Home defense ammo?

[CoastieTech]

As you know from a previous thread I just got my first shotgun and I am thinking about having it replace my Glock as my primary HD weapon. I live in a townhouse with neighbors on either side of me. It is an upstairs/downstairs and I have a 16 month old, so penetration is a very big issue for me. What kind of load would you suggest for my shotgun. For those of you that didn't see the other thread I own a Remington 1100LW with a fixed full choke bbl and a skeet bbl. Also which barrel should I use? Also I read another thread asking how people kept their shotguns for home defense. Since I don't have a pump shotgun should I leave it loaded with the safety on or should I keep it unloaded? My concern with leaving it loaded at all times would be my son's safety. Thank you in advance for all you help and please pardon my ignorance.

 

[kmrcstintn]

Chime me in too

This is of interest to me also. I live in a ground floor apartment with a neighbor on the side of me and a neighbor living above me. There are several windows leading to the outside.

 

[mbs357]

I'm in the same boat.
Got a 12 ga Savage single barrel that I keep by the bed with three 3" mag 00 buckshots and two 2 3/4 birdshots in one of those stock bandolier things...what are they called anyway?
Edit to add:
I'll be upgrading to a Winchester 1400 as soon as I get some experience with it...I refuse to go into a HD situation with a gun I've never fired before. I should probably look into getting an extended magazine for it.

 

[PotatoJudge]

Most people suggest #4 shot for home protection. If I had a kid in the house I'd be more comfortable with #6-9 shot. I keep my 1100 loaded with the safety on. A 19 month old probably couldn't work the bolt, so I would suggest leaving the safety off and the chamber empty, but otherwise loaded. It should be pretty easy to chamber a round if you need to.

 

[CAPTAIN MIKE]

Three Tips

Tip #1: Consider it your DUTY to get proper hands-on training from a training source that knows what the heck they're talking about when it comes to shotguns. see www.pfctraining.com; www.frontsight.com;

Tip #2: Penetration is and should be a big concern from a safety standpoint and I concur with the ammo suggestions above.

Tip #3: The safety of your child is above all. Your child will not always be 16 months old and will be trying to satisfy the curiosity that is part of becoming a toddler and pre-school child. You do NOT ever want to say to yourself as a parent of an accidentally injured or dead child: "If only..."

 

[ugaarguy]

Captain Mike hit the nail on the head - training, training, training. With the safety of your child being your priority I just cant suggest a shotgun for home defense with overpenetration concerns. If you have the means get a 223 caliber carbine and load it with a polymer "ballistic tip" type ammo for rapid disentigration when it hits anything other than flesh. If you cant get a carbine get a good revolver and load it with frangible ammo to avoid overpenetration. While the frangibles arent as effective as good hollow points we're going for avoiding shooting thru drywall and potentially wounding a family member so its a necessary compromise. Thats how I would tackle it. I may be totally off base so please correct me if I'm wrong here folks. Also get a good light.

 

[nitesite]

Aren't MOST townhouses built to code with four, rather than two, layers of gypsum board (sheetrock) between connected dwellings? I believe it is to act as a temporary firewall, delaying the spread of fire.

Can you not check this out to satisfy your concern about your neighbors safety? There isn't much energy left after a load of #5 shot has gone thru four layers of gyp board.

But thru air at across-the-room distances it is pretty awesome.

 

[nitesite]

If you have the means get a 223 caliber carbine and load it with a polymer "ballistic tip" type ammo for rapid disentigration when it hits anything other than flesh.

That is a myth. Soft tissue disrupts and disentegrates a bullet (especially one with a polymer tip) more than hard/dry barriers.

 

[AmbulanceDriver]

Curious

About how different ammo/guns/etc performs against sheetrock, etc?

www.theboxotruth.com

 

[sm]

CAPTAIN MIKE's post worth reading again and again.

Search is your friend, been discussed a LOT before.

Remember it make no difference what a shotgun barrel is marked, what a choke is marked, what a box of shotgun shells "says" , makes no difference what Team Walrus uses, makes no difference what anyone on the Erronet posts...

What does the Pattern Board tell YOU about YOUR shotguns and various loadings?

Take the longest distance in your abode, add one yard, shoot pattern board.
That is what YOU need to know, and only YOU can find this out.

What else is the brain and body trained in to prevent having to reach for the shotgun? Any other steps taken to prevent /deter trouble from choosing your abode and you and others residing there? Anything to discourage trouble if still courious for a closer look?

Shotguns and ammo are just part of the toolbox, not THE toolbox.

 

[Croyance]

Considering the child in the dwelling, I think he is more concerned about penetration inside his townhouse than into the next.
Really the Glock's bullet is perfectly capable of penetrating the walls right now, so the situation isn't getting much worse with an improperly loaded shotgun.

 

[ugaarguy]

AmbulanceDriver, excellent link. NiteSite, thanks for setting me strait. So i guess I don't need a shotgunany more, just some drywall and frangible 223 to shoot thru it

 

[CoastieTech]

Thank you for all your advice. Just so everyone here knows I have very little shotgun experience but I have quite a bit of firearms experience. A shotgun may be very different from other firearms but the general safety rulles are the same. I am very aware of my son being in the house and I have taken all the neccasary precuations. I am not some guy who got an itch and just started buying weapons without any training. As far as other HD methods, I rent my town house and I'm not allowed to put in an alarm system or have a dog, so if someone breaks in to my house and makes it all the way up stairs then he is going to be shot becuase he/she obvisiously is intent on hurting me or my family. I am trained in hand to hand combat but I'm not going to trade blows with someone I don't in the dark especially if I don't know whether he has a weapon or not. Once again thank you for all your suggestions. I will use the advice given here and some of my own research and experimenting to find out whats best for my situation.

 

[riverdog]

Something else to consider is the field of fire you will have in your townhouse. Will you be in a static location or moving through the house? Where will the badguy approach from? If that can be determined (hallways & stairs), the range you are dealing with and what is behind the bad guy will be better known. Where is the heavy furniture relative to where you will shoot from? Will moving the furniture help? Another something to consider is that you can always beef up your child's room such that any errant buckshot will be stopped.

My HD load is 00 Buck. I'd be shooting from the back of the house and have a lot to shoot through before the shot get outside. No kids. I won't be moving around, I'll take a position in the room and only defend that room while I call the cops. YMMV

 

[mountainclmbr]

If I was in this situation I would use either #6 or #4 shot. At close range it should be effective, but won't have much energy after penetrating a wall.

 

[30-06 lover]

Personally this is what I would do:

Make a "Safe Room" and store your gun(s) there. If trouble ever hits that is the room you head for. I made my Safe Room my bedroom. I have a phone in there, a lock on the door, and a 12GA ready to rock and roll.

I would use the skeet barrel. Shot will cover more real estate and not have quite as much "power" as a full (less than a full which means might not go through the wall, but still plenty to take out a human.). I use 00 Buck in my HD 12GA, but in your situation, I would use #4 shot. At close range, it will put one big hole in a man the size of a fist.

Having one in the chamber is the only way for both pumps and semi autos. You can have the safety on if you like, but I don't anymore. The more I learn about reaction time, the more I understand every nanosecond counts. You definitely don't want to have to F with putting one in the pipe...might get you killed. Sure it sounds cool putting one in the pipe and it very well scare the intruder into retreat, but think about this. We are taking HOME INVASION! They don't give a damn about you. Letting them know you have a gun tells them to come in shooting. Not only that, you have one less round in the gun because the magazine tube is not full once you chamber a round.


Be prepared as well as you possibly can. Keep the mag full, the hammer cocked and be ready to kill if necessary. That is my policy. Take Care.
-Mike

 

[beerslurpy]

Anything that works against humans even somewhat reliably goes through tons and tons of drywall.

This is a problem that literally cannot be solved through cartridge choice. You either have to organize your house better (so loved ones arent in danger from shots) or make the walls out of stronger material.

 

[kokogirl]

i was told...

I was always told to use #6 indoors with people next door. I guess 6 and 4 doesnt make too much of a difference?!?!?

 

[nitesite]

NiteSite, thanks for setting me strait. So i guess I don't need a shotgun any more, just some drywall and frangible 223 to shoot thru it

I said nothing at all about frangible ammunition.

Read my post again: I said that

Soft tissue disrupts and disintegrates a bullet... more than hard/dry barriers

such as drywall.

I was responding to the comment about "polymer 'ballistic tip' type ammo for rapid disentigration when it hits anything other than flesh."

Do you mean frangible ammunition or ballistic-tipped ammunition? The two are not the same.


I do not believe that polymer-tipped .223 bullets disintegrate very much more than FMJ when shot into drywall.

 

[nelson133]

Penetration

Guys, go back up to the box of truth link and follow it. He actually tests various shotgun rounds on drywall, and birdshot won't do it. If you are in a home defense situation as a civilian, you can't shoot in most states until it is the only option left. When it is, you are in a situation where you have to smack the bg(s) as hard as you can because your other options are gone. Overpenetration is a potential problem as is missing your target all together, but you have a very real and immediate problem to solve that takes precedence, imo.