How far is too far for self-defense?

[000Buck]

The only thing the homeowner is guilty of is being a bad shot. Maybe the state should pay for more firearms and high stress training for him. I cant even imagine how out of my mind terrified I would be if I awoke with intruders in my house, there should never be any questioning of someone shooting intruders. Even if I came down stairs and some guy was getting himself a glass of water and eating my doritos, I'd still be terrified and shoot him until he was dead.

 

[dustind]

Any person who forces another human being to use their policy on self defense has lost their right to complain about what that policy is.

Not all human life should be seen as having a positive value. If someone wants to intentionally harm another person for no good reason then their life should have a negative value associated with it. It should be a question as to how much energy are we willing to spend to get rid of them.

 

[beerslurpy]

Anyone who is close enough to wake me out of bed and give me a good reason to shoot them is probably fair game. Seeing as I dont roam the streets at night like batman, I am not likely to get involved in a use of force situation that isnt completely justified.

 

[gunsmith]

tuff paws

even in san francisco or berkeley this guy would not have been prosecuted.
the mere fact of breaking in is enough to shoot them.
even if they say "i'm only here for the tv" doesn't mean they aint gonna rape your dog too.
CA is bad but it aint new jersey!!!!

 

[artherd]

When there is no fear of loss of life of injury, or at least here in CA, it is that way. Yep, someone can come into my house, pick up my TV and walk out the door with it, but other than calling the cops, I can't do squat about it

Not true at all, you may immediately place him under Citizen's Arrest for a misdomenor (possibly a felony for the B&E) theft. You just have to be right that he did commit a crime, and as soon as possible turn him over to police or a Majistrate.

If he resists, you may use nessecary force to restrain him, up to and including deadly force if he threatens you with severe bodily harm or death!!!

This is all per CA law.

 

[Pietro Beretta]

even in san francisco or berkeley this guy would not have been prosecuted.

Are you sure? I mean it was dark the guy could have fired the shot gun in the air to scare off the intruders. Do you think the kids evin seen the man with his gun? I think in CA the DA would have a field day on this guy. And the kids would have been the victims.

 

[GRB]

From what was in the article and considering state law in the state in question, it sounds as if it was a case of good shots being fired. A job quite possibly well done by the homeowner.

 

[Moto]

I think it should be legal to shoot or eliminate the threat of anyone that has invaded your home . The guy here likely may not end up being prosecuted by his state, but what about law suits down the road from the families, I can just picture civil suits from the families, because you know the negligent families that raised these kids are going to say that right before this happened they were about to straighten out thier lives and start getting jobs to help out the family and were planning to go to college and take school seriously but are now psychologically damaged or some other crap like that and that it is someone elses fault and they deserve lots of money .

 

[pokey074]

Would I shoot someone for just being in my residence? No, else I would have shot an innocent inspector a couple of weeks ago. Do I blame him for doing so? No.

As far as law suits go, this is SD, not CA. I don't belive they could find a jury to side for the plaintif, 'least not up there.

 

[El Rojo]

When there is no fear of loss of life of injury, or at least here in CA, it is that way. Yep, someone can come into my house, pick up my TV and walk out the door with it, but other than calling the cops, I can't do squat about it.

This statement was made with no understanding of California law. As has been pointed out, California law is pretty clear that the citizens of this state may defend themselves with deadly force if they have a reasonable fear for their life. If you can't argue someone breaking into your house when they know it is occupied isn't a threat to your life, then you better hire at least the worst scum bag lawer in the town because even he should be able to.

Go read the PRK penal code if you don't believe me. There is no duty to retreat. There is no having to warn someone first.

http://www.leginfo.ca.gov/cgi-bin/waisgate?WAISdocID=48352025020+0+0+0&WAISaction=retrieve

Go down to 197 and more importantly 198.5. Here let me quote 198.5 for you.

198.5. Any person using force intended or likely to cause death or
great bodily injury within his or her residence shall be presumed to
have held a reasonable fear of imminent peril of death or great
bodily injury to self, family, or a member of the household when that
force is used against another person, not a member of the family or
household, who unlawfully and forcibly enters or has unlawfully and
forcibly entered the residence and the person using the force knew or
had reason to believe that an unlawful and forcible entry occurred.

As used in this section, great bodily injury means a significant
or substantial physical injury.

It is bad enough people make fun of our state for the stupid things it does. It is worse when our own residents make fun of our state for things that are simply not true.

 

[dakotasin]

pokey- that is a good point... i recently had an 'invasion': neighbor's elderly mother (a little confused, but not too bad) thought my house was her son's house, and just came on in. i didn't shoot her.

i think everything has to be taken into context, eg, what time of day it is, etc - a threat asessment of sorts. in the case in question, i don't recall for sure, but i believe the events happened in the wee hours of the morning (a threat), and they busted a window to gain access (ok, now it is a serious threat), so i believe that not only was the lake traverse fellow justified, i think it very appropriate that charges were not pressed. frankly, i would've been shocked if charges had been filed.

 

[Gunsnrovers]

It is bad enough people make fun of our state for the stupid things it does. It is worse when our own residents make fun of our state for things that are simply not true.

Thanks. I couldn't agree more. We put up with a lot of BS, but we're not dead yet.

 

[Didorian]

So why is it that we can't use deadly force to protect our posessions and property??

Cause the only reason that I've ever heard is because it's against the law to kill a person for stealing somthing ov yours.
And if THAT's the only reason...... then why does this law still exist.

Don't these people realize what a blow to a person's mental state it is to come home and find your door kicked in and have your stuff gone through? Have things missing never to be returned. That, kills a part of a person. And yet so many people say that it's wrong to kill an intruder.
So let me get this right.... this person is already breaking the law to be IN my house. They're breaking the law by trying to steal things out of my house. So that's twice that they've broken the law in just that moment, and yet I'm in the wrong by violating THEIR righst by putting a blade or bullet into them.....
Sorry, but with my math that just don't make sense.

People say that property isn't worth a person's life....
It may not be to that person.... but all of the stuff that I have is, to me, worth the life of anyone that may try to take it from me. If you are willing to take any of it from me, then it also means that you don't care about me or mine at all. Which means that you MIGHT come back again to take more stuff, and hurt one of us if we happen to be there. So yea.... I catch you trying to steal my stuff you're in for a bad time of it.
I MIGHT go to jail. But they will never again be able to break into my home, or anyone else's. That person will never again cause a sleepless night.


Dustind +5

 

[El Rojo]

So yea.... I catch you trying to steal my stuff you're in for a bad time of it. I MIGHT go to jail. But they will never again be able to break into my home, or anyone else's.

Hmmm, I know my earthly possessions or any earthly possessions are worth me going to jail over. That is interesting that you are willing to go to prison over the actions of someone else.

Look at your state laws. In most cases if they have forcibly entered your house while you are in it, you can claim self-defense and shoot them. You don't have to go to jail when you follow the law. Making statements that you are going to kill anyone who even thinks of taking your property probably wouldn't help your case any. Be wise and think carefully before you speak, otherwise your wish to go to jail over mere property just might come true.

 

[perception]

I don't want to steal the thread, so I will just sidetrack it for a sec.

When Holicky first pulled the trigger, the gun didn’t fire because the chamber was empty. The resort owner went to his bedroom to add two shells to the gun.

Keep your defense guns loaded folks, this is a first hand account of someone forgetting to load up under stress. He is lucky he had time to remedy the situation, and lived to tell about it. You might not get the chance.