Heavy 44 Special loads- Was Elmer Keith crazy or genius?

[CraigC]

Maybe, maybe not. No way of knowing what would've transpired if Keith had never been born. There was a group of men working with similar projects (.44 Associates) but none were as influential as Keith.

However, in this case, we do know which came first. Keith pushed S&W into the .44Mag. Ruger chambered it in their mid-frame and found it wanting. Bill designed the large frame flat-top which eventually became the large frame Blackhawk .45......15yrs later.

 

[22-rimfire]

One needs to remember that prior to the movie "Dirty Harry", there were few even interested in big bore revolvers. The Model 29's got real scarce after that movie came out.

 

[1911Tuner]

Maybe, maybe not. No way of knowing what would've transpired if Keith had never been born. However, in this case, we do know which came first. Keith pushed S&W into the .44Mag. Ruger chambered it in their mid-frame and found it wanting. Bill designed the large frame flat-top which eventually became the large frame Blackhawk .45......15yrs later.

Again...the statement was purely academic. Let's try again.

If Keith had been able to obtain a .45 caliber single-action revolver as strong and as durable as a New Model Blackhawk, it's doubtful that he'd have spent a lot of time developing a heavy .44 Special load.

 

[420Stainless]

He couldn't have been too crazy having lived a nice long life. I don't have any revolvers that will handle heavy .44 loads, but have enjoyed the pleasure of shooting heavy loads in a .45 Colt Vaquero. I do like the option even though I don't do it often. Glad the development of the .44 Mag led to its availability.

I've always enjoyed reading about Keith's life. He led an interesting one.

 

[CraigC]

Again...the statement was purely academic. Let's try again.

If Keith had been able to obtain a .45 caliber single-action revolver as strong and as durable as a New Model Blackhawk, it's doubtful that he'd have spent a lot of time developing a heavy .44 Special load.

It makes no sense to even entertain such thoughts. The destination wouldn't have existed were it not for the journey that preceded it.

Large frame .45's came out in 1971, Keith never abandoned his .44's.

 

[Ed Ames]

As a purely academic statement, sure it does. Imagine an alternative history where the SAA was built with the strength of a NMBH. Would .44 Magnum exist as it does today?

 

[1911Tuner]

It makes no sense to even entertain such thoughts. The destination wouldn't have existed were it not for the journey that preceded it.

It doesn't follow logic that Keith would have spent time and effort on ramping up the .44 Special had a strong .45 Colt revolver existed. Keith liked big, heavy bullets. The bigger and heavier, the better.

Why would he have wasted time with .430/250/1200 when he could have had .454/280/1200 with less effort and quite likely lower pressures? He wasn't interested in simply proving something. His goal was optimizing a cartridge for his own purposes and for his own use.

If he'd had a sufficiently strong revolver available...

Why would he have expended his efforts magnumizing the .44 Special when he could just as easily have magnumized the .45 Colt? Easier, actually...because of the greater case capacity.

As a purely academic statement, sure it does. Imagine an alternative history where the SAA was built with the strength of a NMBH. Would .44 Magnum exist as it does today?

Who can say? Possibly. Probably. It would have probably been overshadowed by the imaginary .45 Keith much like the come-lately .41 Magnum is considered by many to be irrelevant because of the .44 Magnum's availability.

 

[murf]

one could ask the same question regarding dick casull or john linebaugh. both took the saa 45 colt platform to "magnum" levels. crazy or genius?

murf

 

[Bull Nutria]

I have keith's Book "Hell I was there". it is about his entire life his tradgedies, his cowboying days,natiional guard camp pendeton days, ranching days, guiding days, gunwriting days, he was a unique person. some of his narratives of the winters in the NW give me chills to this day!

if you like true stories about the good ole days this is the book for you!

Bull