General Purpose rifle
- Thread starter C-grunt
- Start date
- Status
The Ruger guide gun weighs in at 8.12 lbs with minimum OAL of 41 inches. Add rings and an optic to the mix, and your looking at 9.5 lbs unloaded. (About the same as an M1 Garand)
My M1A-A1 weighs less than that, and has useful iron sights for shooting at medium ranges. Add optics, and it's only a half lbs more.
Self defense at close range again people, feral dogs, etc...... and 4 rd internal magazines might not be interesting any longer.
Hopefully food for thought at least.
My M1A-A1 weighs less than that, and has useful iron sights for shooting at medium ranges. Add optics, and it's only a half lbs more.
Self defense at close range again people, feral dogs, etc...... and 4 rd internal magazines might not be interesting any longer.
Hopefully food for thought at least.
OP
OP
C-grunt
Member
My main self defense guns are a couple Colt 6920s. I'm well aware of the benefits of a mag fed semi auto rifle.The Ruger guide gun weighs in at 8.12 lbs with minimum OAL of 41 inches. Add rings and an optic to the mix, and your looking at 9.5 lbs unloaded. (About the same as an M1 Garand)
My M1A-A1 weighs less than that, and has useful iron sights for shooting at medium ranges. Add optics, and it's only a half lbs more.
Self defense at close range again people, feral dogs, etc...... and 4 rd internal magazines might not be interesting any longer.
Hopefully food for thought at least.
What I'm envisioning is a good solid hunting rifle that is also capable of being a decent combat rifle.
Only showing the weight by comparison with rifles that a lot of folks think are too heavy.
A 4rd internal fixed magazine would not qualify for me.
A 10rd detatchable magazine is another matter however. (Self defense/limited security)
Niether is what I would consider to be a combat rifle.
And I never said you were NOT aware of anything.
A 4rd internal fixed magazine would not qualify for me.
A 10rd detatchable magazine is another matter however. (Self defense/limited security)
Niether is what I would consider to be a combat rifle.
And I never said you were NOT aware of anything.
Last edited:
M1GarandDeerHunter
Member
My personal GPR is a Garand in 30-06. Followed by 1903A3 Springer and 1917 Enfield. Any of these does 600 yards. I have a Ruger New Frontier in .308 Win. that is especially handy and fun to hunt with, and the kids fight over who carries it. Muzzle blast sucks. Dont know about 600 yards with it. No doubt the bullets get there tho. I also like my M77 mkII LH in .30-06 with leupold 1.75x6 vari x 3. Sounds like what you really need is a solid .30-06 hunting rifle with a decent scope and maybe backup irons to boot. If I was looking at a new rifle now, I might consider a CZ550 with the full stock and single set trigger and a low power varible scope in QD mounts in something .30 caliber. They are really nice rifles, with a lot of bang for the buck and really accurate from my personal experience.
ECVMatt
Member
- Joined
- Jan 7, 2004
- Messages
- 2,866
I would vote for the .308 as well. I would try to stash more ammo and then the crunch is not so painful. I have loaded ammo as well as components stacked deep. I have a Ruger GSR and it is a great rifle. Mine shoots very well, is uber reliable, and I like the scope/iron combo. I tried a Remington Model Seven for a lighter rifle, but could not get it to shoot. I am going to buy a Howa Ranch land compact next. It's a bit porky, but I am not so concerned with weight. It would be much easier for me to lose a few pound, then freak out about a pound on a rifle. I like to shoot a lot, so more weight also cuts down on recoil. I have a nice VX III 1.5x5 just sitting around waiting for a home, so guess I will put it on the Howa; that should make a nice little rifle.
Let us know what you end up with.
Let us know what you end up with.
peacemaker45
Member
I don't get the Ruger Guide Gun. Maybe I just haven't read enough gun rag articles to explain to me why I need it, but looking at it on paper, I don't see it. It looks like they too the already heavy and unhandy Ruger Scout, and did everything they could to make it heavyer and unhandyer. Too heavy to make a good GP rifle, at least in my estimation, and they lost the aperture rear sight in favor of chintzy open sights. At least they didn't do away with them altogether.
I would agree with Matt above.
The Guide gun that Ruger puts out would not make for a good GPR.
The Savage hog hunter would be a better candidate for a GPR, compared to the guide gun.
It still suffers the same measly iron sights, and limited mag capacity, but weighs less, has a threaded bbl, and can be had in either 30-06 or 308.
The Guide gun that Ruger puts out would not make for a good GPR.
The Savage hog hunter would be a better candidate for a GPR, compared to the guide gun.
It still suffers the same measly iron sights, and limited mag capacity, but weighs less, has a threaded bbl, and can be had in either 30-06 or 308.
OP
OP
C-grunt
Member
I looked at that but I really want a CRF action. The M70 Extreme Weather is my top candidate currently.
That Hog Hunter is a nice gun though.
d2wing
Member
- Joined
- Nov 10, 2008
- Messages
- 6,416
My choice is a 700 BDL stainless, synthetic stock Leopold VX lll scope in 7 MM. It has the power, accuracy, range and reliability to do anything that needs to be done with a hunting rifle and more. Mine also has a detachable box magazine which I prefer. The 7 mm has more useful range than any round you mentioned when you consider retained energy and competition proven accuracy. The second choice for me would be 30-06. The other rounds all have merits. The .308 has great accuracy and is a well developed round. The 270 is my least favorite because of it's issue with long range stability with high B.C. Bullets since you require 600 yard accuracy. All the other rounds have proven accuracy in competition at that range. 30 cal does broaden your choice of bullets suitable for very long range. Less common but 7-08 is a very good choice as well.
Last edited:
this is a good question that i've struggled with. i've never found a good GP rifle (that would do everything i wanted). I've had to basically go the other way. a precision bolt gun and a SBR AR, and most of my effort recently is trying to manage / carry both simultaneously, which is working out better than i expected
Interesting taliv.
I tried the same thing as you in the past. (Precision rifle and a carbine)
It didn't work out well on foot however, but was doable in short humps in certain terrain.
What is your load in terms of ammunition amounts for both firearms, and overall weights?
What type of precision rifle are you using for this?
For reference: My current "do all" GPR is the M14S (18.5in bbl), and has been for awhile now. Less weight and bulk compared to 2 firearms, and very well rounded with a handgun instead.
Rifle weight with sling, mount, rings, and optic = 9.3 lbs
Total weight with a topped off 10rd mag = 10lbs
20rd topped off mags = 1.5 lbs
OAL = 38 inches roughly.
If I had to pick one load only for all around use, it would be using a 165gr SGK bullet.
I have used it to take hogs, deer, bear, and elk, so have complete confidence with it as a hunting bullet, and also prefer it for the purpose of defense, as compared to M80, M852, and M118 that I used at work via our DMR's and machine guns.
This rifle shoots a wide assortment of factory ammunition fairly decent as well. I am shooting some CBC 168gr BTHP as of late, and it isn't that bad in terms of factory imported match ammo.
I tried the same thing as you in the past. (Precision rifle and a carbine)
It didn't work out well on foot however, but was doable in short humps in certain terrain.
What is your load in terms of ammunition amounts for both firearms, and overall weights?
What type of precision rifle are you using for this?
For reference: My current "do all" GPR is the M14S (18.5in bbl), and has been for awhile now. Less weight and bulk compared to 2 firearms, and very well rounded with a handgun instead.
Rifle weight with sling, mount, rings, and optic = 9.3 lbs
Total weight with a topped off 10rd mag = 10lbs
20rd topped off mags = 1.5 lbs
OAL = 38 inches roughly.
If I had to pick one load only for all around use, it would be using a 165gr SGK bullet.
I have used it to take hogs, deer, bear, and elk, so have complete confidence with it as a hunting bullet, and also prefer it for the purpose of defense, as compared to M80, M852, and M118 that I used at work via our DMR's and machine guns.
This rifle shoots a wide assortment of factory ammunition fairly decent as well. I am shooting some CBC 168gr BTHP as of late, and it isn't that bad in terms of factory imported match ammo.
Last edited:
I've actually been on the same quest (GP rifle), to compliment my 3" SP 101 pistol (1P/1R setup).
After handling a couple of Ruger Alaskan's at the gun store today (20" bbl, iron sights and ruger action, not .30-06 tho), I've become convinced that a 20"bbl is just too short (thus,no guide gun). I'll deal with the little bit extra length to get a bit extra oomph and some more burn time.
So - I'm looking M77 in .30-06 with a 1.5-6x vari or a 4x fixed Leupy. Stainless preferred. I would have to have a smith put on a set of irons on it, and pick up a NECG Aperature-sight. If anything, just do a front sight and the NECG. I carry a fold-open allen wrench kit with me anyways, so taking off the scope is an easy affair. Tack on a Limbsaver to the rear and maybe thread the muzzle for a "moderator" in the future, and I'd call it done.
While the M77 only has 4 rounds in the mag, it carries in the hand MUCH nicer than having a 5-10rnd mag sticking out, and if you need another round in a hurry, just push it in.
I'd go .30-06 over .308 - because they're the same under 180gr, but anything over 180gr really separates the two. Also, Woodleigh makes a 220FMJ that would take up half a .308 case, and a 240gr SPECIFICALLY engineered for the .30-06. Anything else .308 could do, .30-06 could replicate.
After handling a couple of Ruger Alaskan's at the gun store today (20" bbl, iron sights and ruger action, not .30-06 tho), I've become convinced that a 20"bbl is just too short (thus,no guide gun). I'll deal with the little bit extra length to get a bit extra oomph and some more burn time.
So - I'm looking M77 in .30-06 with a 1.5-6x vari or a 4x fixed Leupy. Stainless preferred. I would have to have a smith put on a set of irons on it, and pick up a NECG Aperature-sight. If anything, just do a front sight and the NECG. I carry a fold-open allen wrench kit with me anyways, so taking off the scope is an easy affair. Tack on a Limbsaver to the rear and maybe thread the muzzle for a "moderator" in the future, and I'd call it done.
While the M77 only has 4 rounds in the mag, it carries in the hand MUCH nicer than having a 5-10rnd mag sticking out, and if you need another round in a hurry, just push it in.
I'd go .30-06 over .308 - because they're the same under 180gr, but anything over 180gr really separates the two. Also, Woodleigh makes a 220FMJ that would take up half a .308 case, and a 240gr SPECIFICALLY engineered for the .30-06. Anything else .308 could do, .30-06 could replicate.
frag, don't want to derail the thread too much, but usually this for the precision rifle. http://precisionmultigun.com/pics/620-eq4.jpg
ammo for each depends on what i'm doing (match course of fire, or other). generally i can carry about 30 rnds of long gun ammo and 120 rnds of carbine. plus about 60 rnds of pistol in loaded mags, plus whatever i need in available space in the pack. i need to work out more, but with other gear i can handle maybe 10 lbs more of misc ammo.
ammo for each depends on what i'm doing (match course of fire, or other). generally i can carry about 30 rnds of long gun ammo and 120 rnds of carbine. plus about 60 rnds of pistol in loaded mags, plus whatever i need in available space in the pack. i need to work out more, but with other gear i can handle maybe 10 lbs more of misc ammo.
those are 27s but yes, i agree. you should start a new thread about your GPR / NVS and Cans. I'd love to see some pics and hear your experiences. To be honest I did make an attempt at a GPR this year but it hasn't worked out so far... (final pics and specs on 2nd page of this thread www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=713477 )
d2wing
Member
- Joined
- Nov 10, 2008
- Messages
- 6,416
As far as scopes, the 1-4 is a good hunting scope but not too good for target shooting at long range, the reticles are usually thick for quick shooting. For 600 yards you are going to need a higher power good quality scope. In lower priced scopes the Vortex is a good call. I prefer the better eye relief of the Leopold but you have to get a VX ll or higher in my opinion to get the clarity of the Vortex.
For all around I like the 2-7 or 3-9 40mm scopes, but depending on the type of hunting you do you may want 4-12 50 mm to give you a better pic at 600 yards.
The .308 seems to be a good call but to cover more bases 30-06 would be a great call. Several makers make 1 MOA rifles in .308 out of the box, tactical and varmint versions. There is more aftermarket support for the Remington but most
Brands have accurate rifles.
For all around I like the 2-7 or 3-9 40mm scopes, but depending on the type of hunting you do you may want 4-12 50 mm to give you a better pic at 600 yards.
The .308 seems to be a good call but to cover more bases 30-06 would be a great call. Several makers make 1 MOA rifles in .308 out of the box, tactical and varmint versions. There is more aftermarket support for the Remington but most
Brands have accurate rifles.
Mike1234567
member
My choice was .30-06 because it has more versatility than .308 Win and can be downloaded to .30-30 ballistics and even less. Granted, it's a long action but that's a reasonable trade-off for me. Currently, my only other center fire rifle is a .223 Rem. With proper ammunition choices, these two calibers cover (well enough) virtually any (non-specialized) need for a (center fire) cartridge in the entire country. Had I more spare cash I'd definitely have more choices at my disposal and, at one time, I did. But things changed for me so I had to downsize. BTW, my CF rifles are both Savage Axis... cheap and boring but accurate and reliable.
d2wing
Member
- Joined
- Nov 10, 2008
- Messages
- 6,416
I posted that my 7MM 700 was my GP gun, but my other GP gun I use is a 742 with a Redfield 2-7 scope and I also have a 7400 that I am mounting a Nitrex 3-9 on. I also have an AR with a 1-4 on it. I am comfortable with all of them as a GP rifle but it depends on what bases you consider most important and your situation and skills. I give up some reliability with the 742 but gain fast follow up, less recoil and I like how it handles. This one is very accurate for a semi auto. The 30-06 gives me the power and range to kill at any reasonable range and angle on a deer. It also has see through mounts which if you hunt in freezing rain and heavy snow come in handy. I know this is outside the OP criteria but there are choices that may fit other people better. Not a great rifle for 600 yards but not impossible either as I hit pop up targets at 600 yards with an M-14.
Old Shooter
Member
Just to add a note about ammo availability...
During the worst of the ammo shortage about the only ammo on the shelf in the local
Wal-Mart was .270, 30-06 and 7mm Rem Mag. And there was plenty of that. I already have an '06 but am considering adding either a .270 or 7mm mag "just in case".
During the worst of the ammo shortage about the only ammo on the shelf in the local
Wal-Mart was .270, 30-06 and 7mm Rem Mag. And there was plenty of that. I already have an '06 but am considering adding either a .270 or 7mm mag "just in case".
Sheepdog1968
Member
As for general rifles, my two main hunting rifles are the closest thing to an all around rifle.
One is a 30-30 lever action that's been shortened to make it a handy compact carbine. It sports a 2.5x Leupold scout scope and has iron sights. I've hit 24" square steel out to 400 yards with it. For hunting, with the Leverevolution rounds, I am confident on making the shout out to 200 yards.
The other hunting rifle is a Rem 700 in 30-06 with a fixed 4x scope.
I'm happy with both. The 30-30 though is by far my favorite.
One is a 30-30 lever action that's been shortened to make it a handy compact carbine. It sports a 2.5x Leupold scout scope and has iron sights. I've hit 24" square steel out to 400 yards with it. For hunting, with the Leverevolution rounds, I am confident on making the shout out to 200 yards.
The other hunting rifle is a Rem 700 in 30-06 with a fixed 4x scope.
I'm happy with both. The 30-30 though is by far my favorite.
- Status
