Historical: Dr. Watson & his Bull pup

[BaltimoreBoy]

Is anyone familiar with British service revolvers of the late 19th century?

I ran into this and have not found anything definitive poking around the internet.

In the very first Sherlock Holmes story, "A Study in Scarlet" Watson tells Holmes that he keeps a "Bull pup".

Nobody seems 100% sure what Watson means.

It doesn't seem to mean a real dog, since it is never mentioned again in the stories.

Some say that it is a slang expression that means 'having a short temper'. That might be good except that Watson is about as phlegmatic as they come.

Others say that it refers to Watson's service revolver.

So...
Does anyone know of a British service revolver of that period that was either properly or informally called a 'bull pup'.

(...obviously the 20th century rifle is not intended here.)

 

[jeepnik]

The writer, like many, didn't know his subject. Further reading indicates that
Dr. Watson carried a Webley Bulldog revolver in .455 Webley.

 

[yugorpk]

"I keep a bull pup" in the context of Doyle's "Study in Scarlet" was never explained in the novel and has never been explained in 120 years since the novel was published even by Doyle. Its not known whether Watson was talking about an animal , a revolver , or his temperament ( Bull Pup was an expression for an emotional short fuse amongst Afghan campaign veterans ) . Could be anything and despite Chekhov's admonition the term or item was never used again in the novel.

There were many English and Belgian revolvers referred to as "bulldogs" at the turn of that century.

 

[Wolfman Zack]

Exactly, I would assume "bull pup" was a misnomer for a bulldog revolver.

The British term of a bulldog revolver refers to a short barreled weapon or large caliber, often with a somewhat compact grip.
Said weapons were easily concealed in a coat pocket, yet offered potent firepower, and were favored my gentlemen of the Victorian era.

 

[bannockburn]

BaltimoreBoy

In the April 1975 edition of Guns and Ammo writers Scott McMillan and Garry James wrote an article called "The Guns of Sherlock Holmes". Supposedly Sherlock Holmes and Dr. Watson's gun collection had just come into the possession of the family of Dr. Watson's great-granddaughter no less! Basing much of the article with information from various sources intimately familiar with Sir Arthur Conan Doyle's books the writers ventured to state that Dr. Watson had a .450 Second Model Adams revolver and that Sherlock Holmes had a .450 Webley Metropolitan Police revolver.

They also wrote that Holmes had a single shot pistol chambered for the Eley No.1 Centerfire cartridge (which Dr. Watson once described Holmes as "...(he) would sit in an arm chair, with his hair trigger and a hundred Boxer cartridges and proceed to adorn the opposite wall with a patriotic V.R. done in bullet-pocks, I felt strongly that neither the atmosphere nor the appearance of our room was improved by it."). There is also mention of Holmes having a Webley-Green Army model in .455 and a German 7.7mm. Bittner single shot pistol as well as an air rifle manufactured by G. Schmaelzlein of New York (supposedly used by Colonel Moran to kill Holmes in the book, "Adventure of The Empty House").

 

[Malamute]

I recently started reading th eHomes books, very enjoyable. The Gary James G&A article was good, its turned up elsewhere online.

Some say that it is a slang expression that means 'having a short temper'. That might be good except that Watson is about as phlegmatic as they come.

The films seemed to portray Watson in that light, but I haven't seen where he seems so in the books. Not to Holmes seemingly freakish levels of energy at times, but other than the injury from Afghanistan, he would seem to be as fit as any former soldier.

 

[Old Fuff]

None of the portrayed revolvers is a true "British Bulldog," which was a large-bore, short barreled, pocket revolver. While some were made in England, the majority came from small shops in Belgium. They were imported into the United States in large numbers and were popular because they combined small size, low cost, and for what they were, substantial power.

 

[Jim K]

The only problem with all this is that the whole thing was fiction. It is a tribute to Doyle's writing that so many people think of Holmes and Watson as real persons, but they, and their guns, and the famous rooms at 221B Baker St., were all pure fiction. I have never seen any indication that Doyle had any special knowledge of firearms, any more than most writers of fiction do, so it is interesting, but pointless, to try to figure out what some gun reference might mean.

Incidentally, the characterization of Watson as a bumbling and slightly confused elderly man was invented by the actor Nigel Bruce; in the original stories, Watson was not much older than Holmes himself and was a practicing physician who had been an army doctor in Afghanistan, hardly a description of a bumbler or a fool.

Jim

 

[Derry 1946]

The only problem with all this is that the whole thing was fiction. It is a tribute to Doyle's writing that so many people think of Holmes and Watson as real persons, but they, and their guns, and the famous rooms at 221B Baker St., were all pure fiction. I have never seen any indication that Doyle had any special knowledge of firearms, any more than most writers of fiction do, so it is interesting, but pointless, to try to figure out what some gun reference might mean.

Incidentally, the characterization of Watson as a bumbling and slightly confused elderly man was invented by the actor Nigel Bruce; in the original stories, Watson was not much older than Holmes himself and was a practicing physician who had been an army doctor in Afghanistan, hardly a description of a bumbler or a fool.

Jim

Yes, I always thought the Nigel Bruce portrayal was meant to project a benighted foil to show in sharper relief Holmes's (Basil Rathbone) brilliance. And maybe as a device to allow Holmes to explain his technique to an audience the studio considered unsophisticated. Were those films aimed at kids? The next thing you knew, they were in a WWII propaganda movie setting. Double feature was probably Abbott and Costello.

 

[yugorpk]

Separate the written portrayal from the film portrayal of Dr Watson ad you'll do yourself a big favor. Most early Holmes films didnt do Doyle's Watson justice to say the least. Ive read all the books and my wife is a massive Sherlock Holmes fan and Ive probably seen every possible incarnation on film from The Soviet versions to German, British, ours etc. The best true to book portrayals of Holmes and Watson on film probably being the Soviet Vasily Livanov and Vitaly Solomin.

Remember that Doyle, a medical doctor himself , intended Dr. Watson to be a balance to Holmes flightiness

 

[Derry 1946]

Oh, yes. I read all the canonical stories/novels as a kid and many times thereafter before I ever saw a film version. Jeremy Brett came closest to the Holmes ethos for my money.

 

[Malamute]

The only problem with all this is that the whole thing was fiction. It is a tribute to Doyle's writing that so many people think of Holmes and Watson as real persons, but they, and their guns, and the famous rooms at 221B Baker St., were all pure fiction. I have never seen any indication that Doyle had any special knowledge of firearms, any more than most writers of fiction do, so it is interesting, but pointless, to try to figure out what some gun reference might mean.

Yeah, but when did that ever stop us from obsessing over gun details?

Actually, the guns related, however tenuously or fictionally with the Holmes stories has been some of the more interesting learning Ive done about guns in some time. The British revolvers of the period, especially the larger military pistols are pretty interesting to me. In the past, they were a blur of "old Webley-esque Brit stuff not worth messing with", but further looking into the details of them makes me wish Id taken an interest in them before the prices went up so much.

 

[kBob]

old doppy me just translated that quote to "I have a RIC bull dog in my pocket" and kept on reading.

I rather like the current Brit TV of the boys in todays world and Watson as a wounded Afgan Vet and his bull pup as a Sig.


At least Watson there is not transformed into a rather attractive Asian woman with no gun........... interesting as the actress once described using air pistols to shoot Styrofoam wig dummies in her back yard with her Dad to the horror of most other women on the show see did so on. Well the show is set in NYC ...... so no guns for good guys I guess. I do want a marble shooting revolver though.

-kBob

 

[Jim K]

I once walked up Baker Street just to be able to say I was there. No Holmes looking out a window, no kings and dukes running in and out, no mysterious women staking out the place. Just a rather nondescript building, and not even a "B". Oh, well.

Jim

 

[lewwallace]

There was a 'Bulldog' type Webley known as the"Pug". Scarce and pricey these days, but not military. Here's my Bulldog, in 450cf.

 

[Iggy]

I read one story supposedly factual that claimed Custer carried a "Bulldog" at the Little Big Horn.

 

[Jim K]

I have read several versions, each with a different gun. Unfortunately, none of our Native American friends thought to get "bringback" papers.

And, as with other famous guns, the make and model will change dependent on what I am trying to sell at an exorbitant price at the moment. Wanna buy the Beretta carried by Julius Caesar in Gaul? Only 3500 sestertii, no FFL needed.

Jim

 

[Archie]

I'm a Holmes fan. I've read all the Conan-Doyle stories and many of the 'other' authors; none of whom are worth mentioning other than Laurie R. King.

No. Arthur Conan-Doyle knew about as much regarding current handguns of his day as did Ian Fleming about 'secret service' handguns. (They fit in one hand and they go 'bang'.)

However, Watson and Holmes both owned, and carried at need, revolvers suited to the purposes of self defense. It was normal and expected.

I have always wondered about Holmes shooting the back wall of his apartment. I always wondered what his land-lady thought of it, what the neighbors in 'that' direction thought, and how much hearing loss Holmes derived. (Firing a centerfire handgun round in a closed room? Without the advantage of adrenaline?)

 

[susieqz]

perhaps i misremember, but i could have sworn that watson had his service revolver.

 

[RPRNY]

If in the story, Doyle wrote that Watson said "I keep a Bull Pup", he almost certainly meant a dog. In English-language idiom of the time, there is no way this would refer to temper, in which case he might have said "I've a bit of a Bull Pup" or thereabouts. Not quite as unlikely is reference to a firearm. To keep, especially in the time frame, was very specific to animals and ones "establishment", home, servants, animals etc.

Odd that the Bull Pup never resurfaces again however.

Sent from my KFOT using Tapatalk

 

[Kaeto]

Doyle hated writing the Holmes stories. He only did it because it paid the bills.

 

[lewwallace]

Nope! Webley No.1 RIC is the allegation! See last yr's "Guns&Ammo" story on Custer's gun!

 

[Iggy]

General Godfrey, who was a Lt. at the Little Big Horn, reported that Custer had two Bull Dogs with pearl grips.

He also reported that Custer carried a Remington Rolling Block rifle on most of his campaigns. He would shoot any wild game that moved.

Army guns weren't good enough for him.