Good inexpensive kit

[FROGO207]

Well if everyone had a six figure income the Lee products might not enjoy such a success. A LOT of us will never be able to get the blue big buxx tools. We can still reload however due to the Lee's of this world. And saying that a Dillon will make better ammo is pure BS. I see that those that have the most expensive firearm, press, etc often see the need to brag it up IMHO. To each their own as the saying goes but putting down others equipment for any reason is not High Road in my book.

 

[RandyP]

In this hobby you trade $$$ for rounds per hour output and 'features'. At a VERY relaxed pace I am getting:

Lee Single stage = 50-60 rounds per hour batch loading
Lee Turret = 150-175 RPH - 4 handle pulls make one completed round

If you want high output you shop the many progressives out there. Dillon is said to be the "caddy' in that marker and carries matching price tag. THey are great products but no way I can afford them, or frankly need that much output.

Progressive Presses = Hundreds of rounds per hour - one handle pull makes one completed round

I agree that nobody makes a 'junk' product. Match your realistic ammo needs to your budget.

 

[rfwobbly]

OK!!!! Once again someone brings up Lee and the Lee bashers come out.

Lee has more then likely brought more people into the reloading hobby than anyone else.

What OH what is wrong with plastic, take a good look at your car or truck today or the machines that can keep you alive in the hospital for that matter.

I agree. I'm lucky enough to have a Dillon, but that doesn't make them right for everyone. Mercedes makes a great car, but that doesn't mean it's right for hauling construction materials. Just like with vehicles, you'll come out best matching the need to the solution.

When you can match the press to the requirements, any reloading kit can pay for itself in less than one year. Just like shopping for vehicles, you don't want to buy too much OR too little.

 

[James2]

Lee dies will serve you well, claiming the complete line on Lee is sub-par because of their lock rings is a bit of a stretch to say the least.

BTW, Pick up a Lyman reloading manual as an addon.

Oh my, you rag on me for saying I don't like Lee, then suggest a Lyman Manual? What's wrong with the Lee manual?

The point that needs to be made in this discussion is: If you ranked all the brands out there by quality, Lee would probably come in last or close to it. Try to refute that!

Yes, the lee goods are less costly. You would expect that for lesser quality. You must decide for yourself what you will settle for and how much you have to spend. I am not suggesting the Lee stuff will not work, I am simply saying there is better quality stuff available. The OP needs to know this so he can make an informed decision.

 

[jcwit]

Nothing at wrong with the Lee Manual, I have one also, and use it often.

The point that needs to be made in this discussion is: If you ranked all the brands out there by quality, Lee would probably come in last or close to it. Try to refute that!

Thats your opinion and nothing more. Try to prove that!

The key word to that statement is the use of the word "probably". Nothing to substantiate it.

Can't refute it, no more than one can prove it.

Why is the cost of a product the basis for the quality of the product? Ever been a procurement officer for a fortune 500 company? I was. Value for price rules, the ability to save the company money not spend the money is the end game.

BTW I have every color of reloading equipment at my disposal, even some of the high end benchrest equipment. I just believe for someone starting out the Lee is a super value with less $$ spent. What is after 6 months the OP decides reloading is not his game and has spent $500 to $1,000 bucks in equipment.

Just saying

Different views for different folks.

 

[ryanrichmond]

Guys, chill. I came here for help and now I'm wading through arguments to find information. I appreciate all the info given and I think I'm going to look for a turret press of a little higher quality than Lee. Although I'm sure they're fine products, as I mentioned before, I don't want to be wishing I'd spent the extra money a month from now.

Thanks, everyone.

 

[jcwit]

Then by all means take a hard look at a RCBS Turrent Delux Reloading Kit.

http://www.natchezss.com/brand.cfm?brand=RC&mfgSubGroup=1725

There you go.

 

[Lost Sheep]

I absolutely hate those lock rings that don't lock. Arrrgh! This alone is enough to make me steer clear of Lee tools. I think you get what you pay for. To each his own.

I am not suggesting the Lee stuff will not work, I am simply saying there is better quality stuff available. The OP needs to know this so he can make an informed decision.

Yes, indeed. The OP (and the many others who read this thread now and in the future) needs to know that, too.

The people reading (whether they post or not) deserve our best efforts at providing supported, reasoned and well-tempered debate and advice. We may not be concise (democracy, after all is a messy process), but it should be complete.

I thank you for not painting all of Lee's gear as inadequate. But I don't think you have given some of their other equipment (other than the dies that you have) a fair shake.

The point that needs to be made in this discussion is: If you ranked all the brands out there by quality, Lee would probably come in last or close to it. Try to refute that!

I will take a stab at refutation.

In the available Auto-indexing turrets, Lee ranks both first AND last. (Lee's Classic Turret leaves Lee's Deluxe Turret in the dust.)

Lee Precision is the ONLY maker of an Auto-indexing turret press in current production. Anywhere in the world. At any price (short of having a machine shop make one for you from scratch).

Lee's "lock" rings (that only lock by the friction of the "O" ring embedded in them) are easily replaced.

If you use either Lee's Breech-lock press or Hornady's similar press, Lee's "lock" rings are easily replaced by Lee's bushings. In addition to a regular bushing, Lee makes a bushing that DOES lock the die's adjustment positively.

No, Lee's tools are NOT universally at the bottom of the heap, and Lee's designs are in several instances at the top (and some even licensed to other makers).

Ok, now I will fold up my soapbox and have dinner. Thanks for reading.

Lost Sheep

 

[altitude_19]

It's been my experience, when a press gets broken it was secretly being used for work above it's specs. The $30 c-press is not meant to resize 50 BMG, so don't be surprised when it breaks OR call it junk for doing so. That kit will probably work fine for 38/357 BUT, you will catch the bug and upgrade some things.

Although I'm sure they're fine products, as I mentioned before, I don't want to be wishing I'd spent the extra money a month from now.

Are there other cartridges in your forseeable future? If you are POSITIVE you won't be reloading anything other than 38/357 for the next 2 years, I'd do like you were planning and low-ball it. The more pricey equipment I get, the more I wish I'd gone cheaper.

 

[soloban]

I started with the same kit and here are the things that I've found (just my opinion).

* The Lee scale sucks. I replaced it with a $20 Frankford Arsenal digital scale. I'll eventually replace it with an RCBS Chargemaster 1500 or Hornady auto charge.
* Trimming lots of brass sucks with the Lee Case Length Gauge & Trimmer. I got an RCBS trimmer. I only trim rifle cartridges. I almost never trim pistol brass.
* The press has been great thus far.
* For loading pistol/revolver cartridges I really like the Lee Carbide dies
* For rifle, I prefer Redding dies


All in all it will be a good kit to get you started and you can add to it and swap out bits and pieces as you learn what you do and dont like.

 

[rsrocket1]

Congratulations Lee bashers. Now this guy is going to go out and spend several times more for some press that will do just about the same as what he wants.

If you are just starting out, buying a multi hundred dollar turret press may not be the smartest thing to do if your eventual goal is lots of pistol rounds.

I didn't know whether your budget was a couple of hundred dollars or closer to $4-500.
If it's the latter, you have quite a bit more research ahead of you.
You should consider:
Dillon Square Deal B - a great pistol only progressive press that uses proprietary dies not usable on other presses, but a fantastic pistol ammo producer

Dillon 550 - manual index progressive. Another great press that many have learned on. You can also use anyone's dies and can load rifle rounds on it.

Hornady Lock n Load AP automatically indexed progressive. 5 die stations compared to the 550's four and an arguably better value than the 550. 500 free Hornady bullets included.

Lee Pro 1000 and Load Master - don't consider these if you are frightened by the Lee bashers.

Lee Classic Cast (not the Deluxe) - probably the best value and best balance between a single stage and progressive on the market. Auto indexing speeds up pistol loading quite a bit. Again, if you are frightened by the Lee bashers, you'll avoid it.

Redding, RCBS and Lyman turret presses. Well built, but essentially single stage presses with a handle that lets you change dies by manually turning the head.

So in reality, the title "good inexpensive kit" is a little misleading.

Hey Otto, send me your pot metal Lee press, I'll invest $5 and put it back in service.

 

[jcwit]

Congratulations Lee bashers. Now this guy is going to go out and spend several times more for some press that will do just about the same as what he wants.

If you are just starting out, buying a multi hundred dollar turret press may not be the smartest thing to do if your eventual goal is lots of pistol rounds.

Absolutly right. The OP could have gotten more than his feet wet for $200, components encl. and had an excellant set up.

But hey, the economy needs all the help it can get.

 

[Lost Sheep]

Lee needs better naming conventions.

Congratulations Lee bashers. Now this guy is going to go out and spend several times more for some press that will do just about the same as what he wants.

If you are just starting out, buying a multi hundred dollar turret press may not be the smartest thing to do if your eventual goal is lots of pistol rounds.

I didn't know whether your budget was a couple of hundred dollars or closer to $4-500.
If it's the latter, you have quite a bit more research ahead of you.
You should consider:
Dillon Square Deal B - a great pistol only progressive press that uses proprietary dies not usable on other presses, but a fantastic pistol ammo producer

Dillon 550 - manual index progressive. Another great press that many have learned on. You can also use anyone's dies and can load rifle rounds on it.

Hornady Lock n Load AP automatically indexed progressive. 5 die stations compared to the 550's four and an arguably better value than the 550. 500 free Hornady bullets included.

Lee Pro 1000 and Load Master - don't consider these if you are frightened by the Lee bashers.

Lee Classic Cast (not the Deluxe) - probably the best value and best balance between a single stage and progressive on the market. Auto indexing speeds up pistol loading quite a bit. Again, if you are frightened by the Lee bashers, you'll avoid it.

The Lee Classic Cast is an excellent single stage press. The Classic Cast Breechlock is even more versatile, but is also single-stage. Lee absolutely needs a better naming convention for its tools.

I believe you are referring to the Lee Classic Turret, which (unless you need more than four die stations) is superior to every other turret press on the planet. (Obviously expressing my opinion in the strongest manner possible, matching the Lee Classic Turret's nature.)

Redding, RCBS and Lyman turret presses. Well built, but essentially single stage presses with a handle that lets you change dies by manually turning the head.

So in reality, the title "good inexpensive kit" is a little misleading.

Hey Otto, send me your pot metal Lee press, I'll invest $5 and put it back in service.

Lost Sheep

 

[Lost Sheep]

Here is some more reading for the OP

Congratulations Lee bashers. Now this guy is going to go out and spend several times more for some press that will do just about the same as what he wants.

I have more hope for ryanrichmond's (the OP) prospects of making a happy choice. I read through a sampling of his other posts. He seems capable of sifting through the heat, rhetoric and prejudice to get to the meat and the marrow.

The High Road aspires to civil debate and cordial discussion, but people are uneven in their execution of their aspirations.

I particularly recommend to him (from my post "10 Advices for the Novice Handloader") Advice #2, the paragraph about brand loyalty, and Advice #10 about verifying for onesself everything you get from casual sources.

In the meantime here is some more wading for him. I believe these threads will provide a wider, but more focused illumination of what he seeks.

Get a large mug of coffee, tea, hot chocolate, whatever you keep on hand when you read and think. Then read through these. Don't read just my posts. These threads in their entirety will be useful to you. Like manuals, which have many different authors and different writing styles and emphasis different aspects of loading, the different authors of the posts in these threads will give a wide variety of viewpoints with different styles. Some writers may "speak" to you better than others.

The "sticky" thread at the top of TheFiringLine's reloading forum is good, entitled, "For the New Reloader: Equipment Basics -- READ THIS FIRST "
thefiringline.com/forums/showthread.php?t=230171

The "sticky" thread at the top of TheHighRoad.com's reloading forum is good, entitled, "For the New Reloader: Thinking about Reloading;
Equipment Basics -- READ THIS FIRST"
thehighroad.org//showthread.php?t=238214

The latest draft of my "10 Advices..." is on post #7 of this thread,
thehighroad.org/showthread.php?p=7672653

My thread, "Budget Beginning bench you will never outgrow for the novice handloader" was informed by my recent (July 2010) repopulation of my loading bench. It is what I would have done 35 years ago if I had knownthen what I know now.
rugerforum.net/reloading/29385-budget-beginning-bench-you-will-never-outgrow-novice-handloader.html

I have a thread "To Kit or Not to Kit?" that describes differentphilosophies of buying or assembling a kit one piece at a time.
rugerforum.net/reloading/33660-kit-not-kit.html

rugerforum.com/phpBB/viewtopic.php?t=13543

Minimalist minimal (the seventh post down)
rugerforum.com/phpBB/viewtopic.php?t=107332

Thread entitled "Newby needs help."
thefiringline.com/forums/showthread.php?t=430391

My post 11 is entitled "Here's my reloading setup, which I think youmight want to model" November 21, 2010)
Thefiringline.com/forums/showthread.php?t=439810

thefiringline.com/forums/showthread.php?t=448410
scale choice

Lost Sheep

 

[Otto]

Ceiling Fan Chains on a progressive??? Why didn't Dillon think of that?

Lee's designs are in several instances at the top (and some even licensed to other makers.)

 

[jcwit]

It works right? My cruise control uses a similar chain.

 

[altitude_19]

Laws of war: If it's stupid and works, it isn't stupid.

 

[dbarnhart]

Jeez. When I started reloading I bought a Lee Loader and a plastic mallet. That, a pound of powder, some primers, and a bag of bullets and I was in business. It certainly was not high-volume, but for producing 50 or so plinking rounds every week it did the job just fine.

ANY press - I don't care what you think of its quality - is head and shoulders above how I started. I remember graduating to an RCBS Rock Chucker single-stage press. I had to save my money for a long time to get enough gear to finally retire the Lee Loader. But man-o-man I could crank out ammunition like crazy. I was living high.

Even now, if I hadn't bought another rifle in a third caliber I would probably still be reloading on the single-stage press. If you put the RCBS, Hornady, and Lee single-stage presses on the bench side-by-side they will all do their intended job equally as well.

Likewise, if you put the RCBS and Lee turret presses on the bench side-by-side they will both do their intended job equally as well. I'd bet that if you took a poll of turret press users, I'll bet you'd find more people using the Lee than all other brands combined.

What most people fail to understand, IMHO, is that each manufacturer decides which of the myriad of factors is the most important, and then creates a design that favors those factors. I think that Lee understands better than most that until you have been reloading for a while you have no idea what features and functions are important to you, and you have no idea about the places quality is important and the places it does not matter. As a result, Lee decided that low cost of entry is very important. It doesn't matter that the balance scale is not the same quality as - for example - an RCBS 505 because you are probably going to eventually replace it anyway with something that suits your particular desires.

I could probably make the same argument for everything in Lee's kit. The exception - and this is an important one I think - is the press itself. Even if you eventually end up with a Dillon 1050 you are still going to want to have a single-stage press around. (Mine is mounted to my bench and usually has the bullet puller installed). There is absolutely nothing wrong with the Lee press in this regard.

 

[billj888]

Definitely go with that Lee kit. I was in your position about nine months ago. Now I load for two rifles and two handguns. Loading one case at a time is only one of the benefits of the Lee kit. You pay close attention to the details and get each load right. If you find it necessary to load 200 or more cases at a sitting some day, spring for the progressive press then. You will know enough at that time to make a sound decision.

 

[rem22long40x]

I was raised on a RCBS rock chucker , but now use a Lee 4 hole turret press and I love it as most things I load on it I load for accuracy and once you put your case in you don't pull it out until you have a completed round . But I think every beginner should start on a single stage press

 

[Lost Sheep]

I was raised on a RCBS rock chucker , but now use a Lee 4 hole turret press and I love it as most things I load on it I load for accuracy and once you put your case in you don't pull it out until you have a completed round . But I think every beginner should start on a single stage press

I would like to point out that any turret press can be used EXACTLY as if it were a single stage press. (The Lee simply by removing the indexing rod.)

If a handloader expects to load less than 1,000 rounds a month but more than a couple hundred, and especially if he expects to load for more than one cartridge, the Lee Turret would be my recommendation.

But I am keeping my RockChucker (36 years and still going strong) as a backup to my Lee Classic Turret, nonetheless.

Lost Sheep