First AR Build. Parts/Advice

[FlyingKiwi]

Ok... After doing enough research to really piss off my girlfriend, I have come up with an idea for my first AR build. I want a Rifle for accuracy but durability/reliability is very important also. I’m a newb to accuracy shooting and just plan to do it for fun. No competitions. I want the rifle to be ready for SHTF/Zombie Aliens/Apocalypse (sarcasm) as well since this will be my only rifle for a while. So a good combo of the two uses is optimal.

Here is a list of parts I’m thinking about. Any suggestions, advice, or recommended manufacturers will be much appreciated. I have put many of my questions in this thread to avoid multiple posts.

Barrel: BCM vs. Sabre Defense vs. Daniel Defense--- 20 inch, 1/7 twist, chrome lined. I have not done enough research on the different profiles and will probably do a new thread on the subject. Govt profile???

-Upper Receiver: Vltor MUR w/ Bolt assist--- I have read great things about this upper. Worth the money?

-BCG: Spikes Nickel Boron vs. BCM--- nickel boron worth the extra $?

-Butt stock/receiver extension kit: Vltor iMOD clubfoot Mil Spec (already purchased)

-Lower Receiver: Spikes Tactical--- From what I understand is built from LAR. And there is not much difference in lowers.

-LPK/Trigger: Spikes Battle Trigger vs. Geissele 2stage--- I still cannot decide on the trigger. 2stagers are always going to be less durable than a single. But I have heard good things about Geissele’s durability. I am looking for good longevity in these parts.

I am unsure at this time about BUIS (flip up), Hand guards, low profile gas block, and charging handles. Any direction would be great on these items. Especially BUIS and Hand guards.

Thanks for your time.

 

[browneu]

I won't answer all of your questions as I don't have time but the first thing you need to look at is the barrel. From there you can build the rifle how you feel. Don't get all of the other stuff if your not going to get a good barrel. I'm emphasizing this point since you stated accuracy as a condition.

Others will chime in with there opinions.

Hopefully kwels, tirod, or usaagguy will chime in.
Sent from my LG-P999 using Tapatalk

 

[TonyAngel]

In short....

Unless you NEED a 20" barrel, go for a 16" with a mid length gas system. The BCM SS410 is a good barrel. If you just want a longer barrel, then the 18" with rifle length gas system. It will shoot much smoother than a 20" with a minimal sacrifice in velocity.

I've used a couple of the Vltor uppers. Not worth the money IMO. I found the Daniel Defense upper receivers to be truer and offered a tighter barrel extension fit. The bolt channels are also true with no high spots. Besides, the Vltor is bulkier than it needs to be for no good reason. Although it has the look of billet, it is forged.

Don't waste your money on that nickel boron crap. You don't need it. I know that some claim that they can run their rifle dry due to it, but no one should run their rifle dry. Lube in an AR does more than just lubricate. It offers a medium for the displacement of crud. Just pick a good milspec BCG from either Spike's or BCM or Daniel Defense, etc.

The stock is a matter of personal preference. More power to ya on your decision. I would, however, suggest a Spike's ST-T2 buffer and run a milspec spring.

Spike's lowers are what I run. They are as good as any and I really like the Spider with red color fill. I think it looks cool.

As for the LPK, call one of the vendors (Ranier Arms, PKFirearms.com, ADCO, etc.) and get them to put an LPK together for you with your chosen grip and trigger. Geissele SSA-E all the way for a field precision rig. Very dependable and a pretty nice trigger without being too light.

Charging handle....BCM Gunfighter medium.

Gas block, I prefer the ones that clamp rather than are held in place by set screws. Pick one. Just make sure it's steel and not aluminum.

Handguards, pick one. The best? Daniel Defense/Larue Tactical and then all the rest. Troy is popular these days.

BUIS? Again, lots out there. Shop around. Midwest Industries, Troy, Magpul, etc.

Good luck.

 

[LiquidTension]

BCM gets their barrels from FN. PSA's hammer forged barrels also come from FN and are cheaper than the BCM, but they do not offer all of the options that BCM does as far as length and gas system.

For lower parts and lower receiver I like PSA's stuff. I just finished a 6.8 build with mostly PSA parts and it turned out really nice. They also run deals sometimes with Geissele triggers.

I'm running rails from DD, YHM, and Troy. I like the Troy TRX the most, with the DD Omega second and the YHM a distant third.

BCM Gunfighter charging handle.

For bolt and carrier, you can't go wrong with Spikes, BCM, DD, or PSA's premium. I don't have any experience with the nickel boron coating and have never found a need for it, but for all I know it might be the best thing since poptarts.

For BUIS the Magpuls are fine if you don't mount the front one on a gas block. If you've got the money Troy makes some really nice ones. I've got Magpuls on my rifles because they are back ups to optics. If I were using irons only I'd go with Troy.

 

[againstthagrane]

-i'm with tony, look up the velocity difference between a 16" and 20" barrel and decide if it's important to you. usually it'll be between 80-150 fps. usually not enough to warrant the extra weight. And definitely DO NOT get a heavy profile barrel.
-skip the NiB BCG you will never notice the difference other than it being easier to clean.
-i've never used the spike's battle trigger, but i know for a fact that the geissele SSA shrank my groups by about 50%
-i bought a spike's lower as well and i was really happy with it, along with a spike's part kit, i never used the trigger so i just kept it as a spare but everything went together very nicely.

 

[SentinelStrategic]

Barrel: BCM vs. Sabre Defense vs. Daniel Defense--- 20 inch, 1/7 twist, chrome lined. I have not done enough research on the different profiles and will probably do a new thread on the subject. Govt profile???
BCM and DD both make exceptional products. DD is known for their Chrome Hammer Forged barrels, which are very durable and last 2-3 times longer than normal button swage barrels. BCM got into the game of CHF barrels and they did a fantastic job as well. BCM also makes a SS410 heavy contour stainless steel barrel, which is extremely accurate. A Gov't contour barrel is a carbine contour. Getting it in anything longer than 16" is a waste. If you are going for a 20" barrel, you are building a rifle, not a carbine. Buy a rifle barrel. A heavier contour will give you much greater accuracy and control. And FWIW, 16" or 18" are more preferable for AR barrels. 20" tends to be unnecessarily long.
Daniel Defense doesn't make a 20" barrel either. They have an 18" S2W (Size to Weight) barrel, that is a heavier contour and very accurate as well.
Other barrels to consider:
-White Oak Armament
-Noveske
-Rainier Arms
-Shilen
-Wilson Combat


-Upper Receiver: Vltor MUR w/ Bolt assist--- I have read great things about this upper. Worth the money?
MUR is good kit. I use them whenever I can for my builds. Very much worth the money.

-BCG: Spikes Nickel Boron vs. BCM--- nickel boron worth the extra $?
Nickel boron is worth the money if you want to look at your bolt and see how pretty it is. Otherwise, it's cosmetic. It's only "slightly" easier to clean. The BCM bolt is a fantastic piece of kit. They have excellent QC and QA. A little-known gem is the RainierArms Thunder Bolt. It's a fully milspec BCG that costs $119. It's been flawless for me and my builds.

-Butt stock/receiver extension kit: Vltor iMOD clubfoot Mil Spec (already purchased)
It's a matter of preference, but I like VLTOR stocks. They're solid.

-Lower Receiver: Spikes Tactical--- From what I understand is built from LAR. And there is not much difference in lowers.
Spikes has good QC and QA. More good kit.

-LPK/Trigger: Spikes Battle Trigger vs. Geissele 2stage--- I still cannot decide on the trigger. 2stagers are always going to be less durable than a single. But I have heard good things about Geissele’s durability. I am looking for good longevity in these parts.
The Spikes trigger is less complex, but Geissele makes one heckuva good trigger. 2-stage triggers are not durable, but Geissele managed to beef up the system where needed and turned it into a reliable part. It all comes down to what you're willing to spend.

I am unsure at this time about BUIS (flip up), Hand guards, low profile gas block, and charging handles. Any direction would be great on these items. Especially BUIS and Hand guards.
BUIS: Troy if you want heavy duty metal, or Magpul MBUS Gen2 for more economical
Handguards: Troy TRX battlerails, Daniel Defense OmegaX or AR15 LITE rails, Samson MFG, or PRI GenIII tubes
Low-Pro Gasblock (LPG): Troy steel set screw model (some barrels have LPGs from the factory). Then pin the gas block.
Charging Handle: BCM Gunfighter. Period.


Thanks for your time.

See above.

 

[FlyingKiwi]

Wow. Lots of great info. Seem's to be a lot of votes for a 16" barrel. I thought for longer range shooting a 20" would be better. Plus the 5.56 relies on velocity for best defense ballistics??? Is the extra fps really no biggy??? I had problems finding a good 18" barrel but will look again. Would there be a difference in accuracy between the two lengths?

 

[TonyAngel]

Man, why is it that so many get hung up on velocity and terms like "defense ballistics?" Well, considering that the military is running 14.5" barrels, I'd say that going with a 16" won't put you at any great disadvantage.

Go with what will make the package easier to deal with. I've hit MOA sized target out to 300 yards with carbine builds. I'm not saying that it wouldn't have gone farther, it was just all the room I had.

As for the 18" barrel, like I said, Bravo Company SS410, Superior Barrels and Krieger.

 

[againstthagrane]

shooting someone at a distance where a 20" would be needed for fragmentation is NEVER going to be viewed as "defense".

 

[Al Thompson]

Plus the 5.56 relies on velocity for best defense ballistics?

If you shoot FMJ, yes. Luckily being a civilian, I can use ballistic tips or some other form of expanding bullets.

I want a Rifle for accuracy

Actually, a lot of research indicates that a shorter barrel (stiffer) is more mechanically accurate (less barrel whip). If you are planning to use only iron sights, the greater distance between rear and front sight do indeed matter. If you are going with a scope, barrel length is pretty moot unless you plan to shoot at extended ranges (past 600m).

IMHO, getting a great barrel and having it properly assembled (crowned, chambered, etc.) is more important than length.

 

[kwelz]

I would suggest you head over to m4carbine.net and do some reading. I have given my responses in RED in the mean time.

I want a Rifle for accuracy but durability/reliability is very important also.

Barrel length does not affect accuracy. Trust me, you are getter off looking at a 16 inch gun

I’m a newb to accuracy shooting and just plan to do it for fun. No competitions. I want the rifle to be ready for SHTF/Zombie Aliens/Apocalypse (sarcasm) as well since this will be my only rifle for a while. So a good combo of the two uses is optimal.

This backs up my above recommendation for a 16 inch carbine. It is much more flexible and you don't really lose anything.

Here is a list of parts I’m thinking about. Any suggestions, advice, or recommended manufacturers will be much appreciated. I have put many of my questions in this thread to avoid multiple posts.

Barrel: BCM vs. Sabre Defense vs. Daniel Defense--- 20 inch, 1/7 twist, chrome lined. I have not done enough research on the different profiles and will probably do a new thread on the subject. Govt profile???

Well 1 of the three is easy to talk about. Sabre Defense is gone. As for the other 2 you may as well flip a coin. Next to Noveske they make some of the best barrels available on the market. Of the two my personal choice is DD but that is just because I have more of their stuff. Either way I would suggest looking at a Lightweight barrel.

-Upper Receiver: Vltor MUR w/ Bolt assist--- I have read great things about this upper. Worth the money?

For your uses no. The MUR is indeed nice. But the extra money would be better spent else ware for your needs. Make sure you get a quality Bolt and Bolt carrier. BCM and DD are good for this.

-BCG: Spikes Nickel Boron vs. BCM--- nickel boron worth the extra $?

See my above comment. BCM or DD. And no Nickel Boron is not woth the extra cost.

-Butt stock/receiver extension kit: Vltor iMOD clubfoot Mil Spec (already purchased)

A great choice here.

-Lower Receiver: Spikes Tactical--- From what I understand is built from LAR. And there is not much difference in lowers.

While I am not a big fan of Spikes I have used a couple of their lowers and had no problems at all. This will be fine.

-LPK/Trigger: Spikes Battle Trigger vs. Geissele 2stage--- I still cannot decide on the trigger. 2stagers are always going to be less durable than a single. But I have heard good things about Geissele’s durability. I am looking for good longevity in these parts.

Neither. I am going to suggest you run a stock trigger since this is your first AR. The geissele will hold up to abuse no question. But what do you hope to gain from using it?

I am unsure at this time about BUIS (flip up),

BUIS depend on your primary optic which we have not discussed. Flip ups are fine but I prefer a fixed front at the very least. Troy makes some of the best with Magpul being a good budget option

Hand guards,

I suggest a long free float rail. Something in the 12 inch range. Troy TRX extreme and Daniel Defense MRF are both great choices here.

low profile gas block,

Just shave down the original FSB.

and charging handles.

BCM Mod 4 or 5. Best on the market.

Any direction would be great on these items. Especially BUIS and Hand guards.



Thanks for your time.

 

[kwelz]

Wow. Lots of great info. Seem's to be a lot of votes for a 16" barrel. I thought for longer range shooting a 20" would be better. Plus the 5.56 relies on velocity for best defense ballistics??? Is the extra fps really no biggy??? I had problems finding a good 18" barrel but will look again. Would there be a difference in accuracy between the two lengths?

If by long range you mean out past 500 meters then possibly. But I doubt you will be shooting people at that range.

To put it in perspective my primary defensive carbine is a 10.5