Glaser Safety slugs

[ArmedBear]

Seriously, the problem is this:

If a round disintegrates on impact with anything (like drywall), it's the equivalent of snake shot at close range, i.e. not so good for self-defense against a determined attacker who is about to kill you.

If it doesn't disintegrate on impact with anything, it's going to go through walls.

OC spray might be a better option, or a Taser, backed up with a gun, loaded with real bullets, just in case.

 

[hardluk1]

Untill a person has seen glasser saftey slugs shot into some thing they just don't understand. Not rat shot , very controled energy loss. Not sure after ising a test on meat i can think of that could be worse would be a high velocity ballistic tip for f'n up meat.

 

[ArmedBear]

Snake shot will do that, too.

Still not a good SD round.

 

[CWL]

It basically turns a handgun into a little shotgun

Simply wrong and outright dangerous belief.

Back to Glasers, if you like them, go ahead and carry them.
The problem with Glasers and other high-expense ammunition is that the majority of people cannot afford to train regularly with them. This puts them in the category of "Magic Bullets" where faith in hardware replaces hard work and regular training.

 

[ArmedBear]

Quite true. It doesn't turn it into a shotgun.

The load, when it hits the target at a distance, is similar to a shot load AT VERY CLOSE RANGE.

That still doesn't mean I'd trust it for self-defense.

There's no free lunch: either it penetrates enough to work for SD, or it doesn't go through walls. One or the other.

 

[mljdeckard]

Go ahead and buy 200 of them to test fire for reliability in your gun. THEN decide if you feel like buying any more of them.

 

[ArmedBear]

Why would I even want to try them, though?

I don't believe they really can work as advertised, physics being what it is.

 

[doc540]

For years I carried, first, Glasers, then MagSafe's (when Joe Zambone built them).

Now I don't carry them.

One simple, common sense, explanation convinced me:

Any obstruction preventing a clear, vital organ shot could cause them to expend their energy and become virtually worthless as a personal defense round.

I no longer take that chance.

 

[RyanM]

This should be required reading for anyone who wants to use prefragmented ammo.

http://www.firearmstactical.com/tacticalbriefs/volume4/number3/article432.htm

Also this. http://www.brassfetcher.com/Brassfetcher_evaluates_9mm_Glaser_Safety_Slug.pdf

If you still choose to carry it, go ahead. It's a free country. But you absolutely need to know the limitations of the ammunition.

Prefragmented ammunition absolutely will not penetrate enough to rapidly incapacitate someone unless you shoot them in the head or neck, or dead center in the chest from straight on, with no obstructions.

Prefragmented ammo also will quite often not break up if they hit a wall, and will lose enough velocity in the wall that they will penetrate like a solid if they hit someone on the other side. Note that a Glaser safety slug penetrated 11.7" after going through a wall, meaning that it would actually be more likely to kill someone if it hit them at a strange angle or passed through a limb first (which is quite likely, if the round hits an innocent bystander or family member).

If for some reason you anticipate being able to make a perfectly placed, ideal shot, prefragmented ammo absolutely will make a bigger hole than JHPs. But only for the first 2-3" of penetration, which is why the shot must be literally perfect. Those first 2-3" must be vital tissue, because damage beyond that is minimal. If the bullet passes through an arm, or you shoot an especially muscular or fat person, or if a shot must be taken which hits someone at an oblique angle, all of the bullet's wounding potential may very well be wasted on nonvital tissue.

 

[orionengnr]

Untill a person has seen glasser saftey slugs shot into some thing they just don't understand.

Wrong again.

Most of us have read the hype, seen the staged pics of best-case scenarios, and have also read and seen what happens in the real world...and that's why we don't carry MagSafes or Glasers.

Read a few of the links in the above posts, and see if you "understand".

 

[Ron James]

Many of the statements I've seen on the above post are pure bull hockey, while many of the others are throughtful and well reasoned. Will not pentrate a dry wall, Horse hockey, no more effective than a shotshell, pure horse hockey. Like a mini shotgun, horse hockey. will not pentrate clothing, horse hockey and so on and so on. There are no magic bullets and today there are a great deal more effective loads than 20 yrs ago. But don't pull a Black Talon and dish something you know nothing about. And to the poster who asked how many bad guys have I've shot with Glassers or Mag safes I would guess as many as you have. My background includes 42 years as a life member of NRA. 26 years miltary and combat in two countries and an Island, Law Enforedment. Army Pistol Team and so on and so on. I'm no expert but I have been around the block, Have you?

 

[Dan Crocker]

I'm straight up loving some of the spelling on this thread...especially since they have a handy-dandy tool here that will fix such problems for you.

 

[ArmedBear]

And to the poster who asked how many bad guys have I've shot with Glassers or Mag safes I would guess as many as you have.

Never said I did.

I think you know my point, unless your many years and variety of experiences have made you unable to comprehend English.

...and my further point was clear, as well: either it won't penetrate drywall and it won't penetrate clothing, or it will penetrate clothing but it will also penetrate drywall. And either they act essentially like slugs, or they act like snake shot at close range -- fragmenting and spreading immediately on impact. There's no free lunch in Newtonian Physics.

As an educated person with some knowledge of various sciences including physiology, I can't see a single reason to trade these expensive "Safety slugs" which are NEITHER safe, NOR slugs, for good 230 grain JHPs.

Maybe you can.

But you haven't shot anyone with them, either.

I thank you for your service and I certainly admire the shooting ability of anyone who has shot competitively for the military, particularly since I was shooting a match with some the other day and they can shoot! This has very, very little relevance to the subject at hand, though.

 

[ArmedBear]

BTW I am genuinely interested in any personal experience that anyone has had, or that has been documented somewhere credible, shooting an attacker -- human or animal -- with Glasers or equivalent.

Anyone?

 

[bigfatdave]

What, nobody hunts with Glasers?
I thought a 9x29 Glaser would drop an attacker, why is everyone schlepping heavy rifles/shotguns through the woods when they could just pack a mousegun and take deer with these magic bullets?

To be serious, Glaser does make .44magnum and 30-06 ... why not hunt with them?

 

[LaBulldog]

Glaser Safety Slug does exactly what it was designed to do. It will loose significant amount of energy when it hits something, thus keeping life threatening ricocheting and over penetration to a minimum, IN MOST CASES.

It was designed to do maximum internal damage to a human target without over penetration thus endangering anyone behind the intended target. It will not penetrate a solid door. It will probably not penetrate a car door or vehicle glass. It is designed for face to face encounter with a life threatening bad guy. In the right circumstances, it is designed to kill, or gravely wound. It does have its limitations.

If anyone finds it lacking when they use it, then they are using the wrong ammunition for the purpose, i.e. wrong tool for the job.

 

[CapnMac]

in any personal experience that anyone has had, or that has been documented somewhere credible, shooting an attacker -- human or animal -- with Glasers or equivalent.

Srill looking in my stacks of handouts, pass-alongs and the like--I know there was a study on "failures" with glazers and the like. Low-quality-down clothing and defensive postures, both of which increase penetration distance being the mechanism. But, that's just hearsay until I find the article (found the London Metro Bikini Alert info--sheesh, organization, it's a thing).

 

[rbernie]

Glaser Safety Slug does exactly what it was designed to do.

Do you have empirical data to provide on the Glaser's terminal performance?