The Bushmaster
Member
I'm impressed
Isn't that amazing Mr. Quest. They can play nice...Outstanding people. My hats off to ya.
Isn't that amazing Mr. Quest. They can play nice...Outstanding people. My hats off to ya.
Favorite / Best Reloading Equip
- Thread starter mugsie
- Start date
- Status
I think people are way to paranoid about powder charges than they need to be.
If you use a powder that fills the case (most rifle charges are close to compressed.. and may be compressed for MAX loads).
Its hard with pistol cartridges... as 5 grains looks pretty lonely in a .45ACP case.
The greater danger is UNDERcharging..
I do believe that the fixed cavity powder measures are the safest way to go. Unless its broke you cannot get the wrong charge (if you run out of powder how is that the measures fault?)
If you use a powder that fills the case (most rifle charges are close to compressed.. and may be compressed for MAX loads).
Its hard with pistol cartridges... as 5 grains looks pretty lonely in a .45ACP case.
The greater danger is UNDERcharging..
I do believe that the fixed cavity powder measures are the safest way to go. Unless its broke you cannot get the wrong charge (if you run out of powder how is that the measures fault?)
BluesBear
member
I don't see people being paranoid about powder charges. It's simply a matter of grave concern.
Overcharging IS a very serious consequence especially in handgun cartridges.
For undercharging to be dangerous you have to get down into the not-enough-velocity-to-clear-the-muzzle range.
Actually the most danger occirs when people load MAX loads. It is at that point where bullet seating depth becomes critical. In fact ANY change in components or procedures becomes critical when dealing with MAX loads.
But then there will always be those who insist on living life precariously on the edge.
Overcharging IS a very serious consequence especially in handgun cartridges.
For undercharging to be dangerous you have to get down into the not-enough-velocity-to-clear-the-muzzle range.
Actually the most danger occirs when people load MAX loads. It is at that point where bullet seating depth becomes critical. In fact ANY change in components or procedures becomes critical when dealing with MAX loads.
But then there will always be those who insist on living life precariously on the edge.
The Bushmaster
Member
HUH?? What does that have to do with loading equipment??
BigDog(RE)
Member
- Joined
- Apr 6, 2005
- Messages
- 39
If you use primer tubes...
Then the Frankford Arsenal Vibra Prime is a great tool! For $30 it is a real time saver when it comes to filling up primer tubes.
Then the Frankford Arsenal Vibra Prime is a great tool! For $30 it is a real time saver when it comes to filling up primer tubes.
fineredmist
Member
The first order of business is to understand the loading process. Buy, read and understand the contents of a loading manual (I find the Lyman to be the easiest). Once you learn the basics, THEN buy the best equipment you can afford. Lee and Dillion make fine presses and they will work IF you read and understand the manuals. Both companies will give you great service so don't be affarid to call them with questions. You have to take this one step at a time and you will make mistakes so LEARN from them. Remember, the only dumb question is the one you DON'T ask.
The requirements for ammo used in IDPA shooting are very different that competitive Bulls Eye shooting so keep that in mind. IDPA doesn't require 1" groups at 50 yds so you load accordingly.
Learn the basics and be prepared for alot of trial and error. If you stay with the mid ranger load data, loading length in the "cook books" you can't go wrong.
The requirements for ammo used in IDPA shooting are very different that competitive Bulls Eye shooting so keep that in mind. IDPA doesn't require 1" groups at 50 yds so you load accordingly.
Learn the basics and be prepared for alot of trial and error. If you stay with the mid ranger load data, loading length in the "cook books" you can't go wrong.
Well I made a purchase
Thanks for all the helpful information. After a ton of research I broke down and purchased a Dillon 550B. I got the .38 / .357 dies for now, soon to get a 45 (when I purchase the pistol). I bought the press from Graf and paid just over $300 for the press less the dies and shell plate (hey - they gotta hook us somehow!). I expect it to arrive next week so be prepared for more detailed reloading questions. The people I purchased it from were very helpful also. Seems like a great community out here. Thanks again people!
Thanks for all the helpful information. After a ton of research I broke down and purchased a Dillon 550B. I got the .38 / .357 dies for now, soon to get a 45 (when I purchase the pistol). I bought the press from Graf and paid just over $300 for the press less the dies and shell plate (hey - they gotta hook us somehow!). I expect it to arrive next week so be prepared for more detailed reloading questions. The people I purchased it from were very helpful also. Seems like a great community out here. Thanks again people!
LAH
Member
Mugsie I think it's great you're starting with a progressive. If you've done the readin' and understand loading, why not start out with what you will want on down the road?
The 550 Dillons are hard to beat. If you want self indexing there's a couple different ones that do that. I've got or used most makes over the years except for Redding. About all of them are good enough but I'm partial to the big blue. I have 3 and a 4th on the way. Also have a couple Lyman's and one RCBS & a Lee. My advise is free, get the best you can afford, you won't be sorry.
Creeker
The 550 Dillons are hard to beat. If you want self indexing there's a couple different ones that do that. I've got or used most makes over the years except for Redding. About all of them are good enough but I'm partial to the big blue. I have 3 and a 4th on the way. Also have a couple Lyman's and one RCBS & a Lee. My advise is free, get the best you can afford, you won't be sorry.
Creeker
drannor
Member
That's the same setup I started with a couple years ago. (550B & .357/.38) You will not be disappointed.
As already stated, make SURE to read a good loading manual or two before starting, I found the Speer manual to be a great asset. The tip about loading one round at a time to start with is also insightful, it took some bent brass and screwily seated bullets before I got the drill down.
ENJOY!
As already stated, make SURE to read a good loading manual or two before starting, I found the Speer manual to be a great asset. The tip about loading one round at a time to start with is also insightful, it took some bent brass and screwily seated bullets before I got the drill down.
ENJOY!
LAH & Dranner
Thanks for the helpful words. Interestingly enough I purchased the Speer manual with the set. After all the reading I did and listening on the forums, I agree with you LAH - go now for what I'm going to want down stream! I'll only always wish I would have bought it in the first place and would have always wondered if it was me or the press had I gotten the Lee. I figured since everyone talks so highly of Dillon - most probnlems would be me!
Another question I was having was why the different powders? I realize burn rates and all, but if one powder yiends 35,000 psi, and another powder yields 35,000 psi, is the bullet going to know. All it sees is 35,000 psi bushing on it's butt! Any thoughts?
I also realize I need to change the primer pick up when it arrives. Since I'm reloading 38 / 357, they take the small pistol primers and it comes set up for large pistol - guess I'm going to get an education right out of the box! Nothing like jumping in with both feet.
So Drannor - you like it? It does all you want? Are the ads correct - can it crank out a few hundred rounds per hour?
Thanks for the helpful words. Interestingly enough I purchased the Speer manual with the set. After all the reading I did and listening on the forums, I agree with you LAH - go now for what I'm going to want down stream! I'll only always wish I would have bought it in the first place and would have always wondered if it was me or the press had I gotten the Lee. I figured since everyone talks so highly of Dillon - most probnlems would be me!
Another question I was having was why the different powders? I realize burn rates and all, but if one powder yiends 35,000 psi, and another powder yields 35,000 psi, is the bullet going to know. All it sees is 35,000 psi bushing on it's butt! Any thoughts?
I also realize I need to change the primer pick up when it arrives. Since I'm reloading 38 / 357, they take the small pistol primers and it comes set up for large pistol - guess I'm going to get an education right out of the box! Nothing like jumping in with both feet.
So Drannor - you like it? It does all you want? Are the ads correct - can it crank out a few hundred rounds per hour?
LAH
Member
A 550 Dillon can be quite fast, it's the new operator that's slow. And rightly so. Loading is like drawing a sixgun from a holster, make haste slowly. Remember you must lean to load first.
I'll let someone answer the powder question..........Creeker
I'll let someone answer the powder question..........Creeker
Thanks LAH, I've got a lot to learn! Many lifetimes ago I was a soldier in the US Special Forces. I spent 68 and 69 in Nam. When I finally got out I moved away from shooting, raised a family and got on with my life. Now, many years later, my younger son gave me his service revolver (9mm), and I joined a local club in order to get some shooting in. I discovered I loved it all over again and just how much I missed it! I have since bought a couple of other hand guns and now want to move full tilt into shooting once again (hey - ya never know when I'll be called upon to help some muslims visit allah! The sooner this country realizes we're in a war for our very survival the better off we'll all be!). So here I am with a new press, which hasn't been delivered yet, and I'm ready to go. I've got lots of questions and a ton a patience so this is going to be loads of fun. Remember, it's the journey that counts - not the destination. I do appreciate all the help everyone has given me. When they complain, I don't listen to the details but to the tone - it gives me a lot of information into the product capabilities. When they tell me how good something is I do the same thing. I'm a quick learner. I'm glad I chose the Dillon and I know I'm going to be happy with the equipment, having no regrets that "I should chose ....".
Later....
Later....
redneck2
Member
Just remember, at first load one round at a time start to finish. Load a minimum of 50 that way. You'll be a LOT happier
drannor
Member
Mugsie,
I am very pleased with the Dillon. I load three pistol calibers on it currently, and keep two spare toolheads setup so I can rapidly change from .45ACP to .44MAG to .357MAG. Some folks make a big deal out switching the primer system I find it takes me a couple of minutes. (After a fair amount of practice!)
When I transition to loading rifle it'll be another learning experience. Case lube, deburring, case trimmers, etc, etc. I'll probably use the press like a single stage for rifle rounds to guarantee thoroughness.
I can crank out somewhere between 300 - 400 pistol rounds an hour on the 550 when I hit my stride. This did require some tweaks to my Dillon setup though. I highly recommend the following mods:
Strong Mount - gets the Dillon up off the bench and allows for mounting of accessory trays, brackets, etc.
Roller Handle - eased operation for me over the standard ball unit
Bullet Tray - puts the bullets close at hand
Empty Case Bin - by getting another bracket you can mount a empty case bin in front of the finished cartridge bin. Again, easy access to components
Spare Primer Tubes - I load up 3-5 primer tubes before I start loading so I can quickly reload the primer system
I usually buy from Brian Enos's site:
550 Accessories
If you scroll to the bottom of this page you'll see a 550 on the strong mount, with roller handle, bullet tray, and empty case tray. This is pretty much my setup.
I am very pleased with the Dillon. I load three pistol calibers on it currently, and keep two spare toolheads setup so I can rapidly change from .45ACP to .44MAG to .357MAG. Some folks make a big deal out switching the primer system I find it takes me a couple of minutes. (After a fair amount of practice!)
When I transition to loading rifle it'll be another learning experience. Case lube, deburring, case trimmers, etc, etc. I'll probably use the press like a single stage for rifle rounds to guarantee thoroughness.
I can crank out somewhere between 300 - 400 pistol rounds an hour on the 550 when I hit my stride. This did require some tweaks to my Dillon setup though. I highly recommend the following mods:
Strong Mount - gets the Dillon up off the bench and allows for mounting of accessory trays, brackets, etc.
Roller Handle - eased operation for me over the standard ball unit
Bullet Tray - puts the bullets close at hand
Empty Case Bin - by getting another bracket you can mount a empty case bin in front of the finished cartridge bin. Again, easy access to components
Spare Primer Tubes - I load up 3-5 primer tubes before I start loading so I can quickly reload the primer system
I usually buy from Brian Enos's site:
550 Accessories
If you scroll to the bottom of this page you'll see a 550 on the strong mount, with roller handle, bullet tray, and empty case tray. This is pretty much my setup.
LAH
Member
mugsie, thanks for your service. Did mind 68-71, all none combat. Glad you're back into shooting, nothing like it, same for loading. You said:
I've got lots of questions and a ton a patience so this is going to be loads of fun.
If you have patience you'll have no trouble. Loading isn't like going to the moon. Sure there's a learning curve but there's nothing what so ever hard about loading ammo...........Creeker
I've got lots of questions and a ton a patience so this is going to be loads of fun.
If you have patience you'll have no trouble. Loading isn't like going to the moon. Sure there's a learning curve but there's nothing what so ever hard about loading ammo...........Creeker
LAH,
I appreciate the thanks, but truth be told I was doing what I really enjoyed so it really wasn't work! Anyway - I received a call from Grafs today (I purchased from them) and they said they recieved in my Dillon but the outside box was damaged by UPS (bless thier little souls!) and would I accept it in the damaged box if they too 10% off?! Duh - send it on out baby! So it'll be shipped tomorrow and I should have it early next week. First thing I'll do is take it out of the damaged box, throw the box in the garbage and send a nice thank you to UPS! I'm like a little kid on Christmas and can't wait. I was thinking about purchasing a second set of dies and conversion kit for the .357 so I can quickly change over - do you think it's worth it or are the changes fairly easy once I start learning what I'm doin?
Oh - thank you too for your service. It matters not if we were in combat or not, just the fact that we served.
Later....
I appreciate the thanks, but truth be told I was doing what I really enjoyed so it really wasn't work! Anyway - I received a call from Grafs today (I purchased from them) and they said they recieved in my Dillon but the outside box was damaged by UPS (bless thier little souls!) and would I accept it in the damaged box if they too 10% off?! Duh - send it on out baby! So it'll be shipped tomorrow and I should have it early next week. First thing I'll do is take it out of the damaged box, throw the box in the garbage and send a nice thank you to UPS! I'm like a little kid on Christmas and can't wait. I was thinking about purchasing a second set of dies and conversion kit for the .357 so I can quickly change over - do you think it's worth it or are the changes fairly easy once I start learning what I'm doin?
Oh - thank you too for your service. It matters not if we were in combat or not, just the fact that we served.
Later....
LAH
Member
I was thinking about purchasing a second set of dies and conversion kit for the .357 so I can quickly change over - do you think it's worth it or are the changes fairly easy once I start learning what I'm doin?
mugsie the change from one to the other is simple. The sizing die stays the same. The expander/powder funnel will need backed out of the toolhead or it will over expand the 357 case mouth when set for 38 Special. This is the hardest part.
The bullet seating punch will have to be backed out along with the crimp die. These are very easy to adjust.
Still if you plan to shooting lots of both cartridges and changing back and forth a extra set up would be worth while but for me I'd rather buy a large stock of brass for each and not have to change the loader but once in a while. Just me two.........LAH
mugsie the change from one to the other is simple. The sizing die stays the same. The expander/powder funnel will need backed out of the toolhead or it will over expand the 357 case mouth when set for 38 Special. This is the hardest part.
The bullet seating punch will have to be backed out along with the crimp die. These are very easy to adjust.
Still if you plan to shooting lots of both cartridges and changing back and forth a extra set up would be worth while but for me I'd rather buy a large stock of brass for each and not have to change the loader but once in a while. Just me two.........LAH
DDIGeek
Member
Mugsie,
Her is my two cents. It will probably depend more on how long, how much, and what you intend to load.
If your reloading is likely never to be more than a couple hundred 38/357 rounds at a time, two-three times a year. I'd go with a Lee. Your friends are right, it is a good value. You can probably get by with the Lee Pro 1000 rather than the Loadmaster. Once set up properly (this is not all that hard) it will do a great job and last your lifetime.
I started with a RCBS rockchucker, added a LP 1000 and loaded 1000's of good 45 acp and 38 special rounds. When my shooting picked up I bought a Star Universal for the 45ACP work. The Star is a gem but only worth the cost if you plan on loading a lot.
I have used the Dillon's. They are marvelous equipment. But, like all cash outlays you may need to justify that kind of expense. If you absolutley must load rifle and pistol ammo on the same progressive, your options are much more limited. You should probably look seriously at the high-end of the Dillons.
Her is my two cents. It will probably depend more on how long, how much, and what you intend to load.
If your reloading is likely never to be more than a couple hundred 38/357 rounds at a time, two-three times a year. I'd go with a Lee. Your friends are right, it is a good value. You can probably get by with the Lee Pro 1000 rather than the Loadmaster. Once set up properly (this is not all that hard) it will do a great job and last your lifetime.
I started with a RCBS rockchucker, added a LP 1000 and loaded 1000's of good 45 acp and 38 special rounds. When my shooting picked up I bought a Star Universal for the 45ACP work. The Star is a gem but only worth the cost if you plan on loading a lot.
I have used the Dillon's. They are marvelous equipment. But, like all cash outlays you may need to justify that kind of expense. If you absolutley must load rifle and pistol ammo on the same progressive, your options are much more limited. You should probably look seriously at the high-end of the Dillons.
TooTaxed
Member
I've gone to the Hornady L&L Progressive, after testing reloading on friends' Dillons and Lees.
If your heart is set on a Dillon, you can find lots of them second-hand at great pricing, including all accessories, on EBAY auctions.
That said and done, I recommend that in order to learn the reloading process new reloaders start out with a single stage...say the Lee Reloader (pistol only) or Lee Challenger ($30 at Midway), plus quality powder measures and scales (second-hand is fine) with calibration weights (Lee scales and mesures not the easiest to use...Perfect powder measures leak fine powders) and a Lyman Reloading Manual. Once you learn the process, it's easy to move up to a progressive.
Single stage presses are very easy and inexpensive to switch calibers...Progressives are expensive to switch. I load high quantity ammo on my progressive, and the infrequently shot stuff on my single stage. I can run batches of cases through the various reloading operations (except powder charging, which requires full attention) on my single-stage while watching TV...the progressive requires full attention start to finish.
If your heart is set on a Dillon, you can find lots of them second-hand at great pricing, including all accessories, on EBAY auctions.
That said and done, I recommend that in order to learn the reloading process new reloaders start out with a single stage...say the Lee Reloader (pistol only) or Lee Challenger ($30 at Midway), plus quality powder measures and scales (second-hand is fine) with calibration weights (Lee scales and mesures not the easiest to use...Perfect powder measures leak fine powders) and a Lyman Reloading Manual. Once you learn the process, it's easy to move up to a progressive.
Single stage presses are very easy and inexpensive to switch calibers...Progressives are expensive to switch. I load high quantity ammo on my progressive, and the infrequently shot stuff on my single stage. I can run batches of cases through the various reloading operations (except powder charging, which requires full attention) on my single-stage while watching TV...the progressive requires full attention start to finish.
Peter M. Eick
Member
When I look over my equipment, about 80% of it is RCBS, including all of the presses and all of the "big" gear. Mostly this was driven by a desire for heavier duty equipment then other manufacturers.
The rest is MTM (all of the cartridge boxes) Dillon, Redding and Lee dies for anything I could not buy in RCBS at the time.
All of the hand tools are Sears Craftsman except the die wrench which is RCBS.
Over the years, I have been most disappointed with my Lee investments as they tend not to last. For example my hand primer press is at least the third one. They just break over about 4 or 5 years of heavy use. The rest of the gear seems about the same quality. I don't really see that the redding dies are any better then the dillons.
My only suggestion is chose carefully and research (use the search button) a lot.
The rest is MTM (all of the cartridge boxes) Dillon, Redding and Lee dies for anything I could not buy in RCBS at the time.
All of the hand tools are Sears Craftsman except the die wrench which is RCBS.
Over the years, I have been most disappointed with my Lee investments as they tend not to last. For example my hand primer press is at least the third one. They just break over about 4 or 5 years of heavy use. The rest of the gear seems about the same quality. I don't really see that the redding dies are any better then the dillons.
My only suggestion is chose carefully and research (use the search button) a lot.
robertbank
Member
You get a 550 and your grand children will thank you. I am sure there are presses like Hornady, & RCBS that are just as good as a Dillon but at then end of the day they aren't Dillon. If funds are tight and going to be for a long time then go Lee but it will cost you more in the long run cuzz eventually you are going to buy a Dillon, Hornady or RCBS.
Take Care
Take Care
bcominos
Member
I've got a Dillon 450... Older than dirt, works like a charm! The customer support for my 2nd hand press has been nothing short of phenominal!!! If you can find one of these 2nd hand, jump on it!! you can always upgrade it to a 550 down the line! Dillon Rocks!!
+1 on what "YellowLab" said: "The plain fact is that ALL the presses are GOOD. They ALL make quality ammo... IF THE MONKEY PULLING THE LEVER KNOWS WHAT THEY ARE DOING." The fact is that the reloading industry in this country offers a magnificent range of equipment in a whole range of price /performance. Just don't ever forget that YOU are the critical factor in reloading.
Don't believe any of the rhetoric that you need to plunk down a thousand dollars to get started. Instead, do what several other posters have suggested and EDUCATE that monkey! Get at least one comprehensive reloading manual (ABC's of Reloading, Speer, Lyman, Hornady, Lee, etc.) and read it until you understand it. Then start slow, and if you have questions, try to find an experienced reloader who will show you, hands-on, how to do something, or haunt forums like this- they can be helpful.
Don't believe any of the rhetoric that you need to plunk down a thousand dollars to get started. Instead, do what several other posters have suggested and EDUCATE that monkey! Get at least one comprehensive reloading manual (ABC's of Reloading, Speer, Lyman, Hornady, Lee, etc.) and read it until you understand it. Then start slow, and if you have questions, try to find an experienced reloader who will show you, hands-on, how to do something, or haunt forums like this- they can be helpful.
sm
member
Couple of buddies that reload metallic.
Hey - I had as many as 11 MEC reloaders running at the same time for Shotgun shells in all 4 gauges...I was busy.
I do the shot shells, they do the metallic.
Called working smarter not harder. Now that I am semi -retired from reloading shot shells [read, I use other folks MECs set up] I still have buddies...
I'm also the guy that his gun buddy says " you need your gun inspected and cleaned?".
He cleans my guns, I go shoot the ones he is building or fixing.
Ya'll are working way to hard on this Reloading and Gun cleaning stuff.
"Why I am cleaning your gun and reloadiing shot shells that you will shoot too" A student will ask.
"That is how my mentors taught me..."
Hey - I had as many as 11 MEC reloaders running at the same time for Shotgun shells in all 4 gauges...I was busy.
I do the shot shells, they do the metallic.
Called working smarter not harder. Now that I am semi -retired from reloading shot shells [read, I use other folks MECs set up] I still have buddies...
I'm also the guy that his gun buddy says " you need your gun inspected and cleaned?".
He cleans my guns, I go shoot the ones he is building or fixing.
Ya'll are working way to hard on this Reloading and Gun cleaning stuff.
"Why I am cleaning your gun and reloadiing shot shells that you will shoot too" A student will ask.
"That is how my mentors taught me..."
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