Glock 27 rumor true?
- Thread starter TheProf
- Start date
- Status
fineredmist
Member
The decision to go with a Glock 27 or a S&W is up to you but as far as your two points are concerned;
1. Rumors are just that, rumors.
2. Limp wristing - remember, the smaller the gun or grip the more difficult it is to hold. I have a G19, G23, and a G26 and from personal knowledge the G26 requires more practice to shoot well. I have magazine extentions for the G26 which makes it easier but the problem is with the rear of the grip which is short. Think about this, the G27 is .5" shorter and .5" less in height than the G23 and that doesn't make much difference in concealability but it does make a difference in shootability.
The Glock design has a lower center of bore axis than the S&W which adds to the controlability of muzzle flip.
1. Rumors are just that, rumors.
2. Limp wristing - remember, the smaller the gun or grip the more difficult it is to hold. I have a G19, G23, and a G26 and from personal knowledge the G26 requires more practice to shoot well. I have magazine extentions for the G26 which makes it easier but the problem is with the rear of the grip which is short. Think about this, the G27 is .5" shorter and .5" less in height than the G23 and that doesn't make much difference in concealability but it does make a difference in shootability.
The Glock design has a lower center of bore axis than the S&W which adds to the controlability of muzzle flip.
71Commander
Member
Don't know about any rumors but have seen 3 Glocks KB and were all 40's. I had the pleasure of ROing at USPSA matches when it happened. All three were using handloads. Glock 40's have an unsupported chamber.
Radagast
Member
All .40 cal glock failures (Kabooms) that I am aware of occurred with reloaded ammunition. So stick to factory ammo and you should be right.
Limp wristing can occur, but you have to work at it. I've never seen a limp wrist failure when the pistol was held normally. If you have very weak or small hands this may be a problem for you, but if that is the case then you are probably better off with a revolver as you will not have to rack a slide.
The best recommendation any one can give you is buy the one that fits your hand best.
Limp wristing can occur, but you have to work at it. I've never seen a limp wrist failure when the pistol was held normally. If you have very weak or small hands this may be a problem for you, but if that is the case then you are probably better off with a revolver as you will not have to rack a slide.
The best recommendation any one can give you is buy the one that fits your hand best.
Although the risk of kabooms in .40 S&W Glocks has been overblown, I don't think it was merely a rumor or myth but rather the result of a design compromise to help ensure reliable feeding (i.e. leaving a portion of the case unsupported allows for a shallower feed ramp angle). That said, from everything I've heard and seen, the designs of the chambers and feed ramps in Glocks chambered in this caliber have been modified to give virtually full case support (somebody check me on this), and the slightly increased chance of kabooms (mostly with reloaded ammo) should be a thing of the past.
Likewise the major issues with the M&P have been fixed by now, such as feed issues and strikers tending to break when dry-firing. Both designs are simple, practical, and dead reliable--you can't go wrong with whichever you choose.
In my experience and from what I've heard from others, Glocks are more prone to limp-wristing than most other semiautomatic pistols, including the M&P. However, this mostly affects the 9mm Glocks. It's not that easy to limp-wrist a .40 S&W Glock--you'd really have to try to do it deliberately or have to be unable to grip the gun securely for some reason. For some people this may be a deal-breaker, but for the vast majority of owners it's a non-issue and they have complete faith in their Glocks. If you're concerned about this issue (e.g. some folks demand that the gun function even if their hands are injured and slick with blood, and are therefore unable to get a secure grip), then the M&P would be a good alternative (and its infamous slide serrations are so grippy that you could slick your hands up with axle grease, lard, and snot, and still rack the slide with light fingertip pressure
).I did because I think its ergonomics suit me better, relatively speaking, but whether you should for this or other reasons is entirely up to you. Certainly you should try shooting them both, if you haven't already, to find out which you prefer subjectively and in terms of comfort. M&Ps still have a few issues of their own, such as reports of abnormal rusting still coming in, although this issue (caused by the surface treatment occasionally actually spoiling the natural corrosion resistance of the slide's stainless steel) has largely been addressed, and instances, once all too common, are rare these days (and if you're unlucky enough to get an improperly-treated slide, then S&W will replace it for you--they've changed to a different vendor that is doing a much better job, so recently manufactured M&Ps should be fine in this regard).
All guns have certain issues, but these two designs are generally very solid.
Apart from the guns themselves, some hate S&W and will never forgive them for some things that the previous owners/management had done, while others prefer the company over Glock because of their reputation for taking care of their customers and warranty issues (e.g. fully transferable lifetime warranty--if the gun stops working because something breaks, S&W will fix it for you whether you're the original owner or not).
Really? I don't notice much of a difference, and I couldn't tell you which is lower without comparing them side-to-side as well as in-hand. Either are lower than you'll find virtually anywhere in this general class of handgun save for the HK P7, and neither is more difficult to control than the other to me (although I think the M&P is a tad more comfortable to shoot overall, especially in .40 S&W).
Last edited:
Kingofthehill
Member
- Joined
- Jun 25, 2009
- Messages
- 1,806
The glock .40 kaboom's are in fact true. They are also very very rare.
Id get the M&P anyways. Its a nicer gun and its designed on the .40 round.
JOe
Id get the M&P anyways. Its a nicer gun and its designed on the .40 round.
JOe
It is a half inch shorter in the slide and barrel, and a full inch shorter in the grip, and it makes a tremendous difference in concealability, unless you insist on messing it up with a magazine extension. So much of a difference that I was carrying one for a summer in what I believe are known as "board shorts" and a fairly slim tshirt, and at the time I was beginning my slow process of puffing up. I've since begun the deflating process, but it isn't as easy as I remember.
Mine also shoots SO much better without any magazine extensions, I suppose if ammunition were to kaboom in it my pinky may suffer unless the slide could open enough to vent gasses that way. I tried the extensions, they feel bad, they pinch my ring finger, and I lose the mysterious laser-like features of the 27.
It shoots better than my 23, better than the Sigma I owned, as good as or better than the USP I own, about as well as the FNP-9M I own.
Last edited by a moderator:
Hangingrock
Member
There is a certain amount of non factual information concerning Glocks that circulates on forums.
You may want to, but then you may not want to purchase this book. The Glock in Competition a Shooters How to Guide 2nd Ed. There are two chapters which are must reads (Hand Loading for the Glock) and (The Exploding Glock, Fact or Fiction? By Mark Passamaneck, P.E. TY40422).
No I’m not going to give a outline of the chapters and findings.
You may want to, but then you may not want to purchase this book. The Glock in Competition a Shooters How to Guide 2nd Ed. There are two chapters which are must reads (Hand Loading for the Glock) and (The Exploding Glock, Fact or Fiction? By Mark Passamaneck, P.E. TY40422).
No I’m not going to give a outline of the chapters and findings.
71Commander
Member
No. Not improperly loaded ammo. Handloaded ammo, period. If you used virgin brass, it would lessen the likelyhood of a KB.
I can tell while resizing brass if it had been shot out of a Glock. I ended getting a EGW undersize "U" die.
Handgunner
Member
- Joined
- Oct 19, 2008
- Messages
- 197
With so many others to choose from, why take the chance?
surfinUSA
Member
I've had two g27s. They are great guns. I stupidly sold one for another gun then ended up buying another.
They are light, easy to carry in a suit pocket, powerful, accurate, reliable and imperious to harsh conditions and can be detail stripped in about 5 minutes. Consequently I consider them one of the finest carry guns made, regardless of if its inner city ccw, on the boat or out in the woods.
When I read internet stories of Glocks especially 40s KBing. I always take out my G27 and put at least 50 rounds through it just to prove them wrong (but really just to remain proficient and I really like shooting the gun).
Good luck with yours if you get it. My son has a S&W m&P 40 he has no problem with it, but when his friends shoot it sometime the mag drops out when it shouldn't. That has never happened when I shoot it, but when I shoot it the slide locks back before the magazine is empty. Consequently, I'm Sticking with Glocks, they always work for me regardless of frame size or caliber. Looks like I'm off to the range again.
Oh by they way, If you're old enough and been around guns long enough I'm sure you've seen the pics of Colt 1911s and revolvers, S&W and rugers KBing too. This isn't some thing new or only related to Glocks. But it is usually related to reloads or an unnoticed squib load quickly followed by a full load.
They are light, easy to carry in a suit pocket, powerful, accurate, reliable and imperious to harsh conditions and can be detail stripped in about 5 minutes. Consequently I consider them one of the finest carry guns made, regardless of if its inner city ccw, on the boat or out in the woods.
When I read internet stories of Glocks especially 40s KBing. I always take out my G27 and put at least 50 rounds through it just to prove them wrong (but really just to remain proficient and I really like shooting the gun).
Good luck with yours if you get it. My son has a S&W m&P 40 he has no problem with it, but when his friends shoot it sometime the mag drops out when it shouldn't. That has never happened when I shoot it, but when I shoot it the slide locks back before the magazine is empty. Consequently, I'm Sticking with Glocks, they always work for me regardless of frame size or caliber. Looks like I'm off to the range again.
Oh by they way, If you're old enough and been around guns long enough I'm sure you've seen the pics of Colt 1911s and revolvers, S&W and rugers KBing too. This isn't some thing new or only related to Glocks. But it is usually related to reloads or an unnoticed squib load quickly followed by a full load.
Last edited:
AKElroy
Member
+1. I love my G27, it is my primary CCW. I have thousands of rounds through it, have had it since they were first released, 10 years or so? Other than a few lite strikes with Wolf ammo due to a dirty FP channel, it has been flawless. Not a single double feed, stovepipe or FTE.
I added Novak Trijicon's, extended slide release, Pachmayer slip on & stainless guide rod. It is pretty much my perfect idea of a CCW. I pocket carry when wearing slacks (wihich is most of the time) in a Desantis Nemesis. I feed it DoubleTap 165g Gold Dots, two spare mags in the offside pocket to keep my pants level.
It is amazingly accurate for it's size, I shoot it as well as my 5" series 80.
Attachments
DERGLOCKINMEISTER
Member
AND A KIA WILL BLOW IF YOU BURN STRAIGHT ALCOHOL ! Don't blame the gun for a mistake of the reload . I own lots of guns , I only carry my Glock . If you dont like a gun , don't own one , but try not to make stuff up to justify it .
AKElroy
Member
Yes, it has a partially unsupported chamber. I am not an engineer, but I would guess this design provides more reliable feeding. I will take minute KB risk, especially since I do not reload, in exchange for an extremely reliable weapon. I have never put as many rounds through any auto without some kind of failure to feed as I have this Glock. I trust it completely.
NoAlibi
Member
Glock 27 Owner
Manco - Excellent critique.
This has been my experience as well and I agree with you here.
Reliability of extraction can be enhanced by over sizing the chamber (within reason) as well. I miked the brass out of my early G27 and found that the head had been expanded by 8 thousandths of an inch. In some rifle cases an expansion of 8 TEN thousandths is too much - I don't know how this relates to pistol cases whose heads are no where near as stout. IMO I believe that this is too much expansion and each firing further weakens the case making it an even greater risk in an unsupported chamber.
I ONLY used once-fired brass in my G27 and in well over 2000 rounds using CAST bullets I never experienced any problems - not even a failure feed, fire or extract.
I recently bought a currently manufactured G27 (made in 2009) for my fiancee that I'll be test firing/breaking in at the range this Monday or Tuesday. It's my understanding that these later models have smaller chambers and I'll be bringing my caliper to see what the case head expansion is. I'll report my findings afterward.
Manco - Excellent critique.
This has been my experience as well and I agree with you here.
Reliability of extraction can be enhanced by over sizing the chamber (within reason) as well. I miked the brass out of my early G27 and found that the head had been expanded by 8 thousandths of an inch. In some rifle cases an expansion of 8 TEN thousandths is too much - I don't know how this relates to pistol cases whose heads are no where near as stout. IMO I believe that this is too much expansion and each firing further weakens the case making it an even greater risk in an unsupported chamber.
I ONLY used once-fired brass in my G27 and in well over 2000 rounds using CAST bullets I never experienced any problems - not even a failure feed, fire or extract.
I recently bought a currently manufactured G27 (made in 2009) for my fiancee that I'll be test firing/breaking in at the range this Monday or Tuesday. It's my understanding that these later models have smaller chambers and I'll be bringing my caliper to see what the case head expansion is. I'll report my findings afterward.
Last edited:
Ok...just got done doing more research on this...this is what I was thinking...
1. Purchase the G27.
2. Get a fully supported aftermarket barrel. (I'm thinking that this would reduce chances of a KB......albeit a rare thing. By the way, can I purchase this at most local gun smiths...or would I have to special order this? Would this make my Glock safer..but less reliable?)
3. Never use reloads of any kind. Only fresh factory loaded ammo.
Guys...comments????
1. Purchase the G27.
2. Get a fully supported aftermarket barrel. (I'm thinking that this would reduce chances of a KB......albeit a rare thing. By the way, can I purchase this at most local gun smiths...or would I have to special order this? Would this make my Glock safer..but less reliable?)
3. Never use reloads of any kind. Only fresh factory loaded ammo.
Guys...comments????
AKElroy
Member
I would forget the new fully supported barrel. If you have the cash & want a spare, get it in 9mm & shoot it in your G27 for cheap practice & no KB risk. Pop in the .40 stock barrel for carry.
MCgunner
Member
I understand Glocks have problems with cast bullets and as most of my reloads are with cast bullets, could be a source of a KB for the unknowing, I guess. I don't and won't own a Glock anyway. I don't wanna have to buy an after market barrel just to shoot it. Don't care for the trigger system, anyway.
Most little .40s seem to have the limp wristing problem more than the smaller calibers. I figure it's a problem with grip with novice shooters, the grip usually being pinky fingerless. A finger extension magazine could help, there.
Don't care for the trigger system, anyway.Most little .40s seem to have the limp wristing problem more than the smaller calibers. I figure it's a problem with grip with novice shooters, the grip usually being pinky fingerless. A finger extension magazine could help, there.
NoAlibi
Member
Link with Info and photos of Glock kaBooms
TheProf - Do yourself a favor and go tho the link in this post.
It is from the Glock Pages forum in The Gun Zone site. This deals with ALL Glock kaBooms and is titled "Glock kB! FAQ v1.35" and it shows several photos of those kaBooms.
http://www.thegunzone.com/glock/glock-kb-faq.html
Hope this gives you the perspective you're looking for.....Doc
TheProf - Do yourself a favor and go tho the link in this post.
It is from the Glock Pages forum in The Gun Zone site. This deals with ALL Glock kaBooms and is titled "Glock kB! FAQ v1.35" and it shows several photos of those kaBooms.
http://www.thegunzone.com/glock/glock-kb-faq.html
Hope this gives you the perspective you're looking for.....Doc
Action_Can_Do
Member
- Joined
- May 28, 2005
- Messages
- 574
I thought the modern Glocks got a fully supported chamber about 2 years ago?
gb6491
Member
I'm not sure when it happened, but it does appear that Glock addressed the issue.
Here's a photo that SargeMo posted in this thread on GT:
I got my G27 in 2008: here is a photo of its barrel (there are also barrels from a Kahr CW45, SIG229, and SA 1911-A1 in the photo):
My photo is a composite of an older one with the SIG in it and one today with the G27 in it. I would have done them all as one today, but I sold the SIG sometime back (still I think it is good for comparison).
Regards,
Greg
DevilDog0402
Member
I have seen pics of a S&W M&P .40 that was blown up reportedly firing reloads.
I own 2 glocks (a .40 and a .357 Sig) and the chambers don't seem to be any less supported than any of my other pistols, although one was purchased in 2000 and the other in late 2007, so Glock may have already corrected the problem...
I'm not worried about my Glocks blowing up and I wouldn't worry about a Smith/Sig/XD/HK or any of the other polymer guns from reputable manufacturers.
I own 2 glocks (a .40 and a .357 Sig) and the chambers don't seem to be any less supported than any of my other pistols, although one was purchased in 2000 and the other in late 2007, so Glock may have already corrected the problem...
I'm not worried about my Glocks blowing up and I wouldn't worry about a Smith/Sig/XD/HK or any of the other polymer guns from reputable manufacturers.
- Status