Help! Uberti Cattleman cylinder spin when cocked!

[Corpral_Agarn]

Hello THR!
I took the cylinder out of my Uberti Cattleman to clean it (essentially a SAA) and for whatever reason, after reassembled, when I cock the hammer (all the way back) the cylinder free spins for a bit then stops. that's not right. Also, when the hammer is cocked and the trigger is pulled, the hammer does not drop the first time and it looks like the cylinder is rotating just a touch the wrong way before it finally can drop.

It seems to me the bolt at the bottom of the frame is not popping up to stop the cylinder. Perhaps a lock timing issue?

I am not an expert on SAA's. Please, I need help. This is one of my favored pieces to carry while horseback. What is going wrong?

Thank you!

I found this Post: http://www.thehighroad.org/archive/index.php/t-536811.html

it might be the same. can someone confirm?

 

[Driftwood Johnson]

Howdy

Most likely a broken bolt/trigger spring. Probably the most common failure in guns of the old SAA design. Remove the trigger guard and take a look at the split spring which powers both the trigger and the bolt. Very common for one leg to break off as in the top spring in my photo. If you're lucky you just assembled it wrong and did not get the spring on top of the bolt. One big screw holds down the spring, take it out and see what you get. You will first have to remove the backstrap, then the trigger guard. Six screws in all. Keep track of where each screw went, they are not all the same.



P.S. these springs break quite commonly and are readily available and easy to replace.

P.P.S that link you have is referring to the hand spring, not the split bolt/trigger spring. That one is the other one that very commonly breaks. Newer Ubertis use a coil spring for the hand, the coil spring will not break. The old leaf spring hand springs are the ones that break.

P.P.P.S. When you take off the backstrap, be careful. If your gun has a coil hand spring it will most likely be under one of the two screws on either side of the hammer. Look in the holes with a bright light. If your gun is so equipped, a spring and a plunger will be under one of he screws. When you take the backstrap off, the spring will be hanging free in one of the holes. Don't lose it or its plunger.

P.P.P.P.S. Sometimes a broken bolt/trigger spring will fool you. There may be a crack at the base of one of the legs, but the part may not have broken completely off yet. This usually results in a sluggish bolt that pops up but not with much gusto. Usually when you take the spring out the cracked leg breaks off in your hand.

 

[Corpral_Agarn]

Thanks Driftwood!

Driftwood!
You are extremely helpful!

I am very sad that my gun has maybe broken, though... I have been packing it around up in the mountains for more than a month assuming that it was fine... glad I didn't need it.

Will be taking it apart here shortly.

Again, thank you very much!

 

[Corpral_Agarn]

Need a little more assistance...

Okay, I have checked both the parts in the picture and they are just fine.

I have found, however, a large circular pin in the hammer block on the same side as the loading gate that has chipped (partway broken off?).
That pin appears to be where that second part in the photo (the bolt, right?) connects to the hammer block.
As best as I can tell that eroded pin is letting the two little fingers on the bolt to slip by. That would account for the bolt not raising when the gun is cocked and why it free spins a bit when it should be locked up for firing... I think...

I am going to take the hammer block to the local gunshop and see if they can help me out. I have a CCW renewal on Thursday and was planning on putting this revolver on there... ah well. Will have to add it later.

Would love to know what would cause such a failure!

 

[rcmodel]

You must be referring to the hammer cam?

It is an approx 1/4' circular insert in the right side of the hammer that operates the left arm of the bolt.

If it broke off the hammer?

A 'good' gunsmith can make a replacement.

But, it will probably be cheaper & easier in the long run to buy a new hammer.

https://www.vtigunparts.com/store/s...d=23&cat=Uberti+1873+Cattleman+SAA+and+Target

How old is the gun?
If it was new before you started packing it around the mountains a month ago?
Uberti warranty should fix it free!

rc

 

[Driftwood Johnson]

Howdy

Lets be sure we understand how the parts work before we go ordering new parts.

These are the internal parts from a Colt, but the Cattleman is basically the same. Here you can see the cam on the side of the hammer. Notice it has a slanted face. That is the way it is supposed to be. When the hammer is cocked, the upper surface of the cam lifts one tail of the bolt, rotating it down so the cylinder can turn. The cam only lifts one tail, not both. When the hammer falls, the slanted face of the cam pushes the tail of the bolt to the side, so the bolt does not move, keeping the cylinder locked up. The bolt is made of spring steel and the tails can flex to allow the cam to slide by.

You mention the cam on your hammer appears 'eroded'. Does it look like the Colt part? That is the way it is supposed to be.

By the way, the cam on an Uberti hammer is a cast on detail of the part. The cam on a Colt is a separate part pressed into the hammer so it can be easily replaced.

The cam is a wear part, it can wear away over time, but first let's make sure we understand what it is supposed to look like.






Let's be sure we have diagnosed the problem correctly. With the cylinder removed and the hammer down, when you press down on the bolt does it pop up smartly? It should offer some pretty stiff resistance when you try to push it down and should pop right up smartly. If not, the spring is not doing its job, which is much more common than a worn cam.

Just how old is your Cattleman? Has it been shot a great deal? It would usually take a great amount of shooting before a cam wore away.

 

[Corpral_Agarn]

A few pics to help

I think you guys are talking about the right part, but mine does not look all smooth like Driftwood's photo.
The Pistol was brand new when I got it and has maybe 500 rounds through it. I will look into sending it back. I do love that revolver, though.

Driftwood, you might have a point about the spring not doing its job. I may take that in today as well, but best as I can tell, there is nothing wrong with it.

Pics of what I think is the issue:

 

[rcmodel]

Yes, that is an issue all right.

You may also have a broken trigger nose (sear) judging from the big chunk it took out of the safety notch on the hammer!

For sure time for a trip back to the mother-ship for some TLC.

rc

 

[Corpral_Agarn]

Drat.

Well... Poop. That is the pits.
"Roundup" on the summer range in the Sierra Nevadas starts in 2 weeks... And I won't be putting it on my ccw...

Thanks to you both for helping me out. I learned a whole lot about the SAA. Just sad that it had to be this way.

Thanks RC and thanks Driftwood! Again!

 

[Driftwood Johnson]

Actually, that doesn't look too bad to me. The cam is scratched up, but the angled surface should still do its job of pushing the bolt tail out of the way. If I wuz you I would look at the bolt tail and see why it has scratched up the cam so much.

Uberti guns are well known for having roughly finished parts inside. You just don't get custom finished parts for the price you pay for an Uberti. I suspect a burr on the bolt has torn up the cam like that. Both should be gently smoothed with careful application of a good small file.

I believe the chunk rcmodel is referring to on the hammer safety notch is the hole drilled for the safety device Uberti has installed in the hammer. That is normal on one of these guns.

My money is still on a broken bolt/trigger spring.

Did you actually take out the spring and inspect it?

 

[Corpral_Agarn]

My money is still on a broken bolt/trigger spring.

Did you actually take out the spring and inspect it?

You might have something about the bolt scratching up that cam.
I did take out the spring and bolt. This is my first time inspecting them, but they both look okay...
Pics:

 

[Corpral_Agarn]

Shipped it back...

So I took my beloved revolver in to have it returned to Uberti to capitalize on the warranty.
It is a sad day, truly...

 

[Driftwood Johnson]

Howdy

Yup, I was wrong, nothing wrong with your trigger/bolt spring. Sorry we couldn't get to the bottom of the problem. Tough to do without the gun in hand. I sure don't like all that scratching on the cam. Hope you get it back soon and it is all fixed.

 

[Corpral_Agarn]

Howdy

Yup, I was wrong, nothing wrong with your trigger/bolt spring. Sorry we couldn't get to the bottom of the problem. Tough to do without the gun in hand. I sure don't like all that scratching on the cam. Hope you get it back soon and it is all fixed.

No sweat, Driftwood.

I sure appreciate you and RC helping me out. I like the SAA but this is my second bad experience with Uberti products. I sure hope they get it together!