Firing a DA revolver in SA mode

[Rexster]

I have generally fired DA revolvers in DA mode, since 1983, when I started buying revolving pistols. The reason I started buying those DA revolvers was because I was in the recruiting/application process, about to start a police academy, and then attending he academy. I knew that I would be required to fire every training, “qual,” and line-of-duty shot in DA mode, so, there was no point in doing much thumb-cocking. I had a 1911 pistol, with which I could fire SA to my heart’s content. (Edited to add: I was required to use only an S&W L-Frame in the academy training, and then use only DA revolvers during my first year of sworn service, on and off the clock. After that rookie period, I could use a variety of autos, but if using revolvers, I still had to use them only in DA mode.)

Plus, on many DA revolvers, that have hammer spurs, the spur is not really large enough, or well-placed, to nicely facilitate thumb cocking. A well-designed Single Action Sixgun will usually have a hammer spur that facilitates thumb-cocking. None of this caused me any angst, because I learned to really like DA sixgunning.

My major reason for cocking the hammer of a DA revolver, since about 1990, has been to shoot S&W N-Frame revolvers, because my index fingers are not really long enough to reach the N-Frame’s trigger, for optimal DA mode shooting, while holding the grip properly centered in my hand. Until then, I had been using a slightly offset hold, which was NOT healthy for the joints in my thumb, hand, and wrist. I only kept one N-Frame, and have kept it largely in honored retirement, because it had served as a duty handgun, for San Antonio PD, and then as my personalized-owned duty handgun, working for Houston PD, so, its parts were getting a bit loose. Gently cocking the hammer ensures proper lock-up, for the occasional shots fired, for old times’ sake.

I have a Colt Official Police, an older-model Colt DA revolver, which has factory grips that do not facilitate finger placement for DA shooting, but work well for SA shooting. When simply shooting one-handed, for fun, it makes sense to cock the hammer, with this Colt. I do not require that this one “work” for a living, so DA shooting is not important.

I did not start buying SA revolvers until the mid-Nineties, when I wanted to resume firing big-bore sixgun ammo, though this time the milder-pressure .45 Colt. Notably, as my hands age, long-stroke DA trigger pulls may become more difficult. This is already starting to happen, with my right hand, which has prompted me to take my Single Action sixgunning more seriously, when firing my SA revolvers.

 

[d2wing]

Not much to add, I have SA and DA pistols, I shoot mostly SA out of habit. I shoot more Semi-auto pistols now days and most are hammerless. It just takes practice whichever way you shoot.

 

[.38 Special]

I have DA revolvers which have almost never been fired DA. Things intended for hunting, precision, long range, etc.

I also have DA revolvers which have almost never been fired SA. Things intended for defense, speed, etc.

The only argument I would have on the topic is with people who say they should always be fired one way or the other. Otherwise, I guess the OP pretty much summed up the whole topic in his own post, and the rest of us are just beating the dead horse.

 

[Pat Riot]

For years I was into Cowboy Action Shooting. For years all my but one of my revolvers were SA. I did buy a S&W 442 in ‘97. I bought my first “hammered” DA in 2012. A S&W 327 Night Guard. Shooting it DA was strange. It took me a while before I wasn’t embarrassingly inaccurate with it.
Later I bought more DA revolvers. I shoot them all DA and SA. About 50/50. The day I realized that I was comfortable shooting DA was the day I was shooting a CAS match. I drew my first revolver, took aim and pulled the trigger. Nothing happened. I squeezed the trigger again and someone shouted “Hammer”,
That was a “Duh” moment, but it dawned on me as I was clanging steel that I was learning to appreciate shooting my revolvers double action.

 

[cfullgraf]

I have shot my DA/SA revolvers in SA mostly.

Near 2000, I bought an S&W Model 642, a DAO j-frame revolver. A few years later, I bought a Model 442.

I decided I needed to get proficient shooting DA with the DAO j-framed. It took about a year of practice to get reasonably proficient at short ranges. Good enough for self defense. I like using the 642 and 442 for carry at times.

This practice has helped with shooting a DA/SA semi-auto handgun. I also like my H&K P30SK with the DA/SA trigger.

Learning to shoot DA takes more effort than shooting SA.

 

[hawg]

I grew up on single actions. It's second nature for me to cock a hammer first. I own five DA revolvers but I've fired very few DA rounds out of them. I've owned one DA semi auto, a Glock. I sold it without even firing half of a mag out of it. I have no need or desire to learn to shoot DA

 

[Smokin Gator]

Most people I see shooting DA revolvers who don't compete shoot SA. Shooting ICORE for years all of the very good shooters shoot DA only including the targets with the black xring on the tombstone targets. Occasionally you'll see someone who shoots DA only but they take so long staging the trigger they might as well thumbcock the hammer and shoot SA. Very slow.

 

[drobs]

I find hitting what you are aiming at with a DA takes practice, and a lot of it. It's easier to shoot SA with a DA revolver.
I find I shoot DA better with a 6 shot revolver vs a 5 or 7 shot revolver. It's easier for me to stage the trigger in DA on a 6 shot revolver.

If you don't reload, outside of 22LR you really need to look at the cost of revolver ammo. 38 special still hasn't recovered to pre-covid prices. All the other revolver calibers are also expensive. I think the reason you see a lot of shooters shooting SA with a DA revolver is... they haven't put the practice (round count) into DA shooting. Plus it's more enjoyable to shoot SA in a DA revolver for most people. Tight groups are fun.

I frequently will shoot DA with my Model 17 S&W 22LR revolver. A large handful of 22LR stuffed in my shirt pocket makes for a fun afternoon of shooting.

You might ask yourself, why a DA revolver over an SA revolver? Reloading a DA revolver is a lot faster than a SA.

 

[doc hamer]

I find hitting what you are aiming at with a DA takes practice, and a lot of it. It's easier to shoot SA with a DA revolver.
I find I shoot DA better with a 6 shot revolver vs a 5 or 7 shot revolver. It's easier for me to stage the trigger in DA on a 6 shot revolver.

If you don't reload, outside of 22LR you really need to look at the cost of revolver ammo. 38 special still hasn't recovered to pre-covid prices. All the other revolver calibers are also expensive. I think the reason you see a lot of shooters shooting SA with a DA revolver is... they haven't put the practice (round count) into DA shooting. Plus it's more enjoyable to shoot SA in a DA revolver for most people. Tight groups are fun.

I frequently will shoot DA with my Model 17 S&W 22LR revolver. A large handful of 22LR stuffed in my shirt pocket makes for a fun afternoon of shooting.

You might ask yourself, why a DA revolver over an SA revolver? Reloading a DA revolver is a lot faster than a SA.

true when it comes to reloading. da is faster especially with a swing-out cylinder as oppose to a loading gate. unless it is a top break like the schofield.

 

[luzyfuerza]

For gun games and recreation, I shoot revolvers in both SA and DA modes. I own SAO, DAO, and DA/SA revolvers and I like them all.

But the revolvers that I carry and train with for defensive purposes are all double action only (DAO). That is that the parts of the hammer used to cock these guns to SA (the spur and the SA notch) have been concealed or removed.

This is just what I do, based on my experience and training. It is not a recommendation regarding what you should do.

My reasons include:

1) I have put in the time required to learn to quickly and accurately fire my revolvers in DA mode. For defensive shooting, SA provides me no benefits.
2) Concealed hammer versions fire more reliably from under fabric or from the inside of a jacket pocket.
3) Models with no hammer spur are less likely to snag clothing on the draw.
4) For me, the two actions of thumbing back a hammer and then firing in SA are slower and less accurate than the one action of pressing a DA trigger.
5) Stress reduces fine motor control. A gunfight is the last place I want to have a weapon in hand that is easy to fire accidentally because of an extremely light, short SA trigger.
6) If I am ever involved in a defensive shooting, carrying a DAO revolver prevents claims in subsequent criminal and civil actions that the gun was fired using an SA "hair trigger".
7) I never want to have to try to manually lower a cocked hammer on a loaded revolver in the aftermath of a defensive shooting.


Others may disagree. Their training and experiences may be different. As Paul Harrell always said: "My opinions do not spring from the mind of greatness."

YMMV.

 

[Rodfac]

On DA fire, here are a few observations I've had over the years: I find it easier to maintain a consistent grip while firing DA...too, it's a harder, tighter grip. Grip uniformity, for me, is essential to prevent vertical stringing.

In SA fire, I tend to concentrate on the trigger to the detriment of my grip uniformity & it's lead to vertical stringing in my case. This true for both strong hand only and two-handed firing.

Depending on the quality of the trigger, my scores are very nearly as good in DA fire as those I can get with SA slow fire. My best revolver for its DA trigger is Colt's new King Cobra .22 Target with a 4" bbl. I've been a S&W guy for 50+ years and was very surprised at the KC's DA trigger....there are over a dozen S&W's of varying vintages, currently in my safe but that Colt KC has the best DA trigger of any revolver I own. The Smiths still have better SA triggers, however.

Best regards, Rod Pic of KC below with Wilson Sights

​

 

[JoeHenry]

I shot a 686 Smith in NRA action pistol for 10 years. All double action. Some of the shots were at 50 yards. Those revolvers were made to be shot double in that game.

 

[Smokin Gator]

I shot a 686 Smith in NRA action pistol for 10 years. All double action. Some of the shots were at 50 yards. Those revolvers were made to be shot double in that game.

ICORE has far and near standards.
6 targets, row of three at top, three mounted below the top targets.
9 seconds one round each target. 50 yds.

7 seconds one round esch target 25 yards.

10 seconds 2 rounds on 3 targets, mandatory reload, 2 rounds on other 3 targets. 10 yards.

10 seconds 2 rounds top 3 targets strong hand, mandatory reload, 2 rounds each bottom 3 targets weakhand.
Shots fired more than .3 seconds after the time limit are penalized as late shots. Each target has a black x ring for a minus one second bonus. All are gun holstered and loaded at start.

 

[hawg]

Reloading a DA revolver is a lot faster than a SA.

It is if you use a speed loader. If you don't use one it's not enough difference to matter.

 

[Arkansas Paul]

I only own 1 double action revolver, a Taurus 82 in .38 Special.
It's the dedicated nightstand gun.
The double action is not good. It's pretty stiff.
The single action trigger is fantastic.

I have been practicing more double action shooting with it lately. If it is ever called upon to be used for it's intended purpose (fending off an intruder), time may very well be of the essence. I've got a ways to go, but I'm working on it.

 

[MrBorland]

10 seconds 2 rounds on 3 targets, mandatory reload, 2 rounds on other 3 targets. 10 yards.

Very similar to the El Presidente drill, except you start facing away from the targets. My best El Prez time with a revolver (a 686 on steel) was 6.33 seconds with a 2.75 second reload.

 

[trackskippy]

It is if you use a speed loader. If you don't use one it's not enough difference to matter.

Its still a good bit quicker, all depends on how you have things set up and how you do it. Even one at a time is still faster/easier.

And don't forget, the DA gun is empty in one fell swoop, so right from the start you're ahead..

 

[.308 Norma]

And don't forget, the DA gun is empty in one fell swoop, so right from the start you're ahead..

Absolutely! I like SA revolvers as much as the next guy, and I own a few of them. But pushing those fired cases out of the cylinder one at a time is exceedingly boring to me - especially with rimfires.
OTOH, one of the things my wife (a real SA revolver fan) likes about her little Ruger Bearcat is the fact that when we're out shooting ground squirrels with .22s (both rifles and handguns) and there's a lull in the action, she can easily "top off" her Bearcat by pushing the spent cases out of the cylinder and replacing them with fresh rounds. It's not impossible to "top off" a DA revolver's cylinder, but it's more difficult IMO.

 

[Jim Watson]

It's not impossible to "top off" a DA revolver's cylinder, but it's more difficult IMO.

Early days of IDPA, the Tac Load was emphasized. But ol' Bill and his buds were so dismissive of the revolver that the recommendation for a revolver was to empty the cylinder of live rounds and empty cases and "stuff the whole mess in a pocket." I was contrary enough to work out a real Tac Load with live rounds saved and empties discarded, but it took practice and a bit of luck. I only had to reuse those saved rounds a couple of times over about ten years before they dropped the mandatory Tac Load.

 

[JohnKSa]

It is if you use a speed loader. If you don't use one it's not enough difference to matter.

Depends, I guess. First off, all the empties come out at once. Then you can load the new ones two at a time from the box, no turning the cylinder required, no messing with the hammer. I guess if you have a bunch of rounds in a bag and load one at a time, the difference is less significant.

 

[docwharden1881]

i find it easier to shoot in single-action than d.a. Plus I am more of a fan of 'cowboy' guns ie ssa or cap & ball than 'modern' da pistols. Nothing against those who prefer to just squeeze the trigger but I enjoy the old fashioned way.

 

[Smokin Gator]

Very similar to the El Presidente drill, except you start facing away from the targets. My best El Prez time with a revolver (a 686 on steel) was 6.33 seconds with a 2.75 second reload.

That's a great time. Add a 1.25 second time to first shot and that only leaves 2.33 seconds for the actual shooting. These targets have the center black bonus so shooters are taking a bit more time trying to get as many bonuses vs a hit anywhere on target.

 

[Jim Watson]

Then you can load the new ones two at a time from the box,

I was thinking more along the lines of the pre-speed loader PPC, reloading from belt loops or dump boxes.

 

[JohnKSa]

Dump boxes will surely slow you down. From loops, you should be able to grab and load 2 at a time in a swing-out cylinder gun.

 

[hawg]

I was just thinking about loading itself not unloading.