Lupinus
Member
maybe we should write her back asking why we are getting the same responses and see what she says? 
Gangs and Guns in Columbia, SC
- Thread starter Sportcat
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Pilgrim
Member
Dear Ms Goff,
I just finished reading the subject article and I'm afraid you have been subjected to some overly dramatic statements by law enforcement officers, perhaps to impress you with their flair and expertise in weaponry. As a retired peace officer myself, I am aware from watching episodes of COPS that officers say some really stupid things when placed in front of a TV camera.
The SLED officer's statement that an AK-47 shoots nine bullets at one time going 2400 feet per second is curious. I am not aware of any weapon that fires nine cartridges at the same time unless it has nine barrels and nine chambers. His additional statement that that it is a weapon used in combat is additionally provocative. Is the combat usefulness of a weapon defined by bullet speed? If so, then the rifles commonly used by law enforcement officers, AR-15s, must be super combat weapons since their bullet speeds out the barrel are over 3,000 feet per second. Does that mean that the term 'combat' as applied to weaponry is good, or bad?
Lieutenant Ricky Ezell defines a rifle's fear value to peace officers by their ammunition's ability to pierce police body armor. Is this a new definition of combat weapon? That sounds terrible, but I'm sure that just about any rifle cartridge authorized by your state's fish & game department to take deer size game will pierce police body armor. Does that also make every deer hunter in South Carolina a potential police killer?
Lieutenant Ezell also states, apparently from extensive research, that his department has collected cartridges that are capable of going through as many as four people if they are lined up properly. I suppose this is true, given a heavy enough projectile fired at high enough velocities, but my experience causes me to believe this is possible in weapons of light anti-armor (armored vehicles) variety mostly, not something your average street thug is willing to haul about. If you do some research yourself, you will see the light anti-armor rifles weigh on the order of 25 pounds and more. This is something street thugs don't just carry around under their sweatshirts.
In spite of all the smoke thrown your way by these officers, I'm glad to see that Captain Smith finally came clean, in spite of his gun control bias, and admitted that criminals will continue to get guns no matter how many gun control laws are passed. So, what he is really wanting is gun control laws that will hinder and restrict the law abiding citizen, right? The people who pay taxes for his protection, right?
I just finished reading the subject article and I'm afraid you have been subjected to some overly dramatic statements by law enforcement officers, perhaps to impress you with their flair and expertise in weaponry. As a retired peace officer myself, I am aware from watching episodes of COPS that officers say some really stupid things when placed in front of a TV camera.
The SLED officer's statement that an AK-47 shoots nine bullets at one time going 2400 feet per second is curious. I am not aware of any weapon that fires nine cartridges at the same time unless it has nine barrels and nine chambers. His additional statement that that it is a weapon used in combat is additionally provocative. Is the combat usefulness of a weapon defined by bullet speed? If so, then the rifles commonly used by law enforcement officers, AR-15s, must be super combat weapons since their bullet speeds out the barrel are over 3,000 feet per second. Does that mean that the term 'combat' as applied to weaponry is good, or bad?
Lieutenant Ricky Ezell defines a rifle's fear value to peace officers by their ammunition's ability to pierce police body armor. Is this a new definition of combat weapon? That sounds terrible, but I'm sure that just about any rifle cartridge authorized by your state's fish & game department to take deer size game will pierce police body armor. Does that also make every deer hunter in South Carolina a potential police killer?
Lieutenant Ezell also states, apparently from extensive research, that his department has collected cartridges that are capable of going through as many as four people if they are lined up properly. I suppose this is true, given a heavy enough projectile fired at high enough velocities, but my experience causes me to believe this is possible in weapons of light anti-armor (armored vehicles) variety mostly, not something your average street thug is willing to haul about. If you do some research yourself, you will see the light anti-armor rifles weigh on the order of 25 pounds and more. This is something street thugs don't just carry around under their sweatshirts.
In spite of all the smoke thrown your way by these officers, I'm glad to see that Captain Smith finally came clean, in spite of his gun control bias, and admitted that criminals will continue to get guns no matter how many gun control laws are passed. So, what he is really wanting is gun control laws that will hinder and restrict the law abiding citizen, right? The people who pay taxes for his protection, right?
MD_Willington
Member
Invite her to a range to try each firearm...
Also demonstrate how a knitting needle can go through a vest without a plate...
My grandmother could take out a few people with the amount of knitting needles she packs around town
... no restrictions, no licensing... think of the children!
Also demonstrate how a knitting needle can go through a vest without a plate...
My grandmother could take out a few people with the amount of knitting needles she packs around town
... no restrictions, no licensing... think of the children!Pilgrim
Member
Her reply:
Mr. Stanton,
Thanks for watching and writing. As you mentioned my story is attributed to SLED and other law enforcement agencies I interviewed. I reported what they see... and what they have found on the streets. It was very surprising. SLED says the criminals are getting them at gun shows, gun shops and even flea markets... I didn't report all that. They did say some of these guns they collected were purchased for *as little as* $130 dollars.
My story has no intention of targeting law abiding gun owners. The essence of the story was that law enforcement is starting to see a rise in the use of high powered guns in gang violence. It is the opinion of the officers we interviewed not WIS that laws make it a challenge for them to keep guns out of the hands of criminals.
Thanks again for taking the time to write. We value your thoughts about the stories we report here at WIS...and will take them into consideration in our future reporting on this matter.
Respectfully,
Angie Goff
Mr. Stanton,
Thanks for watching and writing. As you mentioned my story is attributed to SLED and other law enforcement agencies I interviewed. I reported what they see... and what they have found on the streets. It was very surprising. SLED says the criminals are getting them at gun shows, gun shops and even flea markets... I didn't report all that. They did say some of these guns they collected were purchased for *as little as* $130 dollars.
My story has no intention of targeting law abiding gun owners. The essence of the story was that law enforcement is starting to see a rise in the use of high powered guns in gang violence. It is the opinion of the officers we interviewed not WIS that laws make it a challenge for them to keep guns out of the hands of criminals.
Thanks again for taking the time to write. We value your thoughts about the stories we report here at WIS...and will take them into consideration in our future reporting on this matter.
Respectfully,
Angie Goff
sterling180
Member
Assault Weapon baans ,never work in the long term,because there are other ways to acquire firearms.AK47s were the highlight in the UK,in 1987,after the Hungerford massacre,where a madman killed most of his victims with one-before threatening the Swat teams,with the same gun.This guy was a licensed gun owner that was psychotic anyway,but the point is that these bans are probably indirectly aimed at the mentally unstable inrdividuals that tarnish shooters everywhere- however the laws in the US are different to the UK,so it would be easier to acquire an assault weapon,then in the UK-up until 19 years ago.
Gangs can acquire assault weapons by stealing them,but most gang members wouldn't attempt,what that monster,did in Hungerford-because humble gangsters and street punks have limits,as to who they target-as opposed to mental persons,who target anything that walks.
Those street punks are jerks anyway and so are the policy makers,to want these assault weapon bans.Take it from me:"never agree to anything,in the form of a firearm ban-you might be a little mortified,18 months later.Also never blame the tool,it is the tools operator that is the problem and secure your guns safely in a cabinet-if you live in a high crime rated area.
Gangs can acquire assault weapons by stealing them,but most gang members wouldn't attempt,what that monster,did in Hungerford-because humble gangsters and street punks have limits,as to who they target-as opposed to mental persons,who target anything that walks.
Those street punks are jerks anyway and so are the policy makers,to want these assault weapon bans.Take it from me:"never agree to anything,in the form of a firearm ban-you might be a little mortified,18 months later.Also never blame the tool,it is the tools operator that is the problem and secure your guns safely in a cabinet-if you live in a high crime rated area.
Lupinus
Member
he is a typical police state hypocryt, believing the state should have total power and the citizens should have no power and be at the total authority of the police or other goverment agents, one of these is that citizens should be disarmed. Not to bash all police, but it seems to be a growing trend.
OldSchooler
Member
The average reporter is little more than a sensation monger on wheels, dolled up for the camera. While I applaud the efforts to enlighten her, suggesting she is misprepresenting the truth won't endear her to your argument. She'll see such stuff as typical gun-nut rhetoric. Long winded, strenuous arguments wont get her attention.
There was one thing overlooked, though. The young woman who was killed was keeping dubious company. She shouldnt have died for it, but the situation remains - she was running with someone who was in the sights of gang shooters.
We're talking gangs, here. They act outside the law, and always in predictably violent ways. Trying to assign laws to them that only effect the rest of us is silly - they ignore them. Remember when there were no such things as guns, only swords and knives and so on? Gangs existed, even then, and they preyed on the innocent and those who would run afoul of them, as they do now.
But, the last paragraphs of the story are the most chilling. It is a formula for liberal minded control of citizens: More laws = More restrictions = More criminals free to do what they want, outside of the laws designed to thwart them - as they always are.
No AK-47 or other weapon ever got up on its own to kill someone. The shooter is responsible. Perhaps if there were a fw more legally armed citizens at hand, the incident would have played out differently. That is the tact to take - and the facts that should be supported in whatever messages are sent to her.
There was one thing overlooked, though. The young woman who was killed was keeping dubious company. She shouldnt have died for it, but the situation remains - she was running with someone who was in the sights of gang shooters.
We're talking gangs, here. They act outside the law, and always in predictably violent ways. Trying to assign laws to them that only effect the rest of us is silly - they ignore them. Remember when there were no such things as guns, only swords and knives and so on? Gangs existed, even then, and they preyed on the innocent and those who would run afoul of them, as they do now.
But, the last paragraphs of the story are the most chilling. It is a formula for liberal minded control of citizens: More laws = More restrictions = More criminals free to do what they want, outside of the laws designed to thwart them - as they always are.
No AK-47 or other weapon ever got up on its own to kill someone. The shooter is responsible. Perhaps if there were a fw more legally armed citizens at hand, the incident would have played out differently. That is the tact to take - and the facts that should be supported in whatever messages are sent to her.
RustyShackelford
member
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Gang "intelligence"/police units
I sat on my county's special grand jury for 6 months. We did several major homicide cases. One case involved a gang related incident with AK-47s/74s. We could ask questions directly to the police officers and/or sworn LEOs who came to testify under oath.
This is what I ask the police detective working the gang related homicide;
ME: When you found out the murder weapon was a AK-47 did you contact any members of your police department's gang unit or police inteligence unit to find out who owned these weapons or bought these firearms?
PO: No
ME: Did you talk to any other detectives to see if this gang would carry or use AKs or were involved with any other crimes using AK-47s?
PO: No
ME: Do you know how many gangs in this area are known to use AK-47s or AK-74s?
PO: No I do not.
The fact that many sworn LEOs deal with gang members/career criminals who may use illegal AKs it irks me that some cops could be so lax about gangs and violent crime. Police officers and sworn LEOs should push harder to bust gangs/crime. To know that these *&#$bags use AKs and the local law enforcement officers are like SFW really bugs me too. :banghead:
Many LEOs gripe about "officer safety" but what about the general public? Don't they risk being shot or killed by these AKs too?
I sat on my county's special grand jury for 6 months. We did several major homicide cases. One case involved a gang related incident with AK-47s/74s. We could ask questions directly to the police officers and/or sworn LEOs who came to testify under oath.
This is what I ask the police detective working the gang related homicide;
ME: When you found out the murder weapon was a AK-47 did you contact any members of your police department's gang unit or police inteligence unit to find out who owned these weapons or bought these firearms?
PO: No
ME: Did you talk to any other detectives to see if this gang would carry or use AKs or were involved with any other crimes using AK-47s?
PO: No
ME: Do you know how many gangs in this area are known to use AK-47s or AK-74s?
PO: No I do not.
The fact that many sworn LEOs deal with gang members/career criminals who may use illegal AKs it irks me that some cops could be so lax about gangs and violent crime. Police officers and sworn LEOs should push harder to bust gangs/crime. To know that these *&#$bags use AKs and the local law enforcement officers are like SFW really bugs me too. :banghead:
Many LEOs gripe about "officer safety" but what about the general public? Don't they risk being shot or killed by these AKs too?
outfieldjack
Member
I have been interviewed numerous times by Angie Goff with regards to my work. I'm not making excuses for her because she should get her facts straight, but these reporters do go from one topic to another each day. She probably had no prior knowledge about guns and depended on SLED for her facts. I know whenever she does a story with me, she takes what I say as the gospel.
BTW, she is a looker.
Hopefully the next time she does a story on firearms she will be better informed.
Jack
BTW, she is a looker.
Hopefully the next time she does a story on firearms she will be better informed.
Jack
ScottsGT
Member
Maybe we should start sending the E-mails to the BS'ers at SLED??? Hmmm?
If their PR people get enough irate people e-mailing them, maybe they won't allow their Bozo's in front of a camera again.
Or ask our favorite reported to do an article on the way SLED slants the info to what they want to be on the air and not the truth of the matter?
If their PR people get enough irate people e-mailing them, maybe they won't allow their Bozo's in front of a camera again.
Or ask our favorite reported to do an article on the way SLED slants the info to what they want to be on the air and not the truth of the matter?
Sportcat
Member
Finally... Scott has a good idea!
ScottsGT
Member
And it took me how many years????
Pilgrim
Member
In my experience, that determines the rank of the officer who gets interviewed. If she is a dog, a probationary patrolman gets assigned to be interviewed.
Pilgrim
Justin
Moderator Emeritus
To those of you who sent civilly-worded messages, thank you.
Having worked with a few reporters in a past life, I can pretty much tell you that it's an impossible job. You're expected to present an unbiased story, showcasing all major viewpoints, on an impossibly tight schedule and with a space/time allotment far to brief to do any of the above well.
This is why the traditional view of reporting, even assuming that a reporter is doing their best to approach a story fairly, is an utterly broken methodology.
Having worked with a few reporters in a past life, I can pretty much tell you that it's an impossible job. You're expected to present an unbiased story, showcasing all major viewpoints, on an impossibly tight schedule and with a space/time allotment far to brief to do any of the above well.
This is why the traditional view of reporting, even assuming that a reporter is doing their best to approach a story fairly, is an utterly broken methodology.
I am not sure that reporters seriously looking at stories before publishing them was ever that common. A more common approach in the past has been to just print whatever sells newspapers or appeases the owner.
If nothing else, she now knows to take what SLED says with a grain of salt, having been scammed by them this time around, and maybe will look a little closer next time.
cmidkiff
Member
I guess my (polite but lengthy) email didn't deserve even the 'form letter' response. Oh well, hopefully she'll think twice about spewing garbage regarding weapons without doing _some_ fact checking first.
Guy B. Meredith
Member
Uh, maybe a $130 AK gets you 20 yd, uh ft., accuracy?
LiquidTension
Member
Maybe I'll invite her to the range. I can literally throw a rock and hit the WIS building from my place of employment.
LiquidTension
Member
BTW, I listen to CPD Metro's radio traffic sometimes. I hear 10-75 (shooting) calls several times on the weekends coming from the 1800 block of Blanding and the surrounding areas. The Bloods and the Crips have a presence here, and MS-13 is active down around Decker and Two Notch.
Langenator
Member
Wow...I used to live less than a mile from that intersection. I never knew.
Forest Acres is a nice area. So which gang owns the mall?
Forest Acres is a nice area. So which gang owns the mall?
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