Fitness a factor?

[speaksoftly]

To slightly reword from the previously closed thread in GGD, how do you view fitness in terms of your self defense beliefs? As stated earlier, many (if not most) of the avid shooters I come in contact with are seriously overweight and obviously not in shape. I'm of the personal belief that we're much more likely to get mugged by clogged arteries than we are an attacker and adjust my lifestyle accordingly. What about you? How much of a necessity is fitness to you? Make it to the range or gym more often?

 

[jon86]

fitness and nutrition are my number one hobbies. I am always cooking and eating. In the gym 5-6 times a week. I'm lucky if I make it to the range 3 times a month.

 

[EdLaver]

I work out 3 to 4 times a week, a good combination of both cardio and weights. I also ride my bicycle in the park for 10 miles once a week. I do partake in the occasionally pizza, wings, and burgers though, can't resist

 

[Corporal K]

Fitness is incredibly important. One of the abilities one must have is the ability to run or at least move quickly. There are a LOT of tubbies out there who shoot well but who can't run from A to B.

Additionally, the level of stress and adrenaline involved in a real-life defensive situation could easily lead to a heart attack in an obese or even overweight person.

 

[Carl Levitian]

Obviously, the fat guys too lazy to work out think that the number 1 tactic of "pull my gun and shoot them", is the end all of self defence. They don't even begin to think of the fact that the bad guy may well be right on top of them, and they may have to fight to 'clear a space' for them to pull thier gun and shoot them.

Unfortunatly, living in the peoples republik of Maryland, CCW is not in the cards in my lifetiime. So I don't have a choice, I have to remaian fit enough to use that blackthorn stick I carry, as well as the knife or screwdriver. I have to work out with others of my ilk to keep up on practice of some basic MA and my old army combatives. I have to remain as fit as possable given that at my and my better halfs age, in the 60's, we're getting into the older citizen range that criminals like to target. That means keeping the weight down, using the eliptical and rowing machines down in the family room in the basement, walking everyday an hour walk in a local regonal park with very hilly trails.

It means keeping very fit as statigies and tactics. Being social security retiries, we tend to travel in numbers, and all male members carry a stout stick of some sort. All the women carry regular police size canisters of pepper for range. In addition to our own personal work outs at home, we have get togethers where we hang up an old duffle bag stuffed with rags, and the men, mostly old vets like myself, pratice pugil stick and Applegate style stick work, some personal bouts with some old hockey helmits/face shields and other odds and ends of safety gear to keep down on injuries. We include some sneak tactics that target the family jewels and knees starting with the stick in a normal position down beside our leg. This requires strength training and cardio for the after scuffle.

Being as fit as one can be means being able to use stratigies and tactics, other than just 'pull my gun and shoot them.' So far in the past 10 years, this has worked just fine in a couple of cases.

 

[Bovice]

Some people work out to look good. Some people work out just so they can kick someone's ass.

Guess which one I am!

I do some cardio (elliptical or stationary bike) so that I won't drop dead at 40. However, I keep it limited to 30 min at a time. That's because I'm also lifting with the intention of being big and strong. I'm about 260 pounds, 6'2", and my bench is nearing 400.

Now, I haven't always been the big guy. In my "former life" I was 100 pounds lighter, ran 5-6 miles a day (sometimes more) and was skinny as hell. I couldn't fight my way out of a paper bag. Any kind of scuffle I ever got into was always a struggle, even though I did some moderately heavy weightlifting. It just didn't give me the overwhelming advantage that I needed.

Now I can quickly overwhelm an opponent with application of extreme force. That's really the best way to handle it when the time comes!

 

[Seattleimport]

Make it to the gym much more often than the range. As mentioned, death by heart disease is much more of a likely threat than death by human assailant.

Well, unless you consider a drunk/negligent driver a "human assailant."

Anyway: yes. If you value your life highly enough to carry a self-defense gun, it makes sense to value your life highly enough to eat right and hit the gym.

 

[William Lee]

I'm one of the tall skinny types, 6'4" and 190 lbs. I'm not an avid runner but I've been in a few fights before. One thing I've noticed is that if you are aware of your surroundings, it is rare to be placed in an inescapable, fists flying left and right in every direction, type situation. With the proper situational awareness, it is possible to either avoid the fight/bad situation all together or end it without expending too much energy or placing yourself at an undue risk. I personally have no problem going for the groin, neck, kidneys, or liver with a good hard right hook, and you can't underestimate the impact of a nice elbow strike to the bridge of the nose. Mind you, I've never been assaulted by someone with a gun who wanted to shoot me--just bottles, knives, and the odd blunt object--I'm working on getting a CCW piece in case I'm not as lucky in the future.

 

[ForumSurfer]

I have a kid and a family history of cancer. I watch what I eat and hit the gym 3-5 days a week, depending on what my schedule may be.

I try to keep my belly from overlapping my gunbelt so my son will have his father around. A fat lot of good it will do to spend all that time at the range if my weight gets to be a concern. I can't very well protect my family if I'm too big and slow to get them to cover or too busy having a heart attack. If I'm dead at 40 because of poor health habits, I definitely won't be able to protect them.

But to each his own. I know first hand how hard it is to stay healthy and workout regularly. Getting there is easy, but maintaining that lifestyle without falling off the wagon takes dedication. I've had numerous broken bones and a surgery or two, so some days are painful. I have my days when I envy those that are more overweight than I and happy.

Anyway: yes. If you value your life highly enough to carry a self-defense gun, it makes sense to value your life highly enough to eat right and hit the gym.

I agree totally. If you can't hit the gym, 30 mins with some barbells and cardio at home will fit into anyone's schedule and is better than nothing. If you can't bring yourself to that, at least don't over indulge and watch what you eat. You can watch what you eat and avoid over eating without become a health food freak.

 

[hso]

There's a huge difference between being a gym bunny and maintaining enough physical fitness to survive an attack. Keep in mind that in all but the most absurdly rare situations will you need to go three 3 minute bouts.

Know how to make distance so that you can use the defensive tools at hand. That may mean moving quickly over a few feet, blocking and escape H2H techniques to allow you to pull a gun or simple offensive counterstrikes to allow you to break off and draw.

There are legions of very fit young men that spend hours per week in the gym that some broken down old men can destroy in a very few seconds because of the training and experience of the broken down old men. A fit broken down old man can just do more.

 

[sm]

hso wrote:There are legions of very fit young men that spend hours per week in the gym that some broken down old men can destroy in a very few seconds because of the training and experience of the broken down old men. A fit broken down old man can just do more. *evil grin*

Yes, I agree.
Plus some of us, are just plain nuts enough, to not give a rip, and get plumb mean-dawg-mean, and cheat like hell.

 

[strambo]

Hmm...this one is touchy and there are no clear answers.

One way of looking at it: If 2 people have 6 hrs of time/week available, person "A" spends 6 hours/week on hand to hand (any good reality based or MMA system) and 0 hrs on fitness, and person "B" spends 5 hrs on fitness and 1 on self defense training, who is better off? Person "A" will be much better off in a critical incident.

It's not that simple though...much self defense training (though not necessarily shooting) is a fitness activity as well.

In a violent situation involving even 3 muggers, I think fitness isn't a huge deal, it will be over (one way or the other) fast. The methods that work involve matching strength against weakness or your mass and a hard body part against a soft, weak exposed anatomy of theirs. Add in adrenalin and there you go. If you are so overweight you cannot move quickly or have atrocious balance (read: obese), this will hurt.

Now, assuming you are just overweight and not morbidly obese, fitness will start to come into play if you have to run or the fight is extended. It would be very important in a SHTF (Katrina) type situation. Also, fatigue has a crippling effect on cognitive function. The better shape you are in, the better able you are to think and act when fatigued...like dialing 911 and being able to state your location after a 30 second struggle and 100 yd sprint to a safer area. Being able to do rudimentary first aid after same. For this, anaerobic fitness is key. Being able to run 10 miles won't help much, being able to go 10 short boxing rounds would.

Training 1st...fitness comes after that in priority (for raw fighting) but, can be critical if you are very out of shape or obese, in an extended situation, or to think critically immediately following exertion. This isn't even going into all the other health and esteem benefits.

Given 2 equally trained people...the edge for survival will always go to the fittest.

At a minimum: get yourself to no more than 20lbs overweight and have the aerobic/anaerobic fitness level where you could spar for 3X 3minute rounds, as someone mentioned above, w/out dying. This would also meet the general and heart health requirements as well. 2-4X per week of moderate to intense activity 15-45 minutes is all it takes, plus a sensible diet.

 

[speaksoftly]

Know how to make distance so that you can use the defensive tools at hand. That may mean moving quickly over a few feet, blocking and escape H2H techniques to allow you to pull a gun or simple offensive counterstrikes to allow you to break off and draw.

Well put...I'm a semi-professional triathlete and take the occasional Krav Maga class. If I can't whip em I know I can out run em. I've yet to meet the assailant who was willing to chase me on a 5 mile run for my wallet. Haha

 

[lions]

Anyway: yes. If you value your life highly enough to carry a self-defense gun, it makes sense to value your life highly enough to eat right and hit the gym.

I do agree with you to a point. I work out regularly and am pretty fit, but if I want to eat poorly, not exercise, and potentially die at an early age from health complications that is my choice, whereas being attacked and potentially killed by another person is not my choice.

 

[MikePGS]

The average person is much more likely to be in danger due to eating poorly and not getting enough exercise than from someone they do or don't know violently attacking them. In fact, statistically speaking I doubt it's even close.

 

[Balrog]

A fit broken down old man can just do more. *evil grin*

My father used to tell me "old age and trickery will always overcome youth and skill". I believe he was correct.

 

[ChCx2744]

Your gun/deadly force option is always your LAST RESORT and FINAL OPTION. Your primary weapon is and always will be the one between your ears and your dual-wielding heavy hitters attached to your wrists. A very good thing to look at is Tony Bauer's CrossFit oriented "SPEAR" system. Stay fit, eat healthy, live well!

 

[shockwave]

Going back to the birth of Western civilization, the ancient Greeks developed the practice of attending gymnasium as a regular regimen for good health. Our modern lifestyle that promotes vegging out and eating poorly is a recipe for all manner of poor outcomes.

After a hiatus of several years while I was too busy to work on firearm skills, I'd gotten out of shape and on my return to the range my guns felt too heavy and my new shotgun felt cumbersome. Following completion of the P90X program, everything's not just back to normal, but better than ever.

For martial arts, since I've overhauled my game to acquire internal style, strength isn't as important as balance and timing, but the restored muscles and aerobic capacity have helped here tremendously. Tonight I led the advanced students in stick form and we practiced both staff and double stick attack and defense.

Never give up, and never, ever, get to where you have to rely on your handgun as your sole means of defense. That way lies weakness. A firearm is a weapon just like any other. You want to be proficient with your hands, sticks, knives, guns. You want skill in throwing weapons, improvised weapons, and acquired weapons. A little bit of practice every day will serve you well.

 

[JoeSlomo]

Fitness is absolutely a factor in defense, however, it is also a factor in your everyday quality of life.

IMO, a regular exercise regimen is more important for the latter than the former.

 

[trickyasafox]

fitness is a big part of my life. More for power than endurance. I've bounced a lot of years, and in my experience- if its not resolved in the first 30 seconds it wasn't a problem to begin with.

that being said, I'm dieting a bit and still hit the mat regularly. I love to still wrestle and stay active in addition to weight lifting, and ride my bike to the gym for cardio.

 

[easyg]

Go to the gym???

But that would mean less time on the golf course.

 

[daveit]

I remember in high school I got bigger muscles than my dad & started to give him some crap about it. He said, "you gotta fall asleep sometime." Haha!

I'm one of Uncle Sam's minions, so I need to stay somewhat fit. Work out at least 3 days a week (5K, circuit training, strength) and I also sneak out a couple times a week for a few hours on the mountain bike.

 

[wishin]

A [strike]broken down[/strike] old man can just do more.

This old man works out 2-3 times a week and walks 2.5 miles every day; besides, I believe an equalizer is always in the cards. Yes, conditioning is very important to me.

 

[content]

Hello friends and neighbors // I thought golf was exercise.

My buisnesses help keep me in good health I get plenty of exercise at both and fresh air at one.
Although I do believe in fitness, a persons mindset is more important.

Even the most fit individual can be surprised and disabled.
Unless you have the right mindset at the right time the BG will get the first move.
So anyone who thinks only the other guy/gal can be wounded or worse in the first couple of seconds I wish you luck.

If at a distance "Sam Colt made everyne equal" is the saying I believe.
If in close and someone wants to get down you had better get dirty first "no such thing as a fair fight".

I think a persons mindset changes as their body changes. I do practice shooting after running but the results are not funny. It is good to know your limitations though and I never was much of a runner.

As far as fitness in shooting, strong arms and wrist definately help me shoot a 6" .357 and I'd think more upper body muscle would reduce felt recoil shooting longguns.

 

[smhbbag1]

Go to the gym???

But that would mean less time on the golf course.

Dude, walk and carry your clubs, and if you play once or twice a week you have a better workout regimen than 95% of America.

That's a 6-7 mile hike with a 15-30 pound oddly shaped bag over your shoulder. You don't need to add much to that outside of the course to keep your heart and muscles in reasonable condition.

It won't make you a stud, for sure, but it'll work.