Handloads for defensive purposes

[71Commander]

How would a jury look on the use of handloads for a defensive shooting ?

I am having a debate about this with a fellow shooter at work. I say that it has no bearing. He states that a jury will hang you.

Thanks.

 

[Jim March]

The truth is somewhere in the middle.

If it's a completely, obviously clean shoot, it doesn't matter.

If it's marginal, a DA can try and generate some "emotional heat" with "oh wow, he brewed up his own super-duper death-ray loads!" but he's risking having it backfire when you say "look, they're harping on what bullets I had because they don't have a real case".

There IS a situation where it can really screw you. If the goblin in question had a weapon other than a gun (club/knife/etc.) then a lot can depend on how close the guy was.

Well, unburnt powder and ash residue "patterns" like a shotgun load in predictable ways, SO LONG AS you can lab-fire the same sort of ammo in the same gun and see how far out the gun needs to be from the target to get the same pattern width. If a lab can say with certainty "the dude with the knife was six feet away and facing you when you shot him" then you're in pretty good shape...but with handloads, making such a lab-grade statement becomes difficult or impossible as you can't prove identical powder types and loads.

Upshot: unless your gun's needs are VERY weird (as in, your barrel length is way different from most guns of that caliber or "good stuff" just isn't made for a funky caliber), I would personally stick with factory ammo. But I would NOT go so far as to say "handloads will always hose you".

 

[Double Naught Spy]

So far, it has proven to be a false issue. I have yet to see a single case where a person used lethal force in a justified shooting where the type of ammo came into play for a criminal charge.

Either you had the right to use lethal force, or you did not. If you did, the type of ammo, handload, factory ball, hollowpoint, or whatever isn't inquestion any more than if you used a handmade baseball bat you lathed yourself for self defense instead of a factory Loiusville slugger.

The main issue most folks have with handloads for self defense is the potential for reliability problems and that is why so many choose factory ammo.

In civil court, anything is fair game. They could claim you used factory loads for better reliability so that you made sure that when you shot the bad guy that you were certain to do him the most harm possible. Go figure.

Ask you buddy to give you specific examples where handload ammo used in defensive shootings has been problematic. Keep in mind that a lot of hunters reload their own ammo and sometimes end up using their hunting rifles and ammo in self defense as that is the only ammo they have on hand. So they have a rifle with a crisp 2# trigger and handload ammo. Your buddy also probably thinks that a light trigger will cause a jury to hang you as well. That is another unproven myth. Once again, either you had the right to use lethal force, or not. The type isn't a salient issue - be it with a gun and handloads, a car where you built the engine from scratch, your own homemade bat, etc.

 

[71Commander]

We got on the discussion after talking about small back-up guns. I have a 2" J frame in .38 cal. that I load with 148 gr. HCSWC inverted. Expansion is a given, but there would be no doubt as to what was done when the bullet was extracted.

 

[NavajoNPaleFace]

I can't honestly say I can recall one case locally here where the type of ammo has been an issue.

I can, however, cite many cases where the number of rounds fired was an issue and a good defense Attorney can usually argue that effectively.

Scarier yet, it's the 8 or 12 jurors that you have to sweat in the long run if it gets that far.

 

[deanf]

Lots of information on this topic at this link.

 

[Mikul]

The prosecution will bring it up if it's a jury case. Legally, you're on solid ground, but it colors you in the eyes of the jury and that's the only reason they mention it.

My handloads are reliable. Occasional shifts in the charge have happened, but that is something that can easily be checked when loading a batch of carry rounds. With your own handloads you can experiement with expansion to create the desired effect, or you can develop a load to match a type of commercial ammunition that you trust.

I plan to keep detailed records of these rounds just as I do for my other handloads. In addition, I plan to load extra rounds that are obviously labeled in case their needed for forensic evidence.

My thought on this is that if I'm justified in using lethal force to defend my life, I could have used a 10-gauge shotgun. I couldn't load a handgun round hot enough to match that kind of power.

 

[Pendragon]

I dont worry about it one bit.

I keep my Valtro loaded up with medium power LSWC (200gr).

Here are the facts I would make sure the jury knew when evaluating my ammo:

1. My gun could reasonably be considered a "target gun".

2. My ammo is what many people use in "target shooting"

3. I make it myself because it is cheaper, more accurate and reliable - the latter two showing great care on my part to use a safe, accurate gun for defense.

4. My bullets are not hot-rodded and they are not "flying saw blades of death" ala "black talon", etc.

I should probably get some good hollow points, but honestly, I do not want to shoot copper in the gun and I think LSWC with good placement should be "good enough"

 

[PDshooter]

It's just me! but I carry ONLY factory loads in my hand guns!
Now hunting and plinking that's a differant story.

 

[seeker_two]

Sheriff Jim Wilson challenged anyone to knew where handloaded ammo was a factor in a SD shooting trial to send him the info so he could publish it. This was several years ago. So far, no takers....

However, I only use factory ammo in my SD guns. Why? I'm just starting out as a reloader, and I don't have as much confidence in the reliability and performance of my ammo (and I do go by the reloading book) as I do in factory ammo. If I need my gun in a SD situation, I want to be sure it works. Hence, I use factory ammo.

But, if all I had was my handloads, I wouldn't hesitate to use them...

 

[Waitone]

I find it amusing when people appeal to logic when discussing the law.

 

[answerguy]

There are two types of men: those with guns and those at their mercy.

I suggest that there is a third type of man. Since an unarmed man isn't at your mercy because you mean no harm to him, the third type of man is one that we gunowners must protect.

 

[Mikul]

Actually, answerguy, your third type of man is still at our mercy. He just happens to have it.