Help For My 19

[The Rabbi]

I've posted before about how I love my beat-to-heck Smith Model 19 with its wonderful trigger pull and great accuracy.
I have been shooting just puff .38spcs in it for club competition and never had an issue. I decided that since the gun is chambered for .357 magnum I ought to shoot that cartridge more. I bought some 158gr reloads that are not painful at all to shoot, more like a 38spc +P+.
I went to shoot today and after a few rounds the gun just locked up. Trigger would not pull, cylinder would not turn, hammer would not cock, latch would not release cylinder. After a while I tried again and the cylinder would open.
Dont know what's going here but would appreciate some insight.

 

[ZenMasterJG]

how many is a few rounds if it was more then "a few" fired really rapidly, its not totally inconcivable that the gun expanded with the heat, eating up the gap between the cylinder and the frame, locking the whole thing together. Other then that, check to make sure none of your brass got horribly warped or torn or anything where peices could get stuck between the cylinder and the frame. thats the only things i can think of, but i dont shoot wheelguns very often

 

[Old Fuff]

Would I be correct in thinking that these were lead-bullet reloads?

It sounds to me as if either the front of the cylinder leaded up enough so that the cylinder wouldn't turn, or that the trigger didn't reset the cylinder stop. When/if this happens the cylinder is locked in place, and nothing will move. If the gun is left sitting and the trigger finely does its thing the stop and trigger reset and everything starts working again.

So, you want to know, do I do about it?

Given that it is an older, well used gun the spring that operates the cylinder stop could be weak, bent, or full of gunk. It's cheap, so I would replace it. It is also possible that the rebound slide spring is weak - especially if the factory one was replaced with an aftermarket one. It is not likely, but possible that one of the studs (read that "pins") that the hammer, trigger and cylinder stop rotate on is bent or broken.

I would suggest that the old girl has been a faithful friend and it's time to compleately disassemble it, inspect the parts for wear, and possibly replace all of the coil springs - the mainspring is probably fine.

Ol' 19's never die, but sometine they require some TLC ...

 

[The Rabbi]

No, these were 158gr TMC, total metal casing. The normal .38spc I use is LRN and it is a dirty bullet.
I have considered sending it back to Smith for an overhaul. I could certainly do the work you mention though.
I dont understand why it would seize up tight and then once I open the cylinder everything is fine again. This happened several times.

 

[Majic]

Some early M66s were known to do that. They expanded when heated and locked up. First time I've heard of a M19 doing that, but anything is possible.

 

[HSMITH]

Look at the primers from the fired cases, look at them closely. Scratch over the firing pin dent with your fingernail, is there a ridge around the dent? Can you see any shiny ring or part of a ring around the firing pin dent?

Recoil is no indication of pressure, so the fact that they weren't fire breathing monster magnums doesn't really change much. I have seen the EXACT same scenario you ran into caused by rounds that generate too much pressure for your particular gun. This doesn't mean that the rounds are over pressure, it just means that they are more than your particular gun likes.

Case in point, my buddy has a 19-3 in great shape and a fantastic shooter with zero previous problems. He bought some Remington 158's and it locked up tight on the second shot. He got it loose and tried it again, it locked up where he couldn't get it loose at all. He called me when he got home and we talked about it. I ended up having him rap the cylinder with the heel of his hand with the release pressed, it popped open. Checked the ejector rod etc, nothing wrong, so I had him look at the primers, sure enough there was flow back around the firing pin and it was smeared when the cylinder opened. Next time out I brought one of my 19's, shot the same ammo without a bit of problem.

Some of the older Smiths had a firing pin bushing with a pretty big hole in it, and this makes them more prone to primer flow. Combine that with a tight gun or a cylinder gap that is fouled to the point that it is very tight and problems can arise.

This might not be what happened to you but it is a real headscratcher if you run into it.

 

[Old Fuff]

If the cylinder stop and trigger haven't reset (which is most often caused by a weak rebound spring) and you open the cylinder you'll bump the cylinder stop ball in the process. If it resets the gun will work thereafter until it happens again.

Take the UNLOADED revolver, pull the trigger backwards in double action, then ease the trigger forward very, very slowly...

See if you can get the gun to lock up as it has been doing.

 

[The Rabbi]

I took apart the gun thoroughly to clean it today. I didnt see anything broken, just dirty as all get out.
When I put it back together, the hand will not stay in the window and turn the cylinder. It also locks up sometimes like what I had. Could this be a spring issue?

 

[Old Fuff]

1. The hand won't stay in the window because the little spring inside the trigger isn't hooked on the hand. Your P.M. to me suggested that you got that fixed, but if not, let me know and I'll write out detailed instructions.

2. I think you may very well have a spring problem, but the question is, which one? Or maybe more then one.

Remove the sideplate and take out the hammer block (sometimes called a safety block). With the cylinder reassembled, double-action the gun while watching the lockwork move. Hopefully it will jam, and you'll notice something. Keep an eye on the hammer and trigger to be sure they don't try to get away. You may have to push them back into place once and awhile.

When you double action the gun you can go fast or slow, but you will see more if you go slow. In particular watch to be sure the little ledge at the front of the trigger goes into the matching slot in the cylinder stop. If it doesn't that's why the gun is hanging up.

 

[juneau803]

If you have been shooting 38 spl. in it for some time there is a chance that the chambers are gunked up. When you switched to the longer .357 it could have caused an over pressure situation due to the gunked up space.

Seems to me that if it worked fine before then it might be that. Worth cleaning out those chambers real good and then testing again. If you have to force the cartridges past that gunked up spot then it could be the problem. I imagine overpressure could jam a gun.

Just a thought.