How is something like this not considered a firearm?
- Thread starter jefnvk
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skeeter1
Member
Well then, I guess I might be doubly screwed. One of my air rifles has a 14.5" barrel which is legal if it's considered a non-firearm. However, if it is considered a firearm, then it's also illegal as far as NFA law is concerned. So, which is it?
DMK
Member
Interesting. I wonder if something like this could be carried in a school, government office or some other place that prohibits firearms?
Where I live here in Oregon my town considers bb-guns and air rifles as firearms too. Gone are the days of sitting in the back yard and taking the Starling population down.
I do find that gas powered pop gun interesting but I would have no use for one myself.
I do find that gas powered pop gun interesting but I would have no use for one myself.
lee n. field
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The little CO2 cylinders loose pressure badly in the cold. (I read it on the Internet, anyway, so it must be true
.) How does nitrogen behave?CO2 does tend to freeze up, but with those 12g cylinders it isn't as big a problem.
I bet they use N2 because it stays in gaseous form at room temp beyond 3000psi, unlike the 800psi of CO2. Higher pressure in a small cartridge = better. And yes, because it doesn't have to change from a liquid to gas, it can't freeze up.
That's how I understand it. Then again, all my knowledge about this stuff comes from experience playing airsoft/paintball and building pneumatic cannons, not from a physics textbook. I'm sure I didn't explain it correctly [
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The Viking
Member
Would definetly be classified as a firearm on this side of the Atlantic ocean, because it's a weapon that fires an irritant - a firearm according to Swedish law . Damn I hate this country sometimes.
. Damn I hate this country sometimes.You guys are thinking mostly of firearms laws. But for most legal purposes, the term "firearm" is not used, the term "weapon" is. Most of those laws use the wording "deadly or dangerous weapon", a knife, a blackjack, or something like a slingshot is considered a weapon for carrying, armed robbery, assault, and the like even if it is not a firearm and can be proven not to be lethal. I suspect anyone using the gun against another person would have the burden of proving that the gun is not and cannot be lethal.
(A fellow who tried to stick up a bank by brandishing a snake (!) was convicted of armed robbery and assault with a deadly weapon even though he claimed the snake was not poisonous.)
Jim
(A fellow who tried to stick up a bank by brandishing a snake (!) was convicted of armed robbery and assault with a deadly weapon even though he claimed the snake was not poisonous.)
Jim
kungfuhippie
Member
So can I take the paint ball gun with pepper balls (the one that shoots real paint balls and looks closer to a real pistol) on my college campus since I can't ccw there?
Warren
Member
It looks like a Ronco Pocket Fisherman.
I'm sure there are areas in the US where even this will be prohibited. Which will, again, show just whose side the average politician is on.
I'm sure there are areas in the US where even this will be prohibited. Which will, again, show just whose side the average politician is on.
ArfinGreebly
Moderator Emeritus
. . . or are you just glad to see me?
Thinkin' they won't sell a lot in that demographic.
"Hey, Sarge, what's that on your belt? A hair dryer?"
Thinkin' they won't sell a lot in that demographic.
Uh... why not just use OC? If I absolutely feel the need to shoot balls filled with an irritant at someone I'll get one that can work work double duty as a paint ball gun and buy a Tiberius 8 and some .68 caliber pepper balls. 8 shots per mag and I can carry an extra. Plus practice ammo would only be like $70 for 2000(including cartridges).
Assuming your college doesn't prohibit paintball (mine does), I suppose, though they could still give you trouble if they feel like it... Kinda like how open carrying legally can get you lots of unwanted attention which in turn can loosely justify to a cop that you're causing a public disturbance. It's BS, but that's how it goes.
Geronimo45
Member
The Feds say that an airgun is not a firearm, therefore the (Federal) NFA barrel length business does not apply. Now, if your state considers your airgun a firearm, and has an SBR defined, then you may be in trouble.
The gun is not a firearm 'cause there ain't no fire.
thexrayboy
Member
Just another overwrought solution looking for a problem to solve. The problem they are trying to market this device as a solution for has numerous other solutions that exist which are better, cheaper and more effective. Waste of money.
Novus Collectus
Member
As I understand it, any non-"antique" gun designed to use any explosive at all is a firearm be it explosive gasses, liquids, solids or powders. This is why some spud guns may be considered firearms even though they just use flammable gasses and vapors and not powders.
A gun using just pressured gas (that does not ignite) is not a firearm according to the feds. The origional Taser used a deflagrating compound to expell the electrical leads and the compund was the same as used in autombile airbags. Becuase the substance burned, the origional Tasers were declared firearms. Since the late 70s Tasers were sold using compressed gas instead to propel the leads and are not "firearms" according to the feds.
A gun using just pressured gas (that does not ignite) is not a firearm according to the feds. The origional Taser used a deflagrating compound to expell the electrical leads and the compund was the same as used in autombile airbags. Becuase the substance burned, the origional Tasers were declared firearms. Since the late 70s Tasers were sold using compressed gas instead to propel the leads and are not "firearms" according to the feds.
MachIVshooter
Member
Something that I think is being overlooked here; Just because it isn't a firearm does not mean that a CCW is not required to carry it. A cap and ball revolver is not considered a firearm either, bt try packing one without a permit. Still falls into other dangerous/deadly weapons categories.
Besides which, most assaults and the like occur at contact distance. So close in, the powder that thing uses is going to affect the defender as well as the assailant. No thanks.
Besides which, most assaults and the like occur at contact distance. So close in, the powder that thing uses is going to affect the defender as well as the assailant. No thanks.
thorn726
Member
i think in stupid CA some types of projectile weapons can be considered firearms, not sure exactly
but that thing is pretty cool for the firearm-afraid, and for the types of idiots i have problems with that thing would be perfect!!
the other advantage to less than lethal is you can probably get away with using it for less than lethal threats
but i am in very good health, and consider a disable/so i can run
option very effective for the gun less attacker.
for the 75 year old, or out of shape person, this thing is kinda stupid
but that thing is pretty cool for the firearm-afraid, and for the types of idiots i have problems with that thing would be perfect!!
the other advantage to less than lethal is you can probably get away with using it for less than lethal threats
but i am in very good health, and consider a disable/so i can run
option very effective for the gun less attacker.
for the 75 year old, or out of shape person, this thing is kinda stupid
I think Police already have them in use. I saw something on TV about it once. The cop unloaded on a bad guy. When they had him subdued they lifted up his shirt and his chest was covered with some nasty welts.
Check out this site:
http://www.pepperball.com/
Their version looks a lot like a paintball gun with a regular hopper and everything. They have a video about it too. Looks like it would actually be pretty useful for riot control or even one guy on a SWAT team to have it. Don't know about concealed carry though.
alucard0822
Member
paintball=.68cal, this thing is .50cal. You didn't think they wouldn't use proprietary balls did you?
Most of the states where this thing is legal, CCW is too, so I don't really see much use. The police have somewhat different needs, they cant simply run away, or avoid trouble. A private citizen shoots only under immediate danger to their life, or to the lives of others in some places, and in that case It would seem you want the best manstopper that you can proficiently use. With current technology, the most versatile and effective type of weapon is a firearm. There is a small place for irritants and non-lethal weapons, but they are more limited either in their effectiveness, range, or capacity.
This thing would seem to have poor stopping ability, low capacity, too big to easily conceal, and probably is not very reliable (leaking gas seals, or dead batteries)
Most of the states where this thing is legal, CCW is too, so I don't really see much use. The police have somewhat different needs, they cant simply run away, or avoid trouble. A private citizen shoots only under immediate danger to their life, or to the lives of others in some places, and in that case It would seem you want the best manstopper that you can proficiently use. With current technology, the most versatile and effective type of weapon is a firearm. There is a small place for irritants and non-lethal weapons, but they are more limited either in their effectiveness, range, or capacity.
This thing would seem to have poor stopping ability, low capacity, too big to easily conceal, and probably is not very reliable (leaking gas seals, or dead batteries)
Stevie-Ray
Member
That's true in Michigan, except for the paintball gun. Pellet pistols, and worse, even the lowly BB pistols need permits to purchase and registration after purchase. So far I haven't bought anymore than what I had as a kid because I think it's totally ridiculous. And I could use new ones to handle the pest problems around here.
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