glass bedding: question on releasing agents

[isaiahc]

Only time JB Weld didn't set for me was when it wasn't thoroughly mixed or mixed in the correct ratio at above 40F and below 120F... But I will admit if you end up using 3 packages of JBWeld you are more than halfway to the cost of the Acraglass kit. Which already has anything for you. I've never had JBWeld crack after setting either but it will get harder after a couple days it's called curing. Shrinkage did not seem to be an issue and it indeed tightened up the groups on my savage axis. Could those groups be tightened up more with acraglass? No way to find out now. I said it once and I'll say it again... on an inexpensive gun I wouldn't think about it that much you run the risk of spending more money and it never making a difference. LIke you said you already have tons of JB Weld.

 

[huntinfool87]

I use kiwi natural shoe polish works great a little goes a long ways and I bed everything action,scope base and rings.

 

[Nyet]

The green kit came in, but I also started school back up so time is not as available. Plus i'm watching vids and doing research to make sure this goes as smoothly as possible. I'll post pics soon in another thread.

 

[krs]

I used JB Weld when putting together benchrest rifles and it works fine if mixed correctly. I've used Acraglass and a stuff called "MarineTec" or something like that too and all do fine.

But...all of them expand during the first part of curing (it's why you need to clamp receivers into stocks) and that expansion will cause some of the stuff to ooze out from between the parts. So you need to be on the spot with Q-tips, sticks, or whatever to keep your goo from showing when the job is done, and JB Weld, being its grey color, can be pretty obvious if your steel parts are blued and your stock isn't grey painted fiberglass. My only hesitancy to use JB Weld on an old milspec would be about it showing.

All products mentioned above will work fine as release agents. Just be sure to get it on every place where your bedding might squeeze itself into. Stock screws and other small parts can be micely locked in place if you don't think it through first..

Generally, heat will release bedding. On those bench guns I didn't use a release agent because I wanted the stock locked to the receiver. If later it needed to come apart for some reason I'd put my wife's steam iron onto the scope blocks and let it sit there until the receiver was hot to my touch. Then the two would come right apart without too much persuasion and without damage to the stock.

 

[Nyet]

Thanks KRS, Good to know. I finally got up the nuts to do the bedding. I need to do it again as I didn't put enough in on the first go around.just a couple of small spots I want to tidy up and I want to redo the tang and the recoil lug recess. I'll post some pics int he near future.

 

[JDGray]

I use jb weld to bed all my scope bases when needed, never an issue

 

[HankB]

I've always uses Brownell's release agent.

On the topic of bedding compounds, does anyone have information on how adding metal particles helps? I contacted Brownell's - which sells "atomized" metal for this purpose - and asked what sort of increase in the strength and durability the metal adds to their Acraglas products.

They told me they don't know.

I've done a number of rifles with Acraglas Gel and have always added finely powdered aluminum on the ASSUMPTION that it's beneficial, but I'd like to know HOW beneficial it is, if only to satisfy my own curiosity.

(BTW, I've done some barrel channels using regular Acraglas, and that stuff is sort of runny, even when you add the "floc" that comes with the kit.)

 

[Nyet]

Well, I finally got up the nuts to do it earlier this week. It was moderately successful in that it filled all of the real problem areas. The gun separated from the stock and I was ecstatic to see that! There were three small spots that were damaged when the gun 'detonated' and large-ish chunks of wood went missing. They are now filled and reinforced. I got the tang done ok as well as the recoil lug recess. But there were plenty of spots that didn't fill in all the way and to be honest the recoil lug recess and the receiver tang needed more attention so its back in the glass. Only problem is in my angst last time I used all of the release agent that came with the kit!!! So I am trying a lot of PAM spray cause that is what I had on hand. If this goes well, I'm taking the bolt over to a buddy's metal shop and getting the bolt handle extended and swept back. after that I sand the bolt down to 400 grit and cold blue it.

 

[natman]

I've always uses Brownell's release agent.

On the topic of bedding compounds, does anyone have information on how adding metal particles helps? I contacted Brownell's - which sells "atomized" metal for this purpose - and asked what sort of increase in the strength and durability the metal adds to their Acraglas products.

They told me they don't know.

I've done a number of rifles with Acraglas Gel and have always added finely powdered aluminum on the ASSUMPTION that it's beneficial, but I'd like to know HOW beneficial it is, if only to satisfy my own curiosity.

(BTW, I've done some barrel channels using regular Acraglas, and that stuff is sort of runny, even when you add the "floc" that comes with the kit.)

The regular Acraglas in the red box is for mending stocks. Because it's so runny you can get it into tiny cracks.

For bedding Acraglas GEL in the green box is vastly superior. It's the consistency of warm peanut butter and is far easier to work with, no floc-ing around necessary.

 

[natman]

Well, I finally got up the nuts to do it earlier this week. It was moderately successful in that it filled all of the real problem areas. The gun separated from the stock and I was ecstatic to see that! There were three small spots that were damaged when the gun 'detonated' and large-ish chunks of wood went missing. They are now filled and reinforced. I got the tang done ok as well as the recoil lug recess. But there were plenty of spots that didn't fill in all the way and to be honest the recoil lug recess and the receiver tang needed more attention so its back in the glass. Only problem is in my angst last time I used all of the release agent that came with the kit!!! So I am trying a lot of PAM spray cause that is what I had on hand. If this goes well, I'm taking the bolt over to a buddy's metal shop and getting the bolt handle extended and swept back. after that I sand the bolt down to 400 grit and cold blue it.

Johnson's Paste Wax if you think you'll ever need that much. Kiwi Neutral Shoe Polish if you'll only need a smaller amount. It's cheap and available everywhere.

 

[Cemetery21]

Hank "On the topic of bedding compounds, does anyone have information on how adding metal particles helps? "
I've used a lot of epoxy with stainless steel filler. The last of my stock has an Army NSN and was made by Chemence Inc., Alpharetta, GA. I don't see anything on their site that looks like it.
Looks like Devcon and Masterbond have metal filled epoxies.

 

[Oldschool shooter]

Silicone based release agents work very well and are not that expensive. If you can't find something like that at the local hardware store, most industrial supply shops have them. Regardless of what you use, always put a coat of paste wax on the metal first, paste wax and release agent and you will never have a problem removing the stock from the metal.

 

[Nyet]

OK, I screwed up somewhere. I saturated every square inch of the receiver with Pam cooking spray, I was told this would work fine, and I can't get the screws out of the action. I've tried putting the screwdriver into the screw slot and raging on it with a rubber mallet, I tried heating with a soldering iron, and I broke two screwdriver drill bits trying to get these to budge. what are my options? I was thinking of drilling out the screws and buying a new magazine...

***Update***
I went ahead and bought another magazine anyway, I did bend the one I have pretty bad trying to get the screws to budge...

 

[BBBBill]

Did you get bedding compound on the screws? Plug all of the receiver openings to prevent mechanical lock?

 

[Nyet]

I put ample release agent in the threads of the receiver and mag and all over every square inch of the receiver/barrel. I ended up taking it to a gun smith this morning and he got it apart ok, but with great difficulty. There was sufficient release agent used but the threads of the screws had play and a lot of glass got compacted in there really good and just made it super tight. My tools were to ****ty and cheap to do the job properly. He only charged me $25 to do it and I am back in business!

 

[FROGO207]

FWIW I worked in a couple boat yards around here making fiberglass boats from mold halves. The first thing we did was buff the molds and then put 5 coats of Johnsons paste wax on polishing well between coats. Never had a problem releasing them. Also should wax the screws as well. I have used epoxy, fiberglass resin, and body filler to bed stocks with. just mix correctly and make sure it is the correct consistency to work as needed. I used a product called "glass bubbles" to thicken the epoxy or fiberglass resin.

 

[Nyet]

Hey guys, just wanted to say thanks for all the advice, information, and support. This project is coming together nicely, and I can't wait to post pics!

 

[243winxb]

wow- glad your ok now

Hungarian M44. I use the red box ACRAGLAS. Petroleum jelly as a release agent and latex puddy to fill voids. The jelly is a fast clean up, unlike the release agent that comes with the kit. The glass runs down the stock screw holes that are drilled oversize before and after bedding. Extra jelly on the stock screws.

 

[jason.jardine72]

I think everyone is using leather polish like shoe wax I saved and used vasoline worked perfectly

 

[shooter54]

FWIW I did a little test using the Kiwi and Johnsons wax. IF you use the Quick JB weld it will get hotter than the longer cure version (seems like).I used JB quick, and the Johnsons was a little easier to remove the metal part (scrap 2x2 and saw cut aluminum scrap-same pieces used. ) I have heard people using Acu-Glass bedding, JB steel epoxy, also Marine Tex and Devcon 10110 are popular (it is like peanut butter when mixed).IMO It looks like most anything epoxy wise will/would work if all prep work and release agent used being equal. My question would be how long will these epoxies/bedding agents remain intact undamaged after solvents, oils, etc. And which ones hold up longer. I am waiting on an order of Devcon 10110 to bed my pillars and action on my .308 My choice of release agent is Johnsons paste wax-I have a big-ol can of it.