Foreign Tourists and Our Guns

[Plan2Live]

I was making a quick pass through a local gun store with an indoor range today (Al Thompson might know the one) and I saw three Japanese men standing in front of the building taking photos of each other with the store and signage as a backdrop. A few minutes later they walked into the store timidly looking around with expressions that seemed somewhere between fascination and intimidation. This got me to wondering what it must be like for them to come here and see guns being sold openly when such is incomprehensible in their country. This got me wondering even further why it is that so many foreign tourists with limited or no access to firearms come here and enjoy shooting while they are here but seem to not push for open gun laws at home.

While I was full of curiosity and really wanted to engage them in conversation, I didn't want to risk running them out of the store.

As I walked outside and fired up my truck I also wondered what their reaction would have been if I did have that conversation and reveal that not only was I a gun owner but actually carrying a concealed pistol at that moment. But it wasn't my store and concealed does mean concealed but the conversation would have been interesting for sure.

 

[Red Wind]

But it wasn't my store and concealed does mean concealed but the conversation would have been interesting for sure.

It certainly would have been instructive! You bring up relevant points about why are so many foreign lands so apathetic or outright hostile towards firearms?

 

[ewlyon]

For people living in countries where civilian firearms ownership is heavily restricted, coming to the US and shooting is like any other tourist activity. I have taken many Europeans who had never touched a gun before shooting and while they do seem to enjoy it and be interested in firearms as machinery they still often see them as something that you do not have a right to use, merely the opportunity while they are at a range. Gun shops for them are almost like museums in that they go and see the guns but it is still a long way from buying and carrying one.

 

[Steel Horse Rider]

I have had Canadians, German's, Frenchy's, one Irishman, and an Englishman (although he is competitive pistol shooter and doesn't count as a non-shooter) at my house in the past. They were all very excited about shooting a variety of weapons although my Marlin 1894C in .357 Mag seems to light them all up the most. They always want photos both holding and shooting it. They are like kids in a candy store........

 

[Deanimator]

I imagine they felt like Saudi women walking into a Victoria's Secret.

Freedom is weird and frightening if you've never experienced it.

 

[Shanghai McCoy]

I used to work on LNG ships that delivered to Japan. A few of us were shooters and had various gun magazines around. The shipyard guys would look at these magazines in awe, especially the Gun Digest . When we started pointing out which guns that we actually owned, well it got a little weird...

 

[ridgerunner1965]

for lots of countries like japan its just too late.they will never get firearms rights again. they never really had them to start with.

they dont have a bill of rights or a constitution.

they lived under totalitarian rule for hundreds of years.it tends to beat you down.

i can see tourists from those countries being curious about guns.i would be also.

for them just firing a gun let alone a semi or full auto would prob be something they would tell storys about for years.

 

[herrwalther]

It is the same reason Americans visit the red light district when visiting Amsterdam to partake in green bars and brothels. They aren't legal here but are there. Visitors take advantage of that.

 

[AlexanderA]

Japanese tourists, in particular, seem fascinated by guns and military history. I've seen them at gun shows, battle reenactments, and military vehicle events. In some cases, they've made special trips from Japan to attend these venues. And they buy whatever they can legally take back home with them (books, vehicle parts, uniforms, etc.).

Part of the attraction, I think, is the "forbidden fruit" aspect.

 

[Reloadron]

The Japanese can be an interesting people. I lived in Japan during the early 70s and had several subsequent visits there. I made a good number of Japanese friends I managed to remain in touch with. Several managed to visit the US during later years while I was living in CA. This was mid to late 70s. The girls wanted to shop for a bikini and go to the beach, the guys wanted to experience a shooting range. They have an interesting culture and are among some of the more humorous people I met during my travels.

Gun ownership is not impossible but very difficult. As mentioned gun restriction goes back a long time, around the 17th century. Gun ownership requires licensing which is a very lengthy and expensive process, then the actual cost of the gun and ammunition. Then too, for the average Japanese citizen can you miss something you never had? Take a good look at some of their airsoft stuff, absolutely incredible authentic looking guns.

Over the years I lost touch with my Japanese friends. Started a family and just lost touch. Darn shame as they were some really fun people.

Ron

 

[edwardware]

I work with a few French and Indian (i.e. India) folks, and have taken several shooting. They've all been interested, and frankly more careful and thoughtful than the typical American noob.

I have heard it frequently remarked upon that it's startling to find a gun counter at WalMart while shopping for groceries and home goods.

 

[230RN]

This was before GCA68:

Coming from "Guns=Ewww!" New York City after we moved out to Colorado, I had the same "touristy" experience when I first walked into a Department Store and found handguns on display under glass cases.

I was actually reluctant to approach the counter, but finally screwed up my courage and asked the guy if this was a "police-only" area.

I was shocked to learn that anyone who was a Colorado resident could buy a handgun. He was a little amused at my heavy New York accent and even remarked, "You're from back east, aren't you?"

"Yuh, yuh, Noo Yawk City. Bvooklyn, in fact." I told him. "No licinse, no poimit?"

"Nope," he said and we chatted about it for a while.

I didn't know what "free air" was like before then.

You can bet the day after I got my Colorado Driver's License, which proved my residency, I was back in there and bought a .22 revolver. No paperwork, no questions asked except to show my CO DL, traded money for gun (and some ammo) and that was that. But I still felt like a criminal as I walked out of the store and drove back home.

So I've seen it from both sides.

That gun, bought NIB, has never been used to shoot anyone, or hold up a liquor store, or anything illegal.

Terry, 230RN

 

[Curator]

My English cousin visited me a few years back. Looking into my gun room where there are 40+ guns hanging on the wall he commented "That would never be allowed in Great Britain." I replied: "I know, that's why we had our revolutionary war and booted you guys out." The US is the ONLY country that formed a government to protect our individual rights. (something our current politicians forget) All other countries have had their governments imposed on them by their conquerors. Conquered people cannot be trusted with arms as they may band together to overthrow their rulers.

 

[Deanimator]

As mentioned gun restriction goes back a long time, around the 17th century.

And I've seen that touted as the solution here... usually by people who VERY carefully avoid the undeniable truth that the Tokugawa Shogunate was a bloody and VERY repressive police state. The logical conclusion is that's what they want the United States to look like.

 

[IlikeSA]

A lot of it may be the culture you are from. The Japanese mentioned earlier come from a general culture of compliance and conformity. They are taught not to rock the boat.

When I lived in Korea I had a pocket knife. I pulled it out to cut some string and one of my co-workers gasped. I played it off and asked "where's yours?" She felt the odd one, even though it was me who was odd there.

Living in a place that bans guns (or other hobbies) and living without it for a while will make a person re-focus his interests. For me, it was custom suits: what can I say, they were much less expensive than they are here. For others, particularly the Koreans I observed, they got into biking (10,000 dollar bikes) with all the accouterments, hiking (special hiking clothing), or a myriad of other interests.

 

[Deanimator]

Living in a place that bans guns (or other hobbies) and living without it for a while will make a person re-focus his interests. For me, it was custom suits: what can I say, they were much less expensive than they are here. For others, particularly the Koreans I observed, they got into biking (10,000 dollar bikes) with all the accouterments, hiking (special hiking clothing), or a myriad of other interests.

After I escaped from 1/31 Infantry (Mechanized), I taught North Korean and Warsaw Pact weapons, equipment and doctrine.

Even at the vile Camp Howze I used my personally owned Ithaca Model 37 DSPS to teach the Korean civilian security guards how to shoot their Winchester Model 1200s which they were issued after their M-14s were taken away.

Even when I couldn't shoot, I'd sit in the Officer's Club, reading my copy of "Small Arms of the World" and drinking rose.

 

[Reloadron]

And I've seen that touted as the solution here... usually by people who VERY carefully avoid the undeniable truth that the Tokugawa Shogunate was a bloody and VERY repressive police state. The logical conclusion is that's what they want the United States to look like.

Yes and they can tout that all they want. Japan is gun free so they have no gun crime. The problem is most who make that claim are too stupid to understand the Japanese culture. Japan has a judicial system that is very quick to mete out justice and the JN Slammer is someplace you do not want to be. Unlike here in the US where we now have a judicial system more enmeshed with the rights of criminals than victims. The Japanese live in a culture where they respect the rights and property of others. They still have a strong belief in honor and not bringing disgrace to family. Anyway, yeah, I have heard that claim from the idiots with no understanding of Japan. Really annoys me.

Ron

 

[zorro45]

Went to the Gun Show at the Eastern States Exposition. Decent crowd, extremely nice and helpful vendors. Lots of good stuff for Christmas presents. Nobody was running amok.
Most of the dealers that my friend and I spoke with were either ex-military or part time LEO.
They were nice as can be, had good prices (sort of) and lots of cool stuff. We are really lucky that our ancestors fought a Revolution to be able to govern themselves. Free people get to have the means to keep that freedom. Let's not lose it.
My friend's dad was a Korean War vet. He spent two years over there. All he said about it was "it was cold." Managed to find a book on the History of the Korean War for him and his son for Christmas. It was a good day.

 

[gbran]

On one of my trips to AK with my dad and brother, there were two Britt fellows on our Halibut boat. The conversation turned to guns, next someone was telling us about a plinking spot. So afterwards we took these guys shooting. Never saw somebody have that much fun. I was in my 50's and I'd guess they were mid 30's but acted like my grandkids. They took safe gun handling very seriously.

 

[Carl N. Brown]

I was once under the impression that Howa only made about 300 civilian legal .30 Carbine sporters -- equivalent to the estimate I heard of 300 licensed deer hunters in Okinawa.

I have since learned that Howa manufacturered about 10,000. I think the myth of a gun free Japan is a myth. No tradition of private ownership, no tradition of RKBA, but not totally legal gun free.

The sad thing I see is that gun bans eliminate the good parts of the legitimate "gun culture": independence, personal responsibility, self-reliance, hunting, self-defense, military prepareness for volunteer duty. The gun laws do not impact the bad parts of the criminal "gun culture".

My cousins who are gun collectors and employed at a large chemical company had some foreign visitors fora weekend at the old home place for BBQ, ATVing and target shooting. 'Twas an interesting weekend.

 

[BK]

This got me wondering even further why it is that so many foreign tourists with limited or no access to firearms come here and enjoy shooting while they are here but seem to not push for open gun laws at home.

Because they think we are lunatics. They would never dare bring that to their own society. They think it's wrong.

It's called indoctrination. That's why.

 

[Skoghund]

When i visited the US it was interesting to see the gun stores. But they had nothing to get excited about. Plenty of guns in Scandinavia and my local gun shop is the best in Sweden. When you had shortages of ammo in the US there was plenty on the shelves here.
Very few of my neighbours don't have a rifle or shotgun and i have at least 3 rifle ranges within a halfhours drive.
A few more jobs to do and then I'm going out to try and shoot a deer. No limit to how many i can shoot.
Visiting the shooting cinema on Tuesday. Now thats a fun way to waste Ammo.

 

[vaupet]

I will be visiting NYC during christmas week.

Very curious about the gun shops and gun rights there.

As I own 30+ firearms and a building with indoor firing ranges and will be opening a gun shop in januari, always eager to learn.

Any tips are welcome

 

[Odd Job]

Visiting the shooting cinema on Tuesday.

Sounds interesting, got a link?

 

[Speedo66]

When i visited the US it was interesting to see the gun stores. But they had nothing to get excited about. Plenty of guns in Scandinavia and my local gun shop is the best in Sweden. When you had shortages of ammo in the US there was plenty on the shelves here.
Very few of my neighbours don't have a rifle or shotgun and i have at least 3 rifle ranges within a halfhours drive.
A few more jobs to do and then I'm going out to try and shoot a deer. No limit to how many i can shoot.
Visiting the shooting cinema on Tuesday. Now thats a fun way to waste Ammo.

I visit Sweden every year or so, interested to know what part of Sweden you're referring to, and the name of the shop.
Also interested in info on the "shooting cinema".

Tack så mycket.

Back to the original theme, when I visit HI, I see many Japanese tourists who literally came to play golf and hold and shoot a "real" gun, both either difficult or extraordinarily expensive to do at home.