Getting ready for my first reload... primers question

[ZeviB]

Greetings!

So (I think...) I got almost everything ready for the first 9mm reload: - wet-tumbled brass (very shiny!), Lee dies on the Hornady LNL AP, powder (Titegroup, Longshot, Accurate #5, #7), Berry bullets, and.... I managed to find (locally) some Federal No. 200 small pistol magnum primers.

According to the guy at the store (and my impression from reading some posts), I'm totally fine using the magnum primers as if they were just small pistol. But he told me to make sure I start with the low-load side of things.

My first 2 questions are:

1. Can I use these magnum primers like that?
2. Would the Accurate #5 be a good choice to start with?

And one more thing about the wet tumbling: should I have deprimed (I did not) prior to tumbling?

Anything else important that you think most of the available instructions are missing?

Thanks in advance,
Zevi.

 

[Random 8]

The magnum primers will be fine. Start with the start load and work up gradually. 9mm can be fussy like that.

Which Berry bullet do you have? Would be best to use data specific to that slug as 9mm is fussy about seating depth. Too deep can get you into troubled waters quickly.

Not depriming first will be no issue so long as your cases have thoroughly dried.

Can't comment on your specific powders. I'm assuming Longshot will have similar charges to HS-6 (will check and edit if necessary). Might be a good place to start, as you'll get more case fill and more margin of error for your first loads than with a faster burning powder (AA7 might be in that same wheelhouse, not familiar with their lineup).

Edit...yeah, Longshot actually looks like a pretty efficient powder for 9mm...I may have to revisit that one VS HS-6 that I use for full power loads.

 

[film495]

I dry tumble then size and deprime. before I load the cases I wash them just in hot soapy water and rinse to get rid of any residual case lube or media hiding in any of the cases, then dry them in the oven on 250 for about an hour

measure the case length to make sure it is in spec
measur the oal, usually recommended by bullet maker
check the case diameter before and after seating a few bullets, to get neck tension, should be .002-.003 for a good grip

visually look in the charged cases with a flash light before seating the bullets, anything way off will be obvious by the powder level. so, if you do 10 or 100, you just line them up in a holder an give them all a good look.

 

[Don_P]

Test fit (plunk and spin) the first round you make before you build 100.

 

[Bcwitt]

I've used magnum primers in 9mm w several powders. No discernable difference.

 

[ZeviB]

Which Berry bullet do you have? Would be best to use data specific to that slug as 9mm is fussy about seating depth. Too deep can get you into troubled waters quickly.

The bullets are 115 gr., FMJ RN. Hornady's book has data for both Titegroup (3.7 gr.) and Accurate #7 (7.0 gr.) starting loads for that bullet. Hodgdon's data for the Longshot is 5.0 gr.

 

[Howland937]

Are you jumping in head first? Reason I'm asking is to know if these will be your first ever homemade ammo or just your first 9mm?
AA5 would be as good as any to start with...titegroup or Longshot as well. AA7 is going to get you the higher end velocities, but I'd lean toward making reliable and functional ammo first, chase performance later.

Check every round you make until you're 100% positively sure of the consistency of your process. Powder charge, neck tension, OAL. And get a Wilson 9mm case gauge.

 

[ZeviB]

measure the case length to make sure it is in spec
measur the oal, usually recommended by bullet maker
check the case diameter before and after seating a few bullets, to get neck tension, should be .002-.003 for a good grip

I'm using the Lee carbides, so I thought that especially for pistol I don't need to lube the cases; am I wrong?
Also, unlike the necked rifle bullets, I thought straight walled pistol bullets don't really stretch out?

visually look in the charged cases with a flash light before seating the bullets, anything way off will be obvious by the powder level. so, if you do 10 or 100, you just line them up in a holder an give them all a good look.

Should I take out from the LNL AP press the first 10 cases after they're charged and before seating the bullets to inspect the charge? I do plan to use Hornady's powder cop die for that

Thank you!

 

[ZeviB]

Test fit (plunk and spin) the first round you make before you build 100.

I actually had to Google how to do it exactly -- https://www.shootingtimes.com/editorial/reloading-tips-the-plunk-test/99389
Good point - thanks!

 

[Howland937]

If you're using the powder cop die, you won't need to visually inspect each powder charge. You won't need to lube or measure/trim brass.

Starting out on a progressive is sorta like learning to drive in a race car. It's doable though, just work on making good ammo first, then you can speed up the process.

 

[Mark_Mark]

I actually had to Google how to do it exactly -- https://www.shootingtimes.com/editorial/reloading-tips-the-plunk-test/99389
Good point - thanks!

Yes, Plunk.... but do you know the Macarena test?

 

[Stevenvalleyky]

Most of those powders you listed will work well but I would recommend using the longshot as it will have the best casefill so you are more likely to catch a double charge. I would suggest checking the powder charge of every single case before loading the bullet.
Lastly, you dont need a case guage, your chamber is your case guage. Plunk test will tell you what you need to know. Just go slow and double check everything and first and you will naturally get faster as you get more comfortable.

 

[Howland937]

Lastly, you dont need a case guage, your chamber is your case guage

True...guess I was thinking about having more than one gun in that caliber.

 

[ZeviB]

Are you jumping in head first? Reason I'm asking is to know if these will be your first ever homemade ammo or just your first 9mm?
AA5 would be as good as any to start with...titegroup or Longshot as well. AA7 is going to get you the higher end velocities, but I'd lean toward making reliable and functional ammo first, chase performance later.

Check every round you make until you're 100% positively sure of the consistency of your process. Powder charge, neck tension, OAL. And get a Wilson 9mm case gauge.

Yeah - head first... First homemade ever... (it sounds scary just typing it...)

I assume AA5 is Accurate #5? I'm beginning to understand why people were advising me to get several loading manuals... The Hornady manual does not specify data for #5 under this bullet, but it lists the data for #2 and #7; both starting loads that I listed above are for 1000 fps. The Western Powder manual offers data for #2, #5, and #7 for 9mm and that bullet - all starting loads are for bout 1000 fps.

Having said that, I totally believe in "making reliable and functional ammo first, chase performance later."
Assuming I set the Lee crimp die correctly - how do I verify the neck tension beyond that?
About the Wilson case gauge, I'm starting with the plunk & spin method using the actual barrel but I was planning on getting THIS Lyman checker soon.

Thank you!

 

[Stevenvalleyky]

True...guess I was thinking about having more than one gun in that caliber.

I have multiple guns in a couple different calibers. Some have chambers a tad tighter than the other pistols of the same caliber. Occasionally I might have to make a slight seating depth change but if I make sure Im sizing everything in that caliber that will plunk in the tightest chamber I have for it and its good. The Lee FCD makes a huge difference in helping make sure they plunk good.

 

[ZeviB]

Most of those powders you listed will work well but I would recommend using the longshot as it will have the best casefill so you are more likely to catch a double charge. I would suggest checking the powder charge of every single case before loading the bullet.

I think I understand what you mean that the Longshot should be best to start (largest amount of case filling), but neither the Hornady or Lyman books list load data for the Longshot with the 115 gr. FMJ 9mm bullet; I could only find it on Hodgdon, where that powder is indeed at the top of the list (as far as largest amount of gr. in a load) at 5.0 gr. So if that logic is correct, wouldn't AA#7 be as good (or better) at 7.0 gr. for the starting load? besides, i do plan to use the powder cop to minimize overloading errors.
Thanks!

 

[Fishingted]

Berry normally shows the Over all bullet length for their bullets on their site.

 

[Stevenvalleyky]

I think I understand what you mean that the Longshot should be best to start (largest amount of case filling), but neither the Hornady or Lyman books list load data for the Longshot with the 115 gr. FMJ 9mm bullet; I could only find it on Hodgdon, where that powder is indeed at the top of the list (as far as largest amount of gr. in a load) at 5.0 gr. So if that logic is correct, wouldn't AA#7 be as good (or better) at 7.0 gr. for the starting load? besides, i do plan to use the powder cop to minimize overloading errors.
Thanks!

Absolutely, if the starting load of AA#7 is more grains than longshot, then yes, it would be a better powder to start with. Sorry, AA#5 is the slowest burning Accurate brand pistol powder I use anymore and I havent used AA#7 in 15 years or more.

 

[lordpaxman]

• Can I use these magnum primers like that?

• Would the Accurate #5 be a good choice to start with?

Yes.
Yes.

Should I take out from the LNL AP press the first 10 cases after they're charged and before seating the bullets to inspect the charge? I do plan to use Hornady's powder cop die for that

That would seriously defeat the purpose of a progressive press. DO look in each case before you place the bullet on the case mouth to see there is a powder charge in there. Your eye will be able to detect no charge or a double charge. Get additional light for the press, you can’t have enough illumination.

I strongly recommend you send back the powder cop die, and purchase the RCBS Lock out die. The powder cop die is no better than a glance in the case to insure there’s powder. The lock out die will lock the press if there’s an issue. Even with the lock out die, visually inspect the case to make sure there’s a powder charge before placing the bullet on the case mouth.

Assuming I set the Lee crimp die correctly - how do I verify the neck tension beyond that?

You’ll want to measure COL before and after: Press the bullet of the completed round as hard as you can into the bench top. I even “whack” it a few times. Also, in a safe place and in a safe way, load up a magazine and allow the slide to drive a round into battery. Some people do this with a round that doesn’t have primer or powder, for safety. Good luck.

 

[Don_P]

................ So if that logic is correct, wouldn't AA#7 be as good (or better) at 7.0 gr. for the starting load? .........

Not familiar with AA powder but powder density will determine how much bulk you'll get. 5 grains of a large flake, ball, slug or stick powder might fill more than 7 grains if it is a more dense powder.

Don't get locked in on printed OAL data, they are not written in stone. Bullet profiles vary and may seat at different depths depending on the particular barrel chamber. That's why I think it is important if / when you change bullet manufacturers / types to know how to test fit, an uncharged round and not just use an advertised OAL. Once you determine the optimal seating depth for a particular bullet and chamber you can adjust the powder charge if necessary).

 

[Goes211]

When I'm loading with a new recipe I only make a magazine worth. Then I'll test fire that batch and see if the gun functions correctly. Then I'll inspect the brass for any signs of over pressure. Finally, I'll put a few over the chrono and see if the velocity matches the recipe.
Skip any of those steps and you may end up wasting some valuable components.....or worse.

 

[WeekendReloader]

Longshot works ok for 115gn Berry's RN. (It's not my favorite, though) I loaded some up with it and it shot fine. Start low and work up. I think I ended up somewhere in the middle of Hodgdon's range before they shot well and burned clean. they were sooty at the low end of the charge weight in my pistol. This is common for some powders to burn sooty at low pressures and then get clean with higher charges. It depends on a lot of things, gun, bullet, seating depth, type of powder, etc.

Whatever powder you start with, just make a few each at increasing charge weights and you should be fine. I usually make 5 rounds each, starting at the low end and increment the powder charge by 0.1 grain. Then you can decide which charge weights you want to test more of and make a handful of those to zero in on what your gun likes.

Edit: Be aware that sometimes the lowest charge in the reloading manual may or may not cycle the action of your pistol. I found the some low charges that worked in one gun were not strong enough to fully cycle a different pistol.

 

[rfwobbly]

Welcome Aboard !

Having read the thread, here's where I see your areas of greatest concern...

1) Wet tumbling with primers in place. Any moisture left in the primer cavity will kill your reloads. You've short-cut the process, so now you'll need to take extra steps to add the needed assurance. That could include baking the cases, or simply going back and removing the primers, or other similar extra steps. But they must be done. Reloading is all about "being 100% sure".

2) OAL. The OAL listed in the recipe is NOT a recommendation. Berry RN bullets are so slim that they can be used at almost any length; Berry conical bullets often force an OAL much shorter than the one listed in the recipe. OAL is determined solely by how your bullet interfaces with your barrel. This means cartridge gauges and case gauges won't help you much, you MUST use the barrel. "One size fits all" simply does not work in auto pistol reloading. This is because no 2 barrels are alike and no 2 bullets are alike. So the combination of bullet-to-barrel always results in a unique OAL.

3) Powder level. There is no substitute for looking inside each case before placing the bullet. If you can't see, then the answer is not a Powder Cop... the answer is more light ! Get a press light from KMS Squared.

4) Tendancy. The natural human tendency will be to make 50 or 100, but please don't. If you begin loading at the Starting Load, then you'll quickly see you may need to unload 48 or 98 !! Pulling bullets is not nearly as fun as pulling triggers.

Hope this helps.

 

[Walkalong]

AA #5 works great in 9MM. The mag primers will be fine.

 

[film495]

I'm using the Lee carbides, so I thought that especially for pistol I don't need to lube the cases; am I wrong?
Also, unlike the necked rifle bullets, I thought straight walled pistol bullets don't really stretch out?
I put a little lube on all cases one way or another, just makes then run smoother, and I was them anyway in hot soapy water before loading, so - not needed to lube, but it is how I do it.

If it is your first reloads, I would certainly take a minute to measure them, every way possible.


Should I take out from the LNL AP press the first 10 cases after they're charged and before seating the bullets to inspect the charge? I do plan to use Hornady's powder cop die for that

Thank you!

Just how I do it, I look inside each case at the powder level. I don't do any real volume, so - I'm not overly automated. If it were me I'd look in each and every one, but some people don't once things are set up. I hand weigh each charge too, so - I lean hard to the not trusting anything is correct or working correctly until it has been weighed, measured, visually inspected, or calibrated. It is one of those, anything that can go wrong will things. The quality control you put in place - reduces errors. IMHO, until you have worked with a process for a good while, you'll find errors that you did not know could happen, so - going slower and checking everyting will help with that.