Hornady XTP v FTX bullets?

[Soonerpesek]

I run the .380 Critical Defense myself. Zero jams, nice round, not too hot, just right.

However, that doesn’t change the fact that the original design was for tube magazines in lever guns. Kept good old boys and their 30-30s in one piece. That they work very well is what has kept Hornady in business all these years.

I happen to come from 30-30 country but never heard of anyone blowing up a tube of rounds because of pointy bullets against flat primers, but I remember them being celebrated as a solution to that problem.

I do not argue that fact one iota ….
Someone made the statement that the brass needs to be trimmed or is junk…
The OP post #1 was inquiring about that bullet in the Critical Defense line of which almost all are handgun/PCC rounds that use the same length cases as most other handgun ammo…..

 

[tmd16556]

The long trim is only on bigger revolver and rifle calibers. On the smaller pistol calibers, I just never see them as a component.

 

[Mercy Me]

Well I have shot both the .430 265 gr. FTX and the .458 325 gr. FTX from my knight with good accuracy to 100 yds. I have not shot farther but imagune that the groups would not fall apart that fast. My go to load is the 44 cal 265 FTX in a MMP Green sabot on top of 120 gr. BH 209. It prints under one inch groups for me at 100 yds. The other load is the 458 cal. 325 FTX in a MMP Orange sabot on top of 110 gr. T7 3F this prints pretty close to one hole accuracy for me at 100 yds. As fot the XTP's thay are a great bullete but tend to come apart at high velocity impacts, ex(. close range) but if you could get them to shoot well from your gun 200 yds. is not that ahrd to acheive. Another choise that others on here will recomend will be the Speer Deep Curl in either 452 cal 250 and 300 gr. some also use the 44 cal 270 gr.

 

[Show Me]

What’s the difference? I’ve read a lot of negative things about FTX bullets but then why would Hornady use them for their Critical Defense ammo?

What negative things . I'm half way through ten box's and would like to know what not to like

 

[Show Me]

I know this is dieing of old age but can I say the .357 FTX is wonderful for practicing speed loaders. Which is harder than seen on TV. Old stiff fingers doesn't help at all

 

[Hugger-4641]

I know this is dieing of old age but can I say the .357 FTX is wonderful for practicing speed loaders. Which is harder than seen on TV. Old stiff fingers doesn't help at all

I'm also wondering what negatives?
No bullet is perfect for everything, but I've used tons of Xtp, Ftx, and Hap in various calibers with no complaints. Some calibers like 380 are not real good with any hollow point, thus something like the FTX may be a better choice.

 

[GeoDudeFlorida]

What’s the difference? I’ve read a lot of negative things about FTX bullets but then why would Hornady use them for their Critical Defense ammo?

The FTX offers better penetration prior to complete expansion than the XTP. The example I would offer is an intruder wearing a leather jacket versus one wearing a T-shirt. The bullet has to get through the equivalent of the proverbial “thin skinned game” before it reaches the intended target. A traditional hollow point tends to behave like a FMJ in that situation and pass through, creating a potential threat to innocents and creating a less than ideal wound cavity. The FTX will penetrate the outer layer - no matter how thick or thin - and behave like a traditional hollow point in flesh. That’s the theory as I understand it.

 

[thump_rrr]

The only uses i have for the FTX are 45-70 and 460 S&W.

I know for a fact if you purchase 45-70 Leverevolution ammo it is trimmed shorter than the minimum recommended trim length.

 

[Charlie98]

The FTX offers better penetration prior to complete expansion than the XTP. The example I would offer is an intruder wearing a leather jacket versus one wearing a T-shirt. The bullet has to get through the equivalent of the proverbial “thin skinned game” before it reaches the intended target. A traditional hollow point tends to behave like a FMJ in that situation and pass through, creating a potential threat to innocents and creating a less than ideal wound cavity. The FTX will penetrate the outer layer - no matter how thick or thin - and behave like a traditional hollow point in flesh. That’s the theory as I understand it.

That's my understanding of it. I don't know if 'barrier blind' is the correct term for the FTX, but it is designed to defeat 'outerwear' before expanding in the body cavity.

I have seen some tests where the gummy tip didn't expand well in some test media, but when the plug was pulled, it expanded well. It's a circular argument... you have to get past the crusty outside to get to the juicy inside... but how much is too much? It's the balancing act all SD ammo tries to overcome. I have given up on trying to find the absolute best SD round... I like the ones that function 100% and that my pistol will deliver with good accuracy. At the bare minimum, I poke a 9mm hole in the target, and if the bullet expands, so much the better. MY job is to deliver the bullet to the right place on the target.

I know for a fact if you purchase 45-70 Leverevolution ammo it is trimmed shorter than the minimum recommended trim length.

Correct. I also believe some .45 Colt FTX ammo comes in short cases, much like AJC was mentioning. It may not be a blanket application, but I've seen it with mine own eyes... because I had to scrap the brass.

 

[Show Me]

The FTX offers better penetration prior to complete expansion than the XTP. The example I would offer is an intruder wearing a leather jacket versus one wearing a T-shirt. The bullet has to get through the equivalent of the proverbial “thin skinned game” before it reaches the intended target. A traditional hollow point tends to behave like a FMJ in that situation and pass through, creating a potential threat to innocents and creating a less than ideal wound cavity. The FTX will penetrate the outer layer - no matter how thick or thin - and behave like a traditional hollow point in flesh. That’s the theory as I understand it.

Well just a few deer kills is as lame as a few good groups. I'm a tad windy because this is so much up my alley. Example, XTP layed in just behind the shoulder of a doe twin for mixing with pork. Expanded , did its job but didn't come out. The little deer layed down and expired, not quick. Max 296 from 16 inch R92. Next example. Big lead doe walked up a hill at me and stood there stomping at me. Was a slow season and she had followers. Shot R92 full mag 44 XTP in chest and it came out making a second bung hole. Next, to shorten this. .357 max load FTX in one shoulder out the other making a thumb size hole. Dropped there. No shot past 50 yds. My open sight thing. All perfect kill shots. Who knows what will happen from shot to shot gun to gun. Placement spot to spot. Didn't gut that 44 mag shot. Yuck. We must trust our gut . Good reading

 

[Show Me]

The only uses i have for the FTX are 45-70 and 460 S&W.

I know for a fact if you purchase 45-70 Leverevolution ammo it is trimmed shorter than the minimum recommended trim length.

And are you aware as to why

 

[GeoDudeFlorida]

That's my understanding of it. I don't know if 'barrier blind' is the correct term for the FTX, but it is designed to defeat 'outerwear' before expanding in the body cavity.

I have seen some tests where the gummy tip didn't expand well in some test media, but when the plug was pulled, it expanded well. It's a circular argument... you have to get past the crusty outside to get to the juicy inside... but how much is too much? It's the balancing act all SD ammo tries to overcome. I have given up on trying to find the absolute best SD round... I like the ones that function 100% and that my pistol will deliver with good accuracy. At the bare minimum, I poke a 9mm hole in the target, and if the bullet expands, so much the better. MY job is to deliver the bullet to the right place on the target.



Correct. I also believe some .45 Colt FTX ammo comes in short cases, much like AJC was mentioning. It may not be a blanket application, but I've seen it with mine own eyes... because I had to scrap the brass.

I don’t understand scrapping the brass. It’s a straight wall case. If you want to keep the same internal space, seat long. If you want a roll crimp, they make tools for that. Seems like a waste.

 

[Charlie98]

I don’t understand scrapping the brass. It’s a straight wall case. If you want to keep the same internal space, seat long. If you want a roll crimp, they make tools for that. Seems like a waste.

Because unformity is the key to success. I don't dabble in oddities... like short brass. Further, it was just a few pieces of range pickup brass, not a large lot... not enough to mess with.

That was actually kind of an odd group of brass... it was a mix of factory .45 Colt loads. Some of the brass was so thin, even after sizing it, the bullets, literally, fell into the case... and my Hornady .45 Colt dies size rather decidedly, so that was a significant change... something I'd never seen before.

And are you aware as to why

I'm guessing COL. The FTX bullets are pointy, not flat, therefor seat longer... and intended for lever-actions, which can be picky about COL.

 

[Show Me]

I don’t understand scrapping the brass. It’s a straight wall case. If you want to keep the same internal space, seat long. If you want a roll crimp, they make tools for that. Seems like a waste.

Some people cant just let go. Some leave it at the range. I put the odd balls in a zip lock and stash for some one else to throw away someday. I only buy factory ammo for testing and never ever think twice about a new batch of brass.

 

[Show Me]

Because unformity is the key to success. I don't dabble in oddities... like short brass. Further, it was just a few pieces of range pickup brass, not a large lot... not enough to mess with.

That was actually kind of an odd group of brass... it was a mix of factory .45 Colt loads. Some of the brass was so thin, even after sizing it, the bullets, literally, fell into the case... and my Hornady .45 Colt dies size rather decidedly, so that was a significant change... something I'd never seen before.



I'm guessing COL. The FTX bullets are pointy, not flat, therefor seat longer... and intended for lever-actions, which can be picky about COL.

Your on it . Hornady books warnings are clear but I read some revolver cylinders are shorter than others. I only have basic Rugers. More than enough room. R92's in .357 don't care and feeds into the mag and chamber like hot butter. If I had a revolver with a short chamber a toe nail clipper would take care of that and no way to tell the diff.

 

[9x56MS]

The only issue I have experienced was jacket separation but the game was dead so really a non-issue.

 

[jski]

Would it be safe to assume that the pistol round FTX bullets are intended for rifles chambered for pistol rounds? Not handguns?

 

[AJC1]

I don’t understand scrapping the brass. It’s a straight wall case. If you want to keep the same internal space, seat long. If you want a roll crimp, they make tools for that. Seems like a waste.

You know I give it away for exactly that reason.... I don't need extra carbon rings in my chamber.

 

[GeoDudeFlorida]

Would it be safe to assume that the pistol round FTX bullets are intended for rifles chambered for pistol rounds? Not handguns?

Mostly for lever guns and hunting but, No, they are definitely also intended for handguns but not short barrel/low velocity loads. I would suggest a call to Hornady to discuss a particular scenario.

The only FTX I ever found useful in handgun is the 225gr .45Colt and I no longer have the revolver I used them for. My only .45Colt now is a Ruger Vaquero with a 5” barrel.

 

[GeoDudeFlorida]

You know I give it away for exactly that reason.... I don't need extra carbon rings in my chamber.

Yes and I appreciate it!

 

[jski]

Let me clarify something in my original post. The negative comments I read about FTX v XTP bullets was in regards to their use in handguns.

 

[GooseGestapo]

If everyone hasn’t picked up on it yet;
There are differences between
FTX -RIFLE,
-HEAVY REVOLVER HANDGUN,
AND
-CRITICAL DEFENSE handgun bullets.
.30/30, and others have shortened cases to prevent the ogive of certain FTX bullets from jamming into the lead of SOME rifles preventing chambering, while still allowing crimping in a cannelure -(.30/30, .45/70, .32winspcl, .35Rem, .357Mag, .45colt, ect).
There are TWO different .308” 160gr FTX bullets. One for the .30/30, (Blount profile) and .308Marlin Express (long profile). Even MidwayUSA has gotten them confused.
The Critical Defense handgun line doesn’t have shortened cases.

Technology is advancing so fast that I’m replacing computers and phones because the old ones are no longer compatible with current internet routers and operating systems…
Bullets are advancing too. ie: FTX technology and powder coatings for plain lead bullets…
It’s tough just to keep up…

 

[Mercy Me]

Before my inline, I shot a .430 180 gr Hornady hp and sabot out of a TC sidelock, I loaded 100 gr of loose powder. It was very accurate and resulted in many one shot kills on whitetail and coyotes. The recoil was similar to a patched ball, several kids of hunting friends shot that combo for a first muzzleloader experience.

 

[Weflyfast]

I have posted this pic before....that is a whitetail shot at 40 yards with. FTX out of a 500S&W.....through the heart.... He did make it to the edge of the field.....I would say the pic explains the bullet performance-