Guns on Campus - Hit This Poll

[lwknight]

Bensdad , you read about people having to leave the range because some idiot does not have the good sense to not sweep ther people with a muzzle of a condition 1 gun.
There just some people in the world that should not handle firearms.
Thats why I think there should be some kind of cencership on campus carry.

How could that be done fairly ? Well.. thats the $1,000,000.00 question.

 

[TeamPrecisionIT]

"A well regulated militia being necessary for the security of a free state, the right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed."

Sounds like a reasonable restriction..... on government. As a college student with a CHP (certified good-guy status) and an adult I should have the right to carry any weapon while on campus in whatever condition I choose to. This shouldn't be a debate, we have seen the writing on the wall with people continually taking advantage of the target rich environments that schools present due to the unarmed population within them.

As far as the LEO's are concerned, I can guarantee that the situation would be handled by the time they get there, stage, prep, stage again, and then finally get the go ahead from the brass to enter. Remember Columbine? VT? And now, UT? We are talking about a deranged individual having more than 20 minutes to carry out their devious plan without obtrusion. Whereas a lawful, non-deranged citizen (or 50) could easily overwhelm a lone (or 10) gunman even without much in the way of training. The mere tactic of fighting back will more then likely be enough to stop the atrocities being committed. One day this stupidity needs to end, we have lost a lot of life thanks to this idea that putting up a stupid sign will stop a murderer. I mean seriously, as a society, are we that naive?

Damian

 

[CHEVELLE427]

Another thing to consider is that while college students are technically adults , its an awkward age where its hard to tell the adults from the kids.
OC on campus for the typical student should be a No No.

so there to young and dumb to carry a gun on campus because it is an awkward age .

but we can send them to war,
be in charge of billion $ jets,
MILLION $ tanks,
1K$ guns,
and offering up there life so we can set here and have this debate without a government telling us we cant (YET)

NEVER did agree with that your to young to drink and smoke but your old enough to go die for your country thing.

 

[millertyme]

I imagined what it would be like when the UT Police, Austin Police and SWAT show up on campus looking for a mad gunman on campus and there are 50 to hundreds of students with guns on them.

I think this is the same concern people have about CCW in the first place - vigilantism. Of course, the students you shouldn't have to worry about are the ones who lawfully carry since they've had a background check, some level of training with their weapon (I know, this is the ideal situation), and also instruction on the use of deadly force.It's the ones who will disregard the rules in the first place people need to be concerned with.

 

[millertyme]

NEVER did agree with that your to young to drink and smoke but your old enough to go die for your country thing.

If you want to drink legally when you're 18 join the military and stay on base. They'll sell to you with a military ID and you can drink at the class 6

 

[CoRoMo]

While watching the news regarding the UT Austin shooting yesterday, I imagined what it would be like when the [strike]UT Police[/strike] building security, Austin Police and SWAT show up [strike]on campus[/strike] at the mall looking for a mad gunman [strike]on campus[/strike] at the mall and there are 50 to hundreds of [strike]students[/strike] citizens with guns on them.
What would be a good protocol for [strike]students[/strike] citizens to then follow knowing hundreds of LEO are there looking for a [strike]kid[/strike] person, who looks like any other [strike]kid[/strike] person, with a gun. Seems to me a bad situation for the LEOs. All 'gunmen situations' are bad situations for LEOs though.
And how would you as a LEO, [strike]on a campus[/strike] at a mall with many thousands (lets switch here from "50 to hundreds" to 'many thousands' now) of potentially armed [strike]students[/strike] customers, looking for one person with a gun (you probably don't know what gun yet, or whether there is more than one madmen), handle yourself?
Seems like an impossible situation, to someone like me. Suspend your disbelief for a moment and Suppose some [strike]student[/strike] customers holed up in a [strike]classroom[/strike] store sees some SWAT guy with a rifle and mistakenly, filled with great fear of course, always filled with great fear, nobody can ever maintain calm or focus ever, thinks that its the madman, then opens fire on the LEO. This of course, is a huge leap of speculation that, a person who goes through the channels to legally carry a concealed weapon isn't able to make intelligent decisions. There are a million 'what ifs' to any issue, this cherry picked one is just that, just one. Rather than putting confidence in a free and honest man, it is easier to worry about 'what if' and just vilify the liberty. Anyway, I'm not saying I'm against CC on campus (wink, wink); just that it presents numerous potential problems. Let's not focus on any of the numerous potential benefits at all. Otherwise my argument falls flat.

 

[doc2rn]

Yes 71%
No 29%

 

[Cracker jack]

I asked around at school today and they few I asked were pro ccw in school. Others said they would be worried about some one shooting a teacher or other student in anger. One girl said no she would be scared to see the gun even on a Leo. My favorit was no because it could go off accidentally go off and hurt a student or a inocent bystander. You got to love ignorance.

 

[LiveLife]

Voted YES. College students of adult age who have no criminal history are tax paying and voting citizens who deserve the right to defend themselves and others.

When I went to college in Los Angeles, we were prey (targets) for local criminals/gang members and college security told us to do whatever we needed to protect ourselves because they couldn't.

Yes: 62%
No: 38%

 

[alexp]

Comparison 18 year old Student V. 18 year old Marine.

I agree in principle the posting on this issue. The difference I see is the extent of the training and practice your marine gets. The college student receives far less training in any course or training session. Then there is the issue of supervision. Just my opinion

 

[Mxracer239y]

I agree in principle the posting on this issue. The difference I see is the extent of the training and practice your marine gets. The college student receives far less training in any course or training session. Then there is the issue of supervision. Just my opinion

This sounds like an argument against concealed carry in general. Extent of training? Thats a 'problem' with citizens vs. LEO too. "You dont have the training they do!" It was a load of crap then, its a load of crap now. Why are college students unable to train? I try to shoot at least once a week. Is that enough training? If not, what is?

I am a 22 year old adult. I don't need your supervision. I am a full time college student. I carry everywhere BUT when going to campus for class. Is that right?

 

[JHK94]

I agree with Mxracer. How is it okay for a "unsupervised" 21 -year old (jeez, when do people stop needing supervision!) unable to responsibly carry on campus, but is able to at the mall?

Also, what about staff? I am a staff member at a large university, and often have to work late at night, etc. etc. Like Mxracer, I carry pretty much all the time, except when I am on campus, which, since its my job, is most of the time. Add that to the fact that I commute by bicycle and can't even take advantage of the AZ statues that allow me to store a weapon in my car.

Edited for spelling

 

[Grey Morel]

Most of the kids at my college are just there to be babysat for 4 years and declared 'Middle Class'.

Most of them have zero exposure to guns, let alone training... Then you still have the pesky issues of responsibility/maturity. Most of them have none.

A large population of MATURE and RESPONSIBLE gun owners who are TRAINED is the best possible recipe for safety.

A large population of EMOTIONAL and CHILDISH gun owners who are UNSKILLED is a nightmare in the making.

I support their 2A right... but in all honest, I would transfer out if I knew I was in the midst of thousands of untrained frat boys with guns:r

 

[alexp]

Students training

No one said students couldn't be trained. I take no position on students carrying on campus. My problem is with any contention that a student trained is per se as qualified as a marine.

 

[CHEVELLE427]

my GF is 47 she joined the navy at 34 as for gun training she said it was slim to none,
had very little hands on.
same as a corman that was in till chief she has had very little hands on , just enough to get by.
no body said anything about Marine trained soldiers,
18 yr old lightly trained navy kid is still old enough to die for his country and knows just a little more then a collage student====MAYBE====

 

[Old Fuff]

I would say that if the worry over college students with carry permits is valid we would have seen a number of accidental, negligent, or deliberate but unjustified shootings on Utah university and college campuses, where CCW is legal, and has been for some time.

In my book actual experience beats speculation every time...

 

[Mxracer239y]

Most of the kids at my college are just there to be babysat for 4 years and declared 'Middle Class'.

Most of them have zero exposure to guns, let alone training... Then you still have the pesky issues of responsibility/maturity. Most of them have none.

A large population of MATURE and RESPONSIBLE gun owners who are TRAINED is the best possible recipe for safety.

A large population of EMOTIONAL and CHILDISH gun owners who are UNSKILLED is a nightmare in the making.

I support their 2A right... but in all honest, I would transfer out if I knew I was in the midst of thousands of untrained frat boys with guns:r

Most American citizens have zero exposure to guns, let alone training. Therefore, NO citizen can be trusted with a gun.

Most American citizens do not have the maturity or responsibility to own firearms. Therefore, NO citizen can be trusted with a gun.

Do you realize how ridiculous this sounds? You cannot deprive an entire population of a right simply because the majority appears to be untrained.

The average american citizen is not a very impressive writer. Should we then remove their right to distribute written material? I do not find the average American to be well spoken. Do we restrict free speech?

Your generalizations, sir, are on the verge of offensive. Do you think I am an untrained frat boy? If I was a member of a fraternity would I be unfit to own firearms?

 

[orionengnr]

62/38

 

[orionengnr]

Most of the kids at my college are just there to be babysat for 4 years and declared 'Middle Class'.

Those won't be the ones who get off their butts and take a CHL class, with FBI background check, range qual, etc.

Yes, I realize that requirements vary from one state to the next. I don't believe there is any way to get a national College Concealed Carry Bill done, so we do it state by state.

If I'm not mistaken it is legal in Utah. No problems there. Perhaps soon it will pass in another state. Just like Concealed Carry, the more states pass it, the more positive data we will have. Soon the "Blood in the streets!" hysteria will fade away due to the lack of evidence to support it.

 

[alexp]

A little info

http://www.concealedcampus.org/state-by-state.php

 

[alexp]

One year shootings on school campuses

Full list: US school and college shootingsGun incidents in US schools and universities over the past year

Education Guardian, Tuesday 15 April 2008 11.50 BST Article history· Jonesboro, Arkansas. February 23, 2008. Student injured when bullet ricochets off building and hits him on campus of Arkansas State University.

· DeKalb, Illinois. February 14, 2008. A man opens fire in a lecture hall at Northern Illinois University and began shooting, killing five students and wounded 16 before killing himself.

· Oxnard, California. February 12, 2008. A 14-year-old fatally shot another student in the head while in class at E.O. Green junior high school. The victim had been bullied at school since declaring that he was gay.

· Memphis, Tennessee. February 11, 2008. A 17-year-old shot another student multiple times before handing the gun over to the teacher during gym class at Mitchell high school.

· Baton Rouge, Louisiana. February 8, 2008. A female student killed herself and two others in a classroom at Louisiana Tech University.

· Memphis, Tennessee. February 4, 2008. A 16-year-old shot his 16-year-old school mate in the leg during class at Hamilton high school.

· Washington, DC. January 22, 2008. Four Ballou high school students were shot and wounded as they were leaving school.

· Las Vegas, Nevada. January 18, 2008. A 16-year-old shot at another student outside a basketball game at Cheyenne high school, but did not injure him.

· Cleveland, Ohio. January 16, 2008. A 16-year-old boy pulled a gun from his locker and aimed it into a crowd of students when a fight erupted at South high school.

· Charlotte, North Carolina. January 16, 2008. A student at Crossroads Charter high school was shot and wounded in the school car park.

· Putnam City, Oklahoma. January 15, 2008. A 17-year-old was shot three times in a Putnam City high school car park after a basketball game.

· Asheville, North Carolina. January 10, 2007. A 16-year-old with a handgun shot at a fellow student at Asheville high school. No injuries.

· Gibsonton, Florida. December 17, 2007. Three East Bay high school students shot and wounded two other students as they were walking home from their bus stop.

· Las Vegas, Nevada. December 11, 2007. Two assailants using 9-millimeter and .45-caliber guns shot and injured six people as they exited a Mojave high school bus.

· Oakland, California. December 11, 2007. Three teens were shot after a basketball game at McClymonds high school in a drive-by shooting.

· Lagrangeville, New York. November 29, 2007. Three Hudson Valley high school students were arrested for planning a Columbine-type attack and making threats online.

· Holland Patent, New York. November 26, 2007. Two Holland Patent high school students shot a gun while on their school bus.

· Beaufort, SC. November 20, 2007. An 18-year-old shot a 17-year-old student in the Battery Creek high school car park after a skirmish.

· Saginaw, Michigan. October 25, 2007. Two Arthur Hill high school students and two adults were shot by another student as they left a middle school football game.

· Portland, Oregon. October 12, 2007. Two teens from Jefferson high school were shot when a gunman fired into a crowd of students that had gathered after the end of their homecoming dance.

· Cleveland, Ohio. October 10, 2007. A 14- year-old student shot two teachers and two students at SuccessTech Academy before killing himself.

ï· Norristown, Pennsylvania. October 10, 2007. A 14-year-old is arrested for stockpiling more than 30 weapons and plotting a Columbine-style attack.

· Memphis, Tennessee. September 30, 2007. A 21-year-old University of Memphis student was shot and killed on campus.

· Oroville, California. September 28, 2007. A 17-year-old armed with a .22-caliber handgun takes over two dozen students hostage at Las Plumas high school, before surrendering to police.

· Dover, Delaware. September 21, 2007. A freshman at Delaware State University shot and wounded two other students at a campus dining hall.

· Newark, New Jersey. August 4, 2007. Three Delaware State University students were shot and killed execution style by a 28-year-old and two 15-year-old boys who forced them to kneel and shot them in the head. A fourth student was found nearby with gunshot and knife wounds.

· Dallas, Texas. June 29, 2007. A 17-year-old former high school football player shot and injured two other high school students in the school car park.

· Huntersville, North Carolina. April 18, 2007. A 16-year-old high school student threatened two of his school mates with a gun.

· Blacksburg, Virginia. April 16, 2007. Student Seung-Hui Cho massacres 32 students and wounds 15 more at Virginia Tech University, armed with a Glock model 19 handgun and a Walther P22 handgun. Then shoots himself

 

[The Wiry Irishman]

I agree in principle the posting on this issue. The difference I see is the extent of the training and practice your marine gets. The college student receives far less training in any course or training session. Then there is the issue of supervision. Just my opinion

I'm in college and I shoot more than 30,000 rounds a year. How much do you shoot? And what makes a college student different than any other legal adult? Why the double standard? I go to the range quite a bit, and from what I see there the average gun owner is a downright awful shot. Also I've known several other students that have come from various branches before college, Marines included, and none of them were a particularly good shot with a handgun. Seems there's not much priority put on that versus rifles.

 

[CHEVELLE427]

One year shootings on school campuses

they must not have seen the no guns allowed sign



no guns allowed makes the legal people setting ducks

 

[xcgates]

To those who say that because a person is a college student, that person should not be allowed to carry, just what makes them different from when they aren't college students?

You can pull all sorts of examples of "college pressure" to party, be rowdy, and drink. Well, it is illegal to drink and drive, and when I was going to be drinking, I would tuck my keys in a spot of my room, removing any temptation. How about someone who is middle-aged and carries? If they are going to be going to a party to drink heavily, would they also not do something like, oh, I don't know, put the gun away?

 

[CHEVELLE427]

ccw test BACK GROUND CHECK would weed a lot out anyway and if it didn't the range test would.

THAT IS

if your state requires one

ALABAMA YOU GIVE THEM THE $15-25 THEY GIVE YOU THE PERMIT = 1 year i think
FL your going to spend around $175 when it's all said and done, = 4-5 years i think