Gaza in America-would you move or fight?

[38snapcaps]

What would you do if the Gaza scenario was happening where you live? Israelites that have been living in Gaza since 1967 are being told by their government that they have to leave. Say, for instance, you live in South Texas or California and the Mexicans have been creating alot of trouble like the Palestinians and our President (a Clinton would do this) says, "well we should give this land back to them to make peace, you have to get out".

You have until midnight and then the police and army are coming to drag you out. I know, we have a Constitution that supposedly prohibits such a thing, but look at how the 2nd Amendment has been violated since 1934, 1968, and 20,000 other ways. The recent SCOTUS decision on eminent domain could easily be turned into this situation.

What would you do? Take a stand, demonstrating peacefully as they drag you out anyway? Or would you take up arms and resist?

 

[Sindawe]

Stand and fight.

 

[Control Group]

Say, for instance, you live in New London, Connecticut...

 

[larry starling]

Heck isnt it all ready here? with illegal immigration??????

 

[Henry Bowman]

Say, for instance, you live in New London, Connecticut...

Hey! No fair bringing it home like that! It's easier to say "Open fire!" when the question is just retorical.

 

[Preacherman]

The Gaza situation is not going to occur here, because it's unique in two ways:

1. Gaza is occupied territory, not part of the State of Israel. Israel conquered it in the 1967 war, and is now handing it back.

2. The settlers there have a religious motivation, believing that God gave ancient Israel this land, and that they're simply reclaiming what God gave them. Unfortunately, this takes no account of the several thousand years of history since that time, and ignores international politics and hard reality.

Since there is no comparable area of land in the USA subject to the same troubles, I guess the Gaza situation can't be replicated here.

 

[Art Eatman]

I'll quibble with ya, Preach: There's no way the Israelis are "handing it back", since it wasn't Palestinian-state land to begin with. Heck, there weren't really any "Palestinians" in 1967.

IIRC, Egypt had an interest in that disputed Gaza Strip...

Pardon my naivete, but I've never understood why the winner in a poker game should somehow be expected to give back the money. I've never understood why the loser in a war that he started somehow deserves the return of lands that were lost.

Art

 

[longeyes]

I made the comparison on THR yesterday. The Government is prepared to hand over a big chunk of the U.S., de facto, to Mexico. They figure the usual suspects will still run the show and make even more money than they are making now. The Feds will side with the illegals; the fix is in, folks.

If we don't want to be faced with "stand or fight?" we'd better take some decisive and dramatic political action NOW.

 

[R.H. Lee]

Well, what portion of Mexico was taken over by the United States in the mid 1800's? Would that also qualify as 'occupied territory', and as such, subject to return to the 'rightful' owners (ie, the descendents of the Aztecs, modern day Mexicans).

 

[longeyes]

where it is

In less than ten years the Hispanic "bloc" in the U.S. has come to be seen as the pivotal "swing" voting group that will determine future elections and future political power. No matter, apparently, that a lot of this bloc got here illegally or is a drain on the taxpayer. What this means to me, given the political thinking now in vogue, is that the current two-party political system is dead. Since when does a minority of interlopers get to control your country? If that is the perspective of the political elites, I want no part of any of them. I'm sure I won't be alone.

 

[RealGun]

Since there is no comparable area of land in the USA subject to the same troubles, I guess the Gaza situation can't be replicated here.

I believe we have comparable situations with Indian territory, including the religious aspects and ancient traditions.

 

[armoredman]

Gadsen purchase, ( Mexico can claim in the Internation Court that they were ripped off...) The Mexican American War, that was, how much of AZ, Southern California, New Mexico? Old claim against Texas, when it was a nation, before statehood. Oh, yeah, we could have the same type of situation, if enough leftist weenies got into office, the UN was invited to "peacekeep" on our southern border, and pantywaists in the blue states decided to "appease" Vincente Fox..... A lot of unlikely events would have to occur, but it's possible.
Now , what if they decided to give back everything taken by conquest, but keep the Gadsen Purhcase area? We'd be blockaded - Berlin airlift anyone?
Just going to the illogical extreme, tin foil hat wise....which sometimes turns out to be true...

 

[Sam Adams]

Say, for instance, you live in South Texas or California and the Mexicans have been creating alot of trouble like the Palestinians and our President (a Clinton would do this) says, "well we should give this land back to them to make peace, you have to get out".

I live in South Texas. Let's just say that I like "What If" scenarios, and I've often pondered what the result of the Battle of the Alamo would have been if the defenders had AR-15s and Remington 700s.

The Gaza situation is not going to occur here, because it's unique in two ways:

1. Gaza is occupied territory, not part of the State of Israel. Israel conquered it in the 1967 war, and is now handing it back.

2. The settlers there have a religious motivation, believing that God gave ancient Israel this land, and that they're simply reclaiming what God gave them. Unfortunately, this takes no account of the several thousand years of history since that time, and ignores international politics and hard reality.

Since there is no comparable area of land in the USA subject to the same troubles, I guess the Gaza situation can't be replicated here.

Uh, Preacherman, I hate to disagree, but the Azlatan people seem to think that the entire SW part of the country belongs to Mexico. I usually don't link to other sites here, but take a gander at http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/698977/posts This thread discusses how 58% of Mexicans think that the SW US is really Mexican territory.

Regarding the religious motivation, what would you call Manifest Destiny? Oh, it wasn't an official part of any religion, but the ideology was as strongly believed in as any theology of the time - otherwise, why would this nation have engaged in the wholesale slaughter of Indians for over a century? People who are otherwise pretty decent have to be whipped up to start killing others, especially in great numbers over a long period of time. Ike didn't call our effort in Europe a "crusade" for no reason.

Oh, and regarding "handing it back," to do so you have to have someone on the other side of the transaction who actually owned the thing in the first place - just like so-called "gun buy-backs." Gaza belonged to Egypt, and Egypt isn't getting anything back...in fact, Egypt would do everything in its power NOT to take back Gaza, because then its government would be the target of the Hamas murderers. The "Palestinians" are a non-existent people. There NEVER was a nation of Palestine, there NEVER was an Arab government that had Jerusalem as its capital, etc. "Palestine" as it is generally understood today was invented in 1967. You see, there never was any demand to "end the occupation" or anything even remotely like it when Egypt controlled Gaza or Jordan controlled the so-called "West Bank" before 1967. You know why? Because it was fellow Arabs, Arabs who were willing to use overwhelming and brutal force to keep the population down. Once the Israelis got control, governments all over the Arab world saw a way of diverting their peoples' attention from the fact that they had low standards of living and were lowly subjects of dictatorships by blaming Israel for everything.

You should know and analyze your history a bit better before making statements like you did. I have great respect for you, based on your prior writings here at THR - but on this issue you seem to not be very well informed.

 

[spartacus2002]

Oh, yeah, we could have the same type of situation, if enough leftist weenies got into office, the UN was invited to "peacekeep" on our southern border, and pantywaists in the blue states decided to "appease" Vincente Fox.....

I daresay the bluehats would not venture outside of their compounds after their first week.

A lot of unlikely events would have to occur, but it's possible.

You mean as unlikely as the fed.gov letting the southern border be wide open, letting the states get overrun by illegal immigrants, and some of the states wanting to give them drivers licenses because hey, that ends the problem of unlicensed drivers Not poking at you, just shocked that these things happen.

 

[wingman]

Since when does a minority of interlopers get to control your country? If

Sad, that is what is happening, taking it back "one house at a time".,
but when they do what they will have is Mexico. Oklahoma build your
wall now.

 

[rick_reno]

Since there is no comparable area of land in the USA subject to the same troubles, I guess the Gaza situation can't be replicated here.

One word - UTAH.

 

[MikeIsaj]

As others have said, Israel isn't giving Gaza back to anyone. Abandoning is the more appropriate term. They won it in war with Egypt in '67. In the negotiations to end the fighting, Egypt expressed no interest in re-aquiring the Gaza. I think they snookered the Israelies because now the Palestinians are Israels problem, not Egypts. Remember always that the Palestinians are in Israel because no other arab nation will have them, and they landed there when Jordan drove them out while slaughtering about 40,000 of the slower ones.

I could be wrong but aren't the settlers living in government housing? I thought the settlements were built by the government in order to enforce their claim to the land in a dispute with the PLO. If my memory is correct that changes the scenario. It would be more like the government condemning public housing and forcing the tenants to move out.

 

[R.H. Lee]

If it ever came to 'Gaza in America', the U.S. government would enforce it, so you'd either move, die, or go to jail.

 

[Sam Adams]

I could be wrong but aren't the settlers living in government housing? I thought the settlements were built by the government in order to enforce their claim to the land in a dispute with the PLO. If my memory is correct that changes the scenario. It would be more like the government condemning public housing and forcing the tenants to move out.

My understanding is that the Israeli government subsidized the housing. But you have to ask, "WHY?" The answer is, because it was government policy for a long time to encourage people to leave their homes and move to Gaza (or Judea or Samaria). The general idea was to have the settlements become towns and then cities, to impede an Arab invasion. What ended up happening is that most of the people who moved out there were religious, because they were willing to put up with the hardships and the danger of being on the frontier, because they subscribed to a bigger picture than the government. Now they are being screwed by their government.

 

[Marshall]

You have until midnight and then the police and army are coming to drag you out.

Maybe you just skipped directly to that part for the question of what would you do??

But, they have had months to get out, they were given anywhere from $100,000.00 to $400,000.00 per family to relocate. I know, just the fact of forcing a move. Remind anyone of something that happened lately here is the USA?

 

[NHBB]

this fiasco will never end... I think it wise on the part of Israel to pull out and offer the so called olive branch, but the leaders of hamas are still grandstanding and demanding a say within the palestinian govt and are willing to continue fighting. isnt this what they have always been trying to achieve? nothing is going to make them happy... I think this is a good step in the direction given their history, but the problem is going to manifest itself in a different manner soon enough I am sure.

 

[entropy]

Re the situation in the SW, .gov deliberately hamstrings the BPS and State and local enforcement to accomplish multiple goals: Packing the whole country with illegal immigrants (they have infested WI in droves, taking jobs traditionally filled by college [particularly Ag majors] students), draining the US economy by sending their illegally gotten gains back to Mexico, and by clogging up the system with their demands for Big Brothers 'money for nothing'. Now susbstitute terrorists (and who's to say some of these aren't sleepers coming in now?) and weapons for some of the lettuce pickers and drugs. Has .gov really made us safer? They come over the wire in battalion strength every night. Every night! Not a stretch of imagination for a massed invasion to occur, and the Pavlovian response of the BGS would be to avoid confrontation, except for a few attempts at 'show' arrests, which would result in their total annihlation. Sure, the Minutemen might inflict small damages before they too were obliterated, but all in all, such an invasion coinciding with .gov ordering all active, Reserve, and NG to stand down, The entire Southwest would become Aztlan without a lot of bloodshed. When you look at what .gov and .mexgov have been up to lately, it's hard to come to any other conclusion.

As for claimants to the land in and about Israel, I guess the Israelis have original claim to it, since they completely eliminated the original inhabitants. (The Caananites.) Land for peace has never worked. Ask the Czechs. Or French. Or Poles....

Guess all Y'all High Roaders down Southwest oughta keep 'em ready, and or learn Spanish.

 

[geekWithA.45]

...believing that God gave ancient Israel this land, and that they're simply reclaiming what God gave them....

Well, that should make it simple then.

All they have to do then is bring the original deed and title, duly signed by The Hand Of God and properly notarized to the UN......

 

[Sindawe]

An interesting side note the withdrawl from Gaza that I read in one of the MSM web sites. Part of the agreement was that the Israelis would leave behind the agricultural infrastructure that made the desert bloom, provided that control of those resources was passed to an identified agent of the Palastinian state. Well, the Palastinians have been fighting and bickering amongst themselves over who will have control. As a result, the Israelis are taking down that infrastructure (water systems, greenhouses, etc) and taking it with the when they leave.

Guess all Y'all High Roaders down Southwest oughta keep 'em ready, and or learn Spanish.

I'll the latter. I'll not learn a foreign language to suit the whims of hostile invaders.

 

[roo_ster]

I'll quibble with ya, Preach: There's no way the Israelis are "handing it back", since it wasn't Palestinian-state land to begin with. Heck, there weren't really any "Palestinians" in 1967.

IIRC, Egypt had an interest in that disputed Gaza Strip...

Pardon my naivete, but I've never understood why the winner in a poker game should somehow be expected to give back the money. I've never understood why the loser in a war that he started somehow deserves the return of lands that were lost.

What Art said.

The Arab countries attacked, in concert, and Israel thumped them. I think that claiming the newly-conquered territory as their own to be perfectly just and some little compensation for the life, time, and money lost fending off the invasion.

Supposedly, the settlements in Gaza generated over $100million in agricultural output. We'll see what they produce when the splodeydopes run the farms.