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How is something like this not considered a firearm?

Discussion in 'General Gun Discussions' started by jefnvk, Sep 8, 2007.

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  1. jefnvk

    jefnvk Member

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    http://www.avurt.com/default.aspx?skinid=1 (there is a promo video on the first page, turn your volume down!)

    How is this not viewed as a firearm. Is it simply because it is gas operated? It is basically a pistol that only fires less than lethal rounds for self defense. Even if it isn't viewed as a firearm, how would it be viewed if you were caught with such a device?
     
  2. GunTech

    GunTech Member

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    Firearm - A rifle, shotgun or handgun using gunpowder as a propellant. By federal definition, under the 1968 Gun Control Act, antiques are excepted.
     
  3. bender

    bender Member

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    looks pretty cool, but it's big... I don't see women taking up all their purse space with one.
     
  4. joab

    joab Member

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    Interesting concept but at $300 it's too expensive and it takes too long to get into action

    If you notice in the reenactments they never fully show the process
     
  5. jefnvk

    jefnvk Member

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    OK, so basically it is an airgun, not falling under any firearm laws.
     
  6. unrealtrip

    unrealtrip Member

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    As already mentioned it doesn't use gunpowder so technically not a firearm. It's kinda phaser / quake gun looking though isn't it?
     
  7. NeoSpud

    NeoSpud Member

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    It isn't a firearm any more than an airsoft or paintball gun. I imagine if a police officer found you had one, there wouldn't be any more of a stir than if you had a taser or stungun. Actually, probably less, as I bet very few people would even recognize it.
     
  8. cnorman18

    cnorman18 Member

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    Not a firearm

    a "firearm", by definition, launches projectiles powered by gunpowder. Anything that launches projectiles, of whatever kind, powered by compressed gas or air is an "airgun". Since there's no gunpowder in this thing, it's not a "firearm".

    If this thing were a firearm, then so is a paintball gun and your kid's pellet gun.
     
  9. ilcylic

    ilcylic Member

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    It's cute, but for the price, I think I'd stick with a K frame .38 Spl.

    I wonder if the pellets are standard paintball gun sized? Splatmasters can be had for $20.
     
  10. kurtmax

    kurtmax Member

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    My question is: How does this thing disrupt anybody without hitting them in the face. I mean, I'm sure even if it hit you in the leg some powder might get in your eyes.... but still.

    Plus... 5 shots? A real gun that size would probably hold 50.
     
  11. Flak_Jakett

    Flak_Jakett Member

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    What the heck are they going to come up with next. The thing looks like a toy I would buy my kid. I can see the baddie laughing histerically when he saw that thing, until he got hit with it I suppose.

    Guess I'll be sticking with my .45 then.
     
  12. Zoogster

    Zoogster Member

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    It is basicly a paintball gun much like the police pepper ball launchers using irritant filled balls. Not at all effective against someone determined and one would be better to stick with pepper spray for the niche this fills.

    The longer range advantage this might provide is negated by the fact that shooting someone in most situations at a distance with something that warrants non lethal force is just not practical. For someone to be posing a risk to you that warrants non lethal force they are going to be close.

    Anything a danger to you from a distance tends to warrant lethal force, like someone with a projectile weapon or closing with another weapon like a knife etc. Outside of police use there is not many non lethal shots from a distance.
    Up close pepper spray needs less precision and will be more effective.

    As far as laws, any gun or something people could reasonably believe is a gun used in a crime is punished the same as if it was a firearm many places. If one was to use that in a way which was innappropriate they could be punished the same as if they used either a firearm if threatening with it, or pepperspray if they are goofing around with it. Unlawful use of sprays, tasers, stunguns etc is a serious crime most places. So goofing around with this thing would get you into serious trouble, and for self defense it is rather worthless.

    So why would you want it?
     
  13. Bazooka Joe71

    Bazooka Joe71 Member

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    Don't think I'll be taking it to a gunfight anytime soon.:rolleyes:
     
  14. M249MachineGun

    M249MachineGun Member

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    That's ridiculous. Violent criminals deserve to face real, deadly bullets.
     
  15. Car Knocker

    Car Knocker Member

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    The definition of "firearm" is quite flexible and may vary depending on who's doing the defining. While the federal government may define a firearm as:

    18 USC 921(a)(3)

    other governmental units may legally define it more restictively, such as those cities that use the term "expel a projectile by means of an expanding gas" to control or restrict pneumatic arms such as pellet guns, etc.

    Please note that the federal definition cited above (GCA of 1968) makes no mention of "gunpowder".
     
  16. Nolo

    Nolo Member

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    Ha! "Oh god, she's shooting baking powder at me! Run away, run away!"
    I'm sorry, but if I'm such a lowlife as the commit a rape, I wouldn't run away from a flour-gun. Seriously, it's brightly-colored, too. That's not going to intimidate. It has a maximum range of forty feet. Which means it can only be relied upon for about 20 feet (always halve the range of something if you want the real reliable range). Can a perp run 20 feet before that "weapon" really gets into action? I bet he could. Once those twenty feet are up, you're toast.
     
  17. walking arsenal

    walking arsenal Member

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    IIRC Minnesota considers air guns firearms as far as felons go.
     
  18. lee n. field

    lee n. field Member

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    Ill-i-noise considers (some) air rifles as firearms.
     
  19. Hugo

    Hugo Member

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    At least it's another "less than lethal" tool for the toolbox. I'd carry a Pistol too with this. Is anyone publicly warning people about repeat criminals who have built up an immunity to pepper spray/things like this?

    I think Quagmire did on one Family Guy episode when the UPS lady sprayed him with pepper spray when he answered the door naked. "Nice Try but I've built up an immunity!" ;)
     
  20. jefnvk

    jefnvk Member

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    Zoogster - I don't. Well, I think it would be fun to play with and see how effective it could be, but definitely dont want one for self defense.

    Personally, I couldn't see carrying it in anything BUT a purse.
     
  21. Flyboy

    Flyboy Member

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    (great for multiple attackers, as long as everybody stops at the first shot)
    So...it shoots seasoning, and has a range of a bit over ten yards.
    Teuller said 21 feet for a gun. This thing is large, and designed for purse (off-body) carry. At that size, she--and there's really not much of a male market here, given the size, and thus requirement for something like a purse--has to get it out of her purse under stress (likely fighting with everything else in her purse), unfold it, take aim, and fire. Anybody figure that 40 feet is enough?

    Yeah, me neither.
    This is a bug, not a feature.

    Okay, fisking this one is getting tedious. Anybody else want to get the next paragraph?
     
  22. Anteater1717

    Anteater1717 Member

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    Neat idea but there is already better ways of going about it that are cheaper and use the same concept. What I would think would be better is on of these, loaded with pepper balls. I shot one using paintballs it shot at around 280fps. It was pretty accurate plus you can reload it using magazines. It was also pretty small. It uses real paintballs which are .68 caliber. For cheap practice 500 for $15.00 as opposed to $40.00 for 25. Real pepper balls are easy to find in .68 caliber too. It’s also a semiautomatic and loads in an 8 round detachable magazine. But no pink finish:rolleyes:.

    The links messed up look for the Tiberius 8
     
  23. Kentak

    Kentak Member

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    It uses nitrogen cylinders for the gas propulsion. Why nitrogen rather than CO2? Maybe higher pressure, I'm guessing.

    I see this as a self-defense option for locations that don't allow CCW or where it's too difficult to get, or for people who prefer a non-firearm SD option.

    The advantage it seems to have over pepper spray is that you can engage an attacker at longer range, the bang and impact of the round may in and of itself give the attacker second thoughts or at least pause and gain time for the intended victim.

    Also, I'm thinking the laser sight *might* (I don't know) be effective to disorient or temp blind the attacker in a dark environment. Their website doesn't say anything about that, but seems possible to me.

    K
     
  24. Flyboy

    Flyboy Member

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    So? Say it with Krylon!
     
  25. 4v50 Gary

    4v50 Gary Moderator Staff Member

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    I wonder if it (or variation thereof) is going to show up at Police conventions as a non-lethal force gadget?
     
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