Jacka L Ope
Member
bogie +1. More often than not, skill and grace is appropriate when dealing with others. Especially total strangers. Better to use a tactful line rather than make ourselves out to be our own worst enemies in the public eye.
Got made yesterday
- Thread starter jojosdad
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BigSoundRacing
Member
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- Feb 2, 2007
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Everyone is jumping into the deep end of the pool over wording of a response… but that was not the question asked….
“Why the remark about shooting her”
Only she could answer that question – sounds like pure straight forward FEAR (False Evidence Appearing Real) from a previous experience that SHE had.
Nothing you could do or say, unless you are willing to take the time to have long conversations about her FEAR.
Be safe, BSR
“Why the remark about shooting her”
Only she could answer that question – sounds like pure straight forward FEAR (False Evidence Appearing Real) from a previous experience that SHE had.
Nothing you could do or say, unless you are willing to take the time to have long conversations about her FEAR.
Be safe, BSR
I think its a terrible answer. I'm guessing that people that post here are in general firearms enthusiasts and want to further our case. A snarky answer isn't going to do that. There was a young girl giving you the opporunity to tell her a little about why it might be a good thing for people to have those guns she's so scared of and you blew it. Wouldn't it be far better next time to take another 30 seconds and say something like "I have a permit from the state that allows me to carry this, lots of other people have them too. The police aren't always there when you need them. It feels good to know I'm able to protect myself and my family if I need to." You don't come off like a jerk (really it was nice of her to let you know you were showing even if she was a little scared by it - be nice to the girl), and even if she doesn't entirely get it, a seed has been planted and she knows that people other than police and criminals carry guns. Think of yourself like an ambassador for the 2nd amendment and help us keep some people out of the anti's camp.
ilcylic
Member
BSR is right, I didn't answer the question you asked.
I'm guessing she may have been afraid of getting shot because she's grown up in an environment where she's been taught that cops are the only people who should have guns, and everyone else with on is a bad guy. It's irrational, but I'm sure there are lots of people out there who simply haven't ever been exposed to firearms much.
Of course, this is lots of psychoanalizing way after the fact.
I'm guessing she may have been afraid of getting shot because she's grown up in an environment where she's been taught that cops are the only people who should have guns, and everyone else with on is a bad guy. It's irrational, but I'm sure there are lots of people out there who simply haven't ever been exposed to firearms much.
Of course, this is lots of psychoanalizing way after the fact.
10 Ring Tao
Member
At first, I agreed that 'Because I can' was a good answer.
But the others are right, in that it does nothing but strengthen the stereotype of the antisocial gun nut, which certainly doesn't seem to be the case any longer.
I do like the response, 'Why? You mean you don't?'. Of course, it should be said in an articulate and light hearted way, such that an exchange could take place.
But the others are right, in that it does nothing but strengthen the stereotype of the antisocial gun nut, which certainly doesn't seem to be the case any longer.
I do like the response, 'Why? You mean you don't?'. Of course, it should be said in an articulate and light hearted way, such that an exchange could take place.
Diesel man
member
jojosdad,
So the Don boosted your rank to capo I wish you the best of luck and I congratulate you on your achievements I myself have jumped many hoops to get to capo but now I made it to underboss.
So the Don boosted your rank to capo I wish you the best of luck and I congratulate you on your achievements I myself have jumped many hoops to get to capo but now I made it to underboss.
Folks, I wasn't being "snarky" or rude to the waitress; I spoke to her in a polite, calm manner, as I do with any stranger. None of you (save Warren) know me personally, so you have no idea of how I conduct myself in real life. When she asked me the question I was caught off guard, and that was the best answer I could come up with. I appreciate all of the suggestions on how I might have better answered her, but the question I asked didn't concern that.
CNYCacher
Member
bogie said:
Cranberry-Apple wine burns in your nose!
Oh, my take on the "Don't shoot me" remark is that maybe it was a segue into ending the conversation. Maybe she was trying to be "cute".
re: the question
I have to agree with the earlier post, she was hoping you would say you were a cop, and was afraid, or unfamiliar with firearms. If she thouhgt you were going to rob the place she would have called the cops. Most people don't even look for guns but when they see them on a hip of a stranger makes them uneasy to say the least.
Which brings the next point, reassuring her that real "good" guys carry guns so the "bad" guys don't have all the power in any way is one more person who won't be as surprised by the next gun she sees.
Just my thoughts.
I have to agree with the earlier post, she was hoping you would say you were a cop, and was afraid, or unfamiliar with firearms. If she thouhgt you were going to rob the place she would have called the cops. Most people don't even look for guns but when they see them on a hip of a stranger makes them uneasy to say the least.
Which brings the next point, reassuring her that real "good" guys carry guns so the "bad" guys don't have all the power in any way is one more person who won't be as surprised by the next gun she sees.
Just my thoughts.
bogie
Member
Well, this is something that a LOT of us are very likely to run into... If we have thought about it ahead of time, and we're prepared for the situation, we stand a lot better chance of gaining a convert to our side of thinking.
Granted. I wasn't there. But I can easily imagine her walking into the back, and picking up the phone to call the cops. "Yeah, I saw this guy with a gun, and when I asked why he had it, he said just because he could, and then he said he wasn't going to shoot me." If I was the dispatcher on that call, I'd likely have that place be real popular for a while...
Our first goal when dealing with non-gun (as opposed to anti-gun...) people should be to be nice, non-threatening, and educate. Hearts and minds, folks...
Granted. I wasn't there. But I can easily imagine her walking into the back, and picking up the phone to call the cops. "Yeah, I saw this guy with a gun, and when I asked why he had it, he said just because he could, and then he said he wasn't going to shoot me." If I was the dispatcher on that call, I'd likely have that place be real popular for a while...
Our first goal when dealing with non-gun (as opposed to anti-gun...) people should be to be nice, non-threatening, and educate. Hearts and minds, folks...
mek42
Member
Ok, I wasn't there so obviously I don't know what she was thinking nor do I even have the benefit of the tone of voice that either of you (the OP or the waitress) used. However, after reading this thread, I wondered if maybe she picked up on the OP's awkwardness and combined with the terse answer maybe thought that the OP may have been carrying with less than honorable intentions.
I live in NY and even as a (relatively new, did not grow up with firearms) shooter I was taken aback for a moment when I visited one of the local gun shops and the owner was open carrying. Granted, this was before I received my NY Pistol Permit (required to own much less carry handguns), but I think this illustrates many people not from a firearm background think that worn handgun == uniform.
The lesson I've learned from this thread is that in addition to training / preparing marksmanship and lethal force legality, those of us that carry concealed should also be preparing for how to respond when 'made'.
I live in NY and even as a (relatively new, did not grow up with firearms) shooter I was taken aback for a moment when I visited one of the local gun shops and the owner was open carrying. Granted, this was before I received my NY Pistol Permit (required to own much less carry handguns), but I think this illustrates many people not from a firearm background think that worn handgun == uniform.
The lesson I've learned from this thread is that in addition to training / preparing marksmanship and lethal force legality, those of us that carry concealed should also be preparing for how to respond when 'made'.
I am not saying the original poster was being a jerk to the waitress-- let me get that out of the way first.
However, the response could have been better.
"Because I can" IS a real and honest answer. This still does not make it the best one.
I've said what I am going to say a thousand times if I have said it once:
We are in a PR battle-- whether anyone wishes it to be so or not. As my grandfather used to tell me-- "Truth doesn't care if you believe it or not."
A LOT of people in the US have gobbled up every bit of biased, slanted information our media has told them about guns. They have no experience with them, so they don't know enough to even formulate an opinion on their own. When this occurs, people often accept the opinion that is given to them regardless of the source.
We have to accept this reality and approach it in kind.
Obviously, the waitress was uneasy. The first thing I would think to do is to set her at ease-- give her something to hold onto that helps. You never know-- she may have been through a robbery in that diner before and was in that frame of mine.
Saying something like "It's ok. I am a concealed weapons permit holder" would have most likely done wonders for her emotional state. The implication of that statement is that you are a law-abiding person who have been "checked out" by the authorities and have their "OK Stamp."
This would have been an opportunity to demonstrate to her that we are normal, everyday people who aren't what the media wishes to portray all that carry guns to be.
Something to think about:
People RARELY remember what you say to them. They ALWAYS remember how you made them feel. Most decisions are made from an emotional level and not a cognitive level. A smile, easing words, an acceptable tip would give her an impression that she will carry with her.
John
However, the response could have been better.
"Because I can" IS a real and honest answer. This still does not make it the best one.
I've said what I am going to say a thousand times if I have said it once:
We are in a PR battle-- whether anyone wishes it to be so or not. As my grandfather used to tell me-- "Truth doesn't care if you believe it or not."
A LOT of people in the US have gobbled up every bit of biased, slanted information our media has told them about guns. They have no experience with them, so they don't know enough to even formulate an opinion on their own. When this occurs, people often accept the opinion that is given to them regardless of the source.
We have to accept this reality and approach it in kind.
Obviously, the waitress was uneasy. The first thing I would think to do is to set her at ease-- give her something to hold onto that helps. You never know-- she may have been through a robbery in that diner before and was in that frame of mine.
Saying something like "It's ok. I am a concealed weapons permit holder" would have most likely done wonders for her emotional state. The implication of that statement is that you are a law-abiding person who have been "checked out" by the authorities and have their "OK Stamp."
This would have been an opportunity to demonstrate to her that we are normal, everyday people who aren't what the media wishes to portray all that carry guns to be.
Something to think about:
People RARELY remember what you say to them. They ALWAYS remember how you made them feel. Most decisions are made from an emotional level and not a cognitive level. A smile, easing words, an acceptable tip would give her an impression that she will carry with her.
John
bogie, you're right - hearts and minds are the answer -
I appreciate all of the positive ideas hat have been presented here, and will take them into consideration the next time that I can educate someone about guns or CCW.
I appreciate all of the positive ideas hat have been presented here, and will take them into consideration the next time that I can educate someone about guns or CCW.
I would have answered differently, I figure. I ride an outlaw scoot, have long hair tied back, 6' 1", 190lb, beard and the leather, scars and all that.
I try to get past my imposing appearance with friendliness and humor (when warranted).
I guess it all depends on what you're trying to accomplish.
Biker
I try to get past my imposing appearance with friendliness and humor (when warranted).
I guess it all depends on what you're trying to accomplish.
Biker
Tom Servo
Member
"Because dragging it on the ground scratches up the finish."
I've only been "made" twice. Once was by an eagle-eyed Marshall who was simply curious what I was carrying, and once by a customer at work who slapped me on the side. Given the neighborhood I worked in at the time, he seemed more relieved than shocked.
I had a friend who got stopped in Macy's once because one of the salesdroids mistook the bulge on his right hip for a gun when it was actually his telephone. Ironically, his gun was on the left hip.
If asked why, I'd go for a simple, non-threatening answer. Something along the lines of
- The police can't be everywhere
- We have a fundamental right to self-defense
- Running away isn't always an option
- Don't worry, I'm licensed, or
- Despite our best efforts to avoid it, trouble sometimes comes looking for us.
You should have said..."if you think that's a big gun...you should see the one in my pants"...
Being a CA CCW holder myself. I think the original poster answered wrong...his response should have been..."thanks miss, I didn't know my pistol was showing" and "I have a license to carry that". And leave it at that.
"Because I can" sounds like you're itching for a fight....
Being a CA CCW holder myself. I think the original poster answered wrong...his response should have been..."thanks miss, I didn't know my pistol was showing" and "I have a license to carry that". And leave it at that.
"Because I can" sounds like you're itching for a fight....
Glockman17366
Member
"Everyone is jumping into the deep end of the pool over wording of a response… but that was not the question asked….
“Why the remark about shooting her”"
"Because I can", depending on how it was said, could be intimidating. I wasn't there so, obviously, I can't say if the response was appropriate. However, her comment about "not going to shoot me..." could indicate the original poster's response was intimidating (after all...he just got made and seemed to be irritated).
Bad guys can respond "Because I can" since they think they're tough or mean.
When I got made (swept my jacket back to get my wallet...oops!, there's the glock!), the salesgirl's eyes got pretty big. I just said "Don't worry, I've got a permit", pulled my wallet out and paid for the item. Kept the whole thing pretty light hearted. This was in a Victoria's Secret, BTW.
We cannot play Monday Morning Quarterback, but as more then one response stated...we have a cultural war to get folks on our side.
A gruff or curt "Because I can" may not be helping the cause.
Just my opinion...
“Why the remark about shooting her”"
"Because I can", depending on how it was said, could be intimidating. I wasn't there so, obviously, I can't say if the response was appropriate. However, her comment about "not going to shoot me..." could indicate the original poster's response was intimidating (after all...he just got made and seemed to be irritated).
Bad guys can respond "Because I can" since they think they're tough or mean.
When I got made (swept my jacket back to get my wallet...oops!, there's the glock!), the salesgirl's eyes got pretty big. I just said "Don't worry, I've got a permit", pulled my wallet out and paid for the item. Kept the whole thing pretty light hearted. This was in a Victoria's Secret, BTW.
We cannot play Monday Morning Quarterback, but as more then one response stated...we have a cultural war to get folks on our side.
A gruff or curt "Because I can" may not be helping the cause.
Just my opinion...
another okie
Member
I agree with 50 freak. Let's win the PR war.
Smile! "Thanks for telling me. I'm sorry if it startled you, I'll try to cover it up better. I'm legal, and I carry to protect myself and everyone else."
Smile! "Thanks for telling me. I'm sorry if it startled you, I'll try to cover it up better. I'm legal, and I carry to protect myself and everyone else."
bogie
Member
Okay, guys, we've thought it out, and we've got a strategy for the next time it happens...
What other scenarios are we likely to see that we can use as opportunities to educate the public?
For instance, when I had my truck, I had a gun rack in it. I lived in a city. My neighbors would ask, and I'd get to tell them that I couldn't legally carry a gun in the truck that way, but instead I had to have it secured in a locked container if I went out to practice target shooting.
Conversation opener, and non-threatening answer. Dunno if I "converted" any of them, but they weren't scared, and likely would not vote to disarm me...
Gun rack was a good spot for the cane...
What other scenarios are we likely to see that we can use as opportunities to educate the public?
For instance, when I had my truck, I had a gun rack in it. I lived in a city. My neighbors would ask, and I'd get to tell them that I couldn't legally carry a gun in the truck that way, but instead I had to have it secured in a locked container if I went out to practice target shooting.
Conversation opener, and non-threatening answer. Dunno if I "converted" any of them, but they weren't scared, and likely would not vote to disarm me...
Gun rack was a good spot for the cane...
Double Naught Spy
Sus Venator
So, you have a vest that you wear that rides up over your gun and you got spotted by a woman in a truck stop and you don't think you need a longer vest because all you need to do is to check your back after you get out of the truck-where it rides up?
Obviously if you can't remember to do that all the time every time, then you really probably do need a longer vest or a different carry option. Your system of concealment failed you because of user error. You are fortunate you just met a Nervous Nelly and not a Panic Pam who would have called the cops for a man with a gun.
PistolNewbie
Member
At the risk of sounding crass, maybe the meat fell out of her sandwich! There are some people you couldn't explain anything to! This is a very hard one to respond to without knowing these people and being there.............
There are some people you couldn't explain anything to! This is a very hard one to respond to without knowing these people and being there.............skinnyguy
Member
jojosdad,
I think your response to her statement of not shooting her;
Even with a shrug and a friendly "because I can", she had no idea what your intent with that gun was at the time. I think because she approached you rather than going into panic mode immediately that she thought maybe you were an LEO or a legal carrier, your answer didn't lend too much in the way of an answer to that unpoken question, and she still wasn't sure if either of those were true or not when she left you at the buffet stand, so she wasn't sure whether to be scared or not.
There are alot of good answers to that question, and I've learned something about a giving a response should I find myself in that kind of situation (THANKS POSTERS), that would be something along the lines of, "If someone comes through that door and HE intends to shoot you, I'll be the one doing my best to make sure he doesn't succeed."
I think your response to her statement of not shooting her;
was pretty good under the off-guard situation you were in. It showed that there was no reason for you to shoot her, but I think that the response you gave her to why are you carrying a gun is what precipitated her question.
Even with a shrug and a friendly "because I can", she had no idea what your intent with that gun was at the time. I think because she approached you rather than going into panic mode immediately that she thought maybe you were an LEO or a legal carrier, your answer didn't lend too much in the way of an answer to that unpoken question, and she still wasn't sure if either of those were true or not when she left you at the buffet stand, so she wasn't sure whether to be scared or not.
There are alot of good answers to that question, and I've learned something about a giving a response should I find myself in that kind of situation (THANKS POSTERS), that would be something along the lines of, "If someone comes through that door and HE intends to shoot you, I'll be the one doing my best to make sure he doesn't succeed."
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