HELP: OLD 1911 experts ONLY: ID this 1911?

[franconialocal]

Hey all,

My girlfriend works for the American Legion in Manchester NH and I've become friends with many of the guys in the hall. The finance manager invited me back to "the safe" and unveiled a beautiful old Colt 1911. He isn't so sure of the history of this particular handgun, and it was donated by a former member years ago. Any help with I.D., history, serial no. info, etc. would be GREATLY appreciated. Eventually I would like to add some photos, but I only have the gun for a few hrs. to do a clean and inspection on it. For reference it looks just like the one on the Wikipedia page for 1911 too. They are planning on showing it in a display of some kind...I would really love to tell them more about this iconic, historical piece!! I was told it was used in World War 1 but I want to clarify this....

Slide: Patented APR.20,1897 SEPT. 9, 1902 Colt's PT. MFG. Co.
DEC. 19, 1905, FEB. 14, 1911, AUG. 19, 1913 Hartford, CT. USA

Frame: United States Property and then a "benchmark" that looks like "JMG" with the J and M in the "circle" of the G.

Right side of Slide: Model of 1911 U.S. ARMY

Right side frame: No. 293511 (Any info about this serial no.???)

BEAUTIFUL original diamond wood grips

No marks of any kind on the magazine

Original plastic case with button for securing/ still the original cosmoline in the case.

Any info would be GREAT and thank you in advance!!!

 

[1911Tuner]

John M. Gilbert, Army ordnance inspector from August 10, 1917 until March 29, 1918.

Serial number resolves to mid to late 1918. It's a "Black Army" Colt.

 

[franconialocal]

Wow..I feel very honored to have this in my possession. It's in great shape. Really, the only hard rust that is present is on the magazine. The extractor is perfect, the firing pin and spring are flawless, the bbl. is in fantastic shape with no pitting or hard rust.

Any tips I can pass on to the legion about preservation?? (a gas filled case would be perfect but $$$ being a factor....

I'm taking care of some of the buildup, (I wonder if I'm cleaning powder out from WWI !!!???), but the surfaces are in amazing shape. It must have been stored very well.

Approx. Cost??? I know it's hard to tell, but generally??

 

[Freedom_fighter_in_IL]

I've seen a few Black Army's go for $6,000 in absolutely great condition. They are generally, in auction settings, going for $2500 to $6,000 with condition being the major factor. The history also matters if it has any documentation to it.

 

[franconialocal]

This one was appraised a few years ago at around $5,000 and yes, there is paperwork (not from Colt per se) from the original "owner" after he donated it post WWI. Good news!

 

[rcmodel]

Original plastic case

Uhhhh?

I don't know what kind of case that is, but it would not be the orginial case.
Plastic was not even hardly invented yet in 1918.

Let alone used to ship & store GI handguns in.

rc

 

[JRH6856]

^^^^ Bakelite, maybe?

 

[rcmodel]

Gutta-Percha, IE: hard rubber maybe?

S&W used it a lot in small boxes for the early guns.
http://www.nramuseum.com/the-museum...ue-revolver-w-original-gutta-percha-case.aspx
Both Colt, S&W, and other companies used it for grips.
I am not aware of Colt doing it for boxes much, especially by 1918.

It had pretty much stopped being used by then by S&W at least.

If it truly is a Gutta-Percha or Bakelite case made by and marked Colt for a 1911?
It would probably be worth more then the gun is.

Regardless, the OP should be aware if it is Gutta-Percha or Bakelite and says Colt on it?
It is nearly 100 years old, very valuable, and is no doubt very fragile and easily broken by now.

rc

 

[franconialocal]

Yes, it's like a hard rubber/plastic, very old, very worn, yellowing but it has an insert to hold the "shape" of the container and is coated with old cosmoline in the inside. I was thinking the same thing actually...plastic?? In 1918?? But I really don't know...I wish I could supply a pic. Maybe it was transferred into a later designed case after some time but I really don't know.

 

[rcmodel]

You have to post some pictures!!

Of the gun, and especially the box.

I have seen those guns before.
But I haven't seen a Colt box like that.

rc

 

[Jim K]

IIRC, Army contract handguns of that era were originally shipped from the factory in wood crates, not in individual boxes, so the case is not "original".

Colt magazines were not marked.

A letter from Colt would be nice, but really wouln't help much with the history; it would just show the gun was shipped to X depot on Y date, not the unit or person to whom it was later issued.

Sounds like a beauty; keep it lightly oiled or greased with RIG and away from grubby finger prints. Do NOT store it in a holster. Make sure to CAREFULLY remove the grips and oil/grease underneath.

Jim

 

[mag1911]

No 293511 shipped in May 9th or 13th, 1918 to the Commanding Officer, Springfield Armory.

 

[Jim K]

Thanks, Mag1911, and that is as much as you will get from a Colt letter.

Jim

 

[franconialocal]

Thanks guys..I will try to get some pics...