possummanplus3
Member
Hi, I'm wondering what's your alls opinions of the glaser safety slugs, say, with a 45 acp 1911. I'm talking how well they work, not overpenetrating, and reliability. Are these a worthy consideration for HD?
Glaser Safety slugs
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Definitely not. Gimmick ammo at best. They can make a big hole if you manage a perfectly placed shot, but they just don't penetrate deep enough for a shot at some unusual angle, as can happen with self defense.
The ironic thing is that though they don't meet the FBI's penetration requirements if you shoot someone directly, they do meet requirements if they pass through an interior wall first! So Glasers are arguably deadlier to innocent bystanders than they are to crooks.
The ironic thing is that though they don't meet the FBI's penetration requirements if you shoot someone directly, they do meet requirements if they pass through an interior wall first! So Glasers are arguably deadlier to innocent bystanders than they are to crooks.
Dan Crocker
Member
I've heard that they won't reliably cycle the action in a semi-automatic. Regardless of what else they may or may not do, that right there is a show-stopper for me.
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Gunfighter123
Member
http://thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=177203&highlight=glaser
I like and use them ---- I am still looking for the thread where I had some good links posted
I like and use them ---- I am still looking for the thread where I had some good links posted
Gunfighter123
Member
I have found most of the negitive comments are second hand. I have heard, someone told me or else the old staement they mdon't make a deep hole. They were not designed to make a deep hole and they never will.
they are designed to pentatate and fragment. They do that very well. Like the non issue with mim parts, the effectiveness of the glasser is a non issue. What they were designed to do , they do very well. It really boils down to personal choice. Like them or don't like them.
they are designed to pentatate and fragment. They do that very well. Like the non issue with mim parts, the effectiveness of the glasser is a non issue. What they were designed to do , they do very well. It really boils down to personal choice. Like them or don't like them.
pbearperry
Member
I think a Glaser in the neck would work all the time.Outside of that,they can be iffy.Sometimes in the summer when everyone is without coats,I put one first up with regular hollowpoints after them.
Gunfighter123
Member
I load as pbearperry does ---- I NEVER have a full mag of just Glasers but have Ball and hollow/soft points loaded after the Glaser.
punkndisorderly
Member
Glasers are more expensive and don't generally penetrate as deeply as other, popular bullet designs.
I think Glasers are a good option if they answer your specific need. If you live in an apartment or have people in other rooms of your house, they may be the ticket. If not, your probably better served with traditional defensive hollowpoints (gold dot, hyrdrashock, golden saber, etc).
One thing to consider: you should plan on running at least 100 rounds of whatever you plan to carry through your firearm to check for function, accuracy, and point of aim. As expensive as Glasers are, that's an expensive proposition.
Outside of the forums, I've read mixed things by established gunwriters. One story I remember reading over a decade ago is a story of an autopsy of a criminal that had been shot a few times in the chest with a .45 loaded with Glasers. When they opened him up, he was hollow. All of his organs had been jellied and ran out the entrance wounds. I've been looking for the source of this a few times but haven't been able to find it.
I think Glasers are a good option if they answer your specific need. If you live in an apartment or have people in other rooms of your house, they may be the ticket. If not, your probably better served with traditional defensive hollowpoints (gold dot, hyrdrashock, golden saber, etc).
One thing to consider: you should plan on running at least 100 rounds of whatever you plan to carry through your firearm to check for function, accuracy, and point of aim. As expensive as Glasers are, that's an expensive proposition.
Outside of the forums, I've read mixed things by established gunwriters. One story I remember reading over a decade ago is a story of an autopsy of a criminal that had been shot a few times in the chest with a .45 loaded with Glasers. When they opened him up, he was hollow. All of his organs had been jellied and ran out the entrance wounds. I've been looking for the source of this a few times but haven't been able to find it.
SCKimberFan
Member
Too high priced. A lot better other choices out there. Gold Dots, Hornaday Tap, etc
Sir Aardvark
Member
At one time Glaser's used to be the cat's pajamas, but, with all of the newer bullet technology that has been developed since Glaser's came to market, you now have much better options available for self-defense.
I remember when about your only options for "self-defense" rounds were Glaser's or Winchester Silvertips.
Multiple manufacturers now provide a plethora of bullet designs specifically engineered for self-defense - Gold Dots, SXT/Ranger, Hydra-Shok, Golden Saber, HST, TAP CQ, and the list goes on...
Available now are: prescored jackets that give reliable, consistent expansion; bonded bullets that retain close to 100% of bullet weight; a smorgasbord of bullet weights and power levels to suit nearly every need (eg: .38 special, .38 special +P, .357 Magnum - 110 grain, 125 grain, 158 grain, 180 grain, etc.).
Glaser's reputation for poor penetration, coupled with their incredible expense, has pretty much made my decision to go with the "newer" design bullets, which have an established track record of performance.
My comfort level dictates that I get something that I am reasonably assured of accomplishing the desired purpose - and in a matter of life-and-death, I find this to be of some importance.
I remember when about your only options for "self-defense" rounds were Glaser's or Winchester Silvertips.
Multiple manufacturers now provide a plethora of bullet designs specifically engineered for self-defense - Gold Dots, SXT/Ranger, Hydra-Shok, Golden Saber, HST, TAP CQ, and the list goes on...
Available now are: prescored jackets that give reliable, consistent expansion; bonded bullets that retain close to 100% of bullet weight; a smorgasbord of bullet weights and power levels to suit nearly every need (eg: .38 special, .38 special +P, .357 Magnum - 110 grain, 125 grain, 158 grain, 180 grain, etc.).
Glaser's reputation for poor penetration, coupled with their incredible expense, has pretty much made my decision to go with the "newer" design bullets, which have an established track record of performance.
My comfort level dictates that I get something that I am reasonably assured of accomplishing the desired purpose - and in a matter of life-and-death, I find this to be of some importance.
351 WINCHESTER
Member
I have limited experience with glasers in .38+p. In some lots the bullets wern't crimped very well. Shot a silver +P in gel. and it failed badly. Save your money.
Wolfeye
Member
I load them in my gun before putting on my bedside. I live in an apartment complex and am 100% sure that any non-fragmented ammo would overpenetrate.
It basically turns a handgun into a little shotgun, except that the bullet stays whole until it strikes something. I think it's a compromise in stopping power, but it makes sense to use if you live in an apartment, condo, or boat. Otherwise I wouldn't recommend it.
Other fragmented ammunition that might perform better is made by International Cartridge Corp. If you handload, I think Barnes also makes fragmenting bullets. As far as I know, they will penetrate better than Glasers but have much less chance of overpenetrating than hollowpoints. I haven't tried either yet, as I am still shooting up my supply of Glasers.
It basically turns a handgun into a little shotgun, except that the bullet stays whole until it strikes something. I think it's a compromise in stopping power, but it makes sense to use if you live in an apartment, condo, or boat. Otherwise I wouldn't recommend it.
Other fragmented ammunition that might perform better is made by International Cartridge Corp. If you handload, I think Barnes also makes fragmenting bullets. As far as I know, they will penetrate better than Glasers but have much less chance of overpenetrating than hollowpoints. I haven't tried either yet, as I am still shooting up my supply of Glasers.
Gunfighter123
Member
Anyway you can post some photos of your test ?? Also about how far away to gel block , apx. depth of penetration , barrel lgh. etc.
I have never used the silver Glasers -- I have used the blue Glasers in .357 , 9 mm and .45acp -- I did not get to try any in gel. but they went to about 6" deep in water soaked phone books --- the "spread" of the pellets was almost 10" !!!!
I would love to try some gel. tests -- - did you buy or make your gel. -- any place to buy some on the cheap side ???
moxie
Member
The .45 ACP Blue version cycles in my 1911 perfectly and has for over 20 years.
rbernie
Contributing Member
I find it interesting to note that not a single LE agency of any kind issues or recommends Glasers for its officers (presumably because of their poor penetration characteristics).
saltydog452
Member
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If we're lucky, we learn.
Blue Glassers and a PPK have traveled with me from border to border and water to water.
Not the best solution, but it was handier than a M 19.
Better options are available now.
salty
Blue Glassers and a PPK have traveled with me from border to border and water to water.
Not the best solution, but it was handier than a M 19.
Better options are available now.
salty
Tom S.
Member
Lots of folks are missing major points here!
First off, law enforcement don't use these because they are designed specifically for close quarter defense, as in 15 feet and less. They are not designed for shooting 25 yards (and further). Next, let's talk about penetration. They are designed to fragment quickly and thus do not penetrate far, but before you dismiss them for that, measure five inches on your body and think if you want something to penetrate even that far. Bullets that penetrate 18 inches go through a target and take their energy with them. The Glasser design and logic is to not over penetrate and thus disperse all their energy inside their target. Lastly, even the best expansion of a bullet will typically be double it's diameter while the Glasser shot expands to about 4 inches. This gives it a much better chance of striking a major artery or important organ like the heart.
Having said this, no hand gun bullet is the end all best solution when all factors are added in. For that reason, the suggestions of having a mixed magazine makes a lot of sense.
First off, law enforcement don't use these because they are designed specifically for close quarter defense, as in 15 feet and less. They are not designed for shooting 25 yards (and further). Next, let's talk about penetration. They are designed to fragment quickly and thus do not penetrate far, but before you dismiss them for that, measure five inches on your body and think if you want something to penetrate even that far. Bullets that penetrate 18 inches go through a target and take their energy with them. The Glasser design and logic is to not over penetrate and thus disperse all their energy inside their target. Lastly, even the best expansion of a bullet will typically be double it's diameter while the Glasser shot expands to about 4 inches. This gives it a much better chance of striking a major artery or important organ like the heart.
Having said this, no hand gun bullet is the end all best solution when all factors are added in. For that reason, the suggestions of having a mixed magazine makes a lot of sense.
hardluk1
member
Tom s ithink out got it. Most people are to hung up on penitration to under stand. Glasser in allmost the entire line has a heavy and light load. Heavy will go through winter coating and dump ALL it energy in the body and will not kill others donw range if syou have a shot through with most leo type loads. Also a different choise could also be the Powerball that will also do much the same with a more solid design bullet. Both have a long track.
Myles
Member
I've always liked the concept - guaranteed rapid dump of 100% of the kinetic energy. I understand that limited penetration, that's the point.
I've never used them, however, because I cannot afford to function fire 200-300 rounds, much less practice with the load.
I've never used them, however, because I cannot afford to function fire 200-300 rounds, much less practice with the load.
rbernie
Contributing Member
This is simply not a factor; the difference in projectile energy between 7 yards and 25 yards is very small for most handgun chamberings.
A 9mm 147gr HP, assuming a BC of .1 and a muzzle velocity of 900fps, has a velocity of 886ft/sec at ten yards and still has a velocity of 866ft/sec at 25 yards.
Police do not choose rounds based upon longer engagement distances; they choose their carry ammo based upon economy and success testing of the ammo against the FBI protocol.
While the FBI Proitocol tests against barrier penetration may be unique to LE and not HD, tests #1, #2, and #7 are very compatible both with LE and SD/HD needs.
The FBI protocol tests for terminal ballistics establishes 12" as the minimum desired penetration for a reason; because the Miami shootout (and other examples) proved that anything less was inadequate for the real world.
I recommend reading this.
Virtually nobody stands face-to-face and shoots into each others chest. Gunfights are fluid thing, with moving people and odd entry vectors. Many shots have to penetrate an upraised arm or somesuch before even getting to a torso.
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