not be too bad. Hopefully, that will make a huge improvement in accuracy too if I can concentrate on shot placement rather than bruised jaw!
Mikul
Member
My FAL used to do that to me. I came home with a yellow cheek on several occasions. The stock is too short for me, so I put in insert between the stock and buttpad to get it right. I haven't had a problem since.
If you're a tall guy, this is probably your problem.
If you're a tall guy, this is probably your problem.
Destructo6
Member
Try pulling your face a little further away from the rear sight. It's not intended to be a nose's distance like an AR.
It's the shape of the stock that beats you up, not the material (at least, not that I know of...)
Is your stock kinda straight, like the STG:
Or more contoured, like this:
The first stock is the one I had, and it pounded me every time. I switched to the second type, and it's just dreamy.
(Thanks to www.tapco.com for the pics. Buy something, they're cool!)
Keith
Member
That's interesting about the stock design. My G1 has the second style and I get very little recoil and no "stock slap".
If the person having cycling problems also has a G1, the easiest cure is to bore out the gas hole to a slightly larger diameter - takes about 5 minutes and can be done with any drill.
The diameter of that hole was enlarged in all subsequent versions because they found that as the gun aged, various small leaks were bound to occur in the gas system. enlarging the hole eliminates all of those problems and the rifle will never hiccup again. Much simpler than always fussing with the gas system.
It's been a while, but I *think* the correct diameter is 7/64ths. You'll want to confirm that on Falfiles before you go drilling away. Stick a .25 wood dowl down the bore before you drill. When you see wood chips coming out, you're done.
If the person having cycling problems also has a G1, the easiest cure is to bore out the gas hole to a slightly larger diameter - takes about 5 minutes and can be done with any drill.
The diameter of that hole was enlarged in all subsequent versions because they found that as the gun aged, various small leaks were bound to occur in the gas system. enlarging the hole eliminates all of those problems and the rifle will never hiccup again. Much simpler than always fussing with the gas system.
It's been a while, but I *think* the correct diameter is 7/64ths. You'll want to confirm that on Falfiles before you go drilling away. Stick a .25 wood dowl down the bore before you drill. When you see wood chips coming out, you're done.
I don't see a lot of difference between the stocks, but mine is pretty straight. I did take it to the range today and got rained out after 20 rounds. I cranked the gas to highest setting and it did not eject spent rounds until I set it at 3. And, even at the highest setting, it still battered my cheekbone. I'm considering trying to get a new FAL with hopefully a proper gas system and stock. Anyone know what the best place to get them would be?
Keith
Member
As I related, you can fix the gas problem in five minutes by boring out the hole to the proper diameter. It's just a small "bug" in the original design that was corrected later.
I'm assuming you have a rifle built on the G1 style.
Also, you can buy a new stock for very little money, or simply scallop the top with a sander to match the original design. I think these stocks with the straight edge along the top must be something that was tossed on later, after the original Belgian designed stocks wore out or got damaged.
The nice thing about FAL's is that they are very easy to fix without paying a gunsmith, so don't be afraid to go for it!
Keith
I'm assuming you have a rifle built on the G1 style.
Also, you can buy a new stock for very little money, or simply scallop the top with a sander to match the original design. I think these stocks with the straight edge along the top must be something that was tossed on later, after the original Belgian designed stocks wore out or got damaged.
The nice thing about FAL's is that they are very easy to fix without paying a gunsmith, so don't be afraid to go for it!
Keith
Tapco is the best source of FAL parts. Buy a Penguin stock and a stock removal tool from Tapco - take Keiths advice on the gas porting - and your problem will probably be fixed for under $50. If you're dead set on a new rifle -they can be had at DSA for a grand or so.
SodaPop
member
Boing- is that stock any longer than the STG one? Does it come with a rubber butt pad on it? Is the stock any fatter at the butt?
Was it a pain to change?
I'm holding my credit card............................
The only thing I hate about FALs are the stocks.
Was it a pain to change?
I'm holding my credit card............................
The only thing I hate about FALs are the stocks.
nemesis
Member
I've been shooting various FAL's for 30 years and don't actually understand the many comments about "recoil". It is a heavy rifle and the seven-six-two is not a particularly powerful round.
The FAL, as with most rifles, demands to be held in tight to the shoulder at firing or it will have space to accelerate back into the shoulder. A proper hold will cure this.
Also, one thing that is often mistaken for recoil is the uncomfortable slam when the rat hits the stop in the frame. The easiest way around that is to add a recoil buffer. It only takes ten seconds to install and makes a world of difference. Adjust your gas properly, get a solid hold on the rifle and install a recoil buffer.
I should add that I have a pre-ban L1A1 which I shoot often and frequently shoot several hundred rounds a day with no discomfort.
The FAL, as with most rifles, demands to be held in tight to the shoulder at firing or it will have space to accelerate back into the shoulder. A proper hold will cure this.
Also, one thing that is often mistaken for recoil is the uncomfortable slam when the rat hits the stop in the frame. The easiest way around that is to add a recoil buffer. It only takes ten seconds to install and makes a world of difference. Adjust your gas properly, get a solid hold on the rifle and install a recoil buffer.
I should add that I have a pre-ban L1A1 which I shoot often and frequently shoot several hundred rounds a day with no discomfort.
Soda-
The Penguin stock is the same length as the STG stock, and it doesn't appear to be significantly wider at the butt. The buttpad and sling swivel are not included, and the STG buttpad doesn't quite fit the Penguin stock.
Installation is easy, as long you're ready for the recoil springs to come flying out. I loosened the nut with a regular screw driver, then ran a T-handled .22 caliber cleaning rod through it, into the recoil spring tube, to keep the springs under control. If you've ever removed the buttstock, you'll know what I mean. Don't forget the little screw near the receiver, and you'll have to make a hole for it in the new stock.
I know LOP and buttpad surface area are problems for you, so I don't know if the Penguin stock will help. But for me, it's like shooting different rifle. The first few trips out, I thought I was a wuss for be punished by the recoil of the 7.62 in the soft-shooting FAL. When I changed the stock, all that went away.
Note: the stock shown on Tapco's site here is Penguin's Premium stock. It's trimmed of any mold lines and bead blasted to a nice finish. I got the cheaper economy set, which is just the same stock without the trim and bead blast. I ordered online direct from www.humpbackstock.bigstep.com . Some people have reported slow transactions and difficulty contacting the owner, but my purchase was fast and trouble-free.
The Penguin stock is the same length as the STG stock, and it doesn't appear to be significantly wider at the butt. The buttpad and sling swivel are not included, and the STG buttpad doesn't quite fit the Penguin stock.
Installation is easy, as long you're ready for the recoil springs to come flying out. I loosened the nut with a regular screw driver, then ran a T-handled .22 caliber cleaning rod through it, into the recoil spring tube, to keep the springs under control. If you've ever removed the buttstock, you'll know what I mean. Don't forget the little screw near the receiver, and you'll have to make a hole for it in the new stock.
I know LOP and buttpad surface area are problems for you, so I don't know if the Penguin stock will help. But for me, it's like shooting different rifle. The first few trips out, I thought I was a wuss for be punished by the recoil of the 7.62 in the soft-shooting FAL. When I changed the stock, all that went away.
Note: the stock shown on Tapco's site here is Penguin's Premium stock. It's trimmed of any mold lines and bead blasted to a nice finish. I got the cheaper economy set, which is just the same stock without the trim and bead blast. I ordered online direct from www.humpbackstock.bigstep.com . Some people have reported slow transactions and difficulty contacting the owner, but my purchase was fast and trouble-free.
I have an IAI M444 (IMBEL) and experienced exactly the same thing you did.
I am going to guess that you have a Hesse muzzle brake that resembles the IMBEL flash hider. It should have 2 rows of 3 ports at 0100 and 1100. The ports are drilled at an angle.
Assuming that this is the brake you have then your problem is not the stock it is the brake. It can be reduced with another stock but not eliminated. This brake actually levers the stock up into your cheek.
Here is how I fixed mine. THe first thing I did was to take my dremel and open up the existing ports. Now, instead of circular ports drilled at a 45 degree angle I have oval ports at a 90 degree angle. That improved things but did not totally alleviate the problem. I then drilled 4 more ports into the brake. 2 were at 0300 and 2 were at 0900. That completely fixed the problem.
My FAL is now a pleasure to shoot. If you would like pictures or more help drop me an email.
I am going to guess that you have a Hesse muzzle brake that resembles the IMBEL flash hider. It should have 2 rows of 3 ports at 0100 and 1100. The ports are drilled at an angle.
Assuming that this is the brake you have then your problem is not the stock it is the brake. It can be reduced with another stock but not eliminated. This brake actually levers the stock up into your cheek.
Here is how I fixed mine. THe first thing I did was to take my dremel and open up the existing ports. Now, instead of circular ports drilled at a 45 degree angle I have oval ports at a 90 degree angle. That improved things but did not totally alleviate the problem. I then drilled 4 more ports into the brake. 2 were at 0300 and 2 were at 0900. That completely fixed the problem.
My FAL is now a pleasure to shoot. If you would like pictures or more help drop me an email.
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