How often do you practice/train for a defensive situation?

[Bishop.357]

Probably everyone on this forum carries,and I'm sure everyone has at least basic training in defensive pistol combat,but how ready are you to defend yourself against an attack? If you got jumped today,by say three gangbangers and had no choice but to shoot it out;whould you be both physically and mentally prepared?
This scenario could happen any number of ways,but how ready are you to pull your weapon and defend your life?

Please try to be honest.

 

[TEDDY]

ready

most of you wont be.you must have the mind set to kill.and be prepared at same time you must sift the information you see at blinding speed.with the new criminal he will shot the old times did not want to only as a last resort.and then most gave up.not so now.most shootings in defence end with wounded or perp getting away.are you prepared to kill??? or are you going to hesitate worrying about the result.

 

[bigfatdave]

I'm quite aware that if "jumped" by multiple assailants I'll be lucky to end up in the hospital. I'm certainly armed well enough most days to fend off an assailant armed with something other than a gun, and I have a fighting chance if I were to somehow get into a gunfight. (that chance being inversely proportional to the assailant's firearms quality/skill ... let's face it, most thugs have a junk gun they haven't been to the range practicing with frequently)

But practicing for something as chaotic and unpredictable as a multi-thug "jumping" is about impossible unless you get into airsoft and have cooperative friends, and even that is mostly academic, unless you can replicate the adrenaline, fear, and consequences. Planning on situations like that is all good, but a fighting retreat is more in order than standing your ground, unless you are defending your own home/family.

Sort of like pondering "how many 5-year-old kids you could take in a fight" ... interesting, but entirely theoretical and almost impossible to do real training for.

 

[gondorian]

Us folks in Illinois can't carry, so we repel armed attackers with spittle.

 

[CWL]

The first step of SD is situational awareness. I doubt that I would ever be anywhere where I can be jumped by 3 gangbangers.

Sometimes, you need to know when to skeedadle before trouble finds you.

As for shooting, who knows? I'll certainly be doing everything I can to get away while I'm shooting.

 

[kanewpadle]

I'm quite aware that if "jumped" by multiple assailants I'll be lucky to end up in the hospital. I'm certainly armed well enough most days to fend off an assailant armed with something other than a gun, and I have a fighting chance if I were to somehow get into a gunfight. (that chance being inversely proportional to the assailant's firearms quality/skill ... let's face it, most thugs have a junk gun they haven't been to the range practicing with frequently)

But practicing for something as chaotic and unpredictable as a multi-thug "jumping" is about impossible unless you get into airsoft and have cooperative friends, and even that is mostly academic, unless you can replicate the adrenaline, fear, and consequences. Planning on situations like that is all good, but a fighting retreat is more in order than standing your ground, unless you are defending your own home/family.

Sort of like pondering "how many 5-year-old kids you could take in a fight" ... interesting, but entirely theoretical and almost impossible to do real training for.

It's not impossible. Difficult maybe. There are many drills that can be done indoors and out. I shoot once a week. Every other week I shoot steel plates. The other weeks I shoot at moving targets, draw from concealment, use cover, tactical reloads, malfunctions, etc..........

I would say that MANY are not ready even though they think they are. I see many, many people that carry and don't know much about tactics, training, and even worse, the lawful use of force. They don't know state laws. Don't know how to disassemble and clean their guns. Some of these people worry me more than the average bad guy. I don't want to get shot by accident.

 

[M2 Carbine]

but how ready are you to pull your weapon and defend your life?

Probably more than most.
Having home ranges I practice 3-5 times a week, plus 2-3 evenings with lasers and laser lights.

mentally prepared?

I don't dwell on it but the idea of shooting someone that needs shooting doesn't bother me at all.

 

[Mikhail Weiss]

How often do you practice/train for a defensive situation?

Hmm. I practice once a week, about a hundred to a hundred and fifty rounds, with some pretty basic scenarios and drills – basic, mostly, because the range where I shoot doesn't allow some of the more interesting things, for which I have to rely on dry-fire practice. I work a few specific drills during each range visit, mixing them up so I don't end up doing the same thing every time and getting bored. One thing I always practice, though: draw from concealment and fire pairs as quickly as possible at three yards, again at five and seven (not always in that order). This is almost always my cold start drill. If not that, it'll be failure-to-stop drills at the same distances, which I also practice during each range visit.

How ready are you to defend yourself against an attack?

Beats me, and I'm not eager to find out. In past circumstances, I was ready enough that I didn't think at all about what to do, or why. I just did it. Preparation and training seems to have helped. End result, I know what I can do, how quickly I can do it, and at what distances. I suppose this means that I have at least a modicum of a somewhat realistic notion of my skill level, and under what circumstances I can bring those skills to bear, but I also believe that those skills are simply rudimentary.

If you got jumped today,by say three gangbangers and had no choice but to shoot it out;whould you be both physically and mentally prepared?

If it were necessary to fight or die, I'd fight with a clear understanding that one of the consequences of using deadly force is that someone may die, including me. I'd work hard to make sure it wasn't me.

How ready are you to pull your weapon and defend your life?

Hesitate and thou art lost. Mindset has been constantly beaten into me in other areas, and defensive shooting has been no different. If the need for action arises, act swiftly and decisively.

 

[bigfatdave]

It's not impossible. Difficult maybe. There are many drills that can be done indoors and out. I shoot once a week. Every other week I shoot steel plates. The other weeks I shoot at moving targets, draw from concealment, use cover, tactical reloads, malfunctions, etc

1-Where did you find a place to shoot in more than one direction? I've always wanted somewhere I could practice stopping one assailant from each cardinal direction.
2-How do you practice getting someone off of yourself?
3-How loud was it shooting over your shoulder at someone (simulated) grabbing you from behind?

unless you can replicate the adrenaline, fear, and consequences.

You're probably a lot better prepared than the crowds of victims out there waiting for an "active shooter" to wander in and line them up for execution (VT, the recent gym in PA, Binghampton, Luby's) but replicating the stark terror and potential consequences of a real shooting is damn near impossible. You could always guzzle three or four espressos, take a nice run, and then shoot on targets while dodging airsoft pellets from a friend, but I got tired just typing all that, and it still wouldn't replicate a real defensive scenario.

 

[kanewpadle]

Gravel pit and an indoor range. Can't shoot 360 inside the range but there are many other situations that can be practiced.

Practice getting someone off me? Palm/stiff arm to the face while drawing at the same time. Two or three quick shots to the midsection from the hip. It isn't that hard.

I don't shoot over my shoulder. I don't shoot those I can't see. I don't let people sneak up on me. If that fails hopefully a few years of traditional Okinawan karate and a knife will help but I would rather not rely on that.

 

[jackstinson]

I keep four crackheads on retainer to sporadically mug me. This trains me to expect the unexpected/expected.
The crackheads replaced seven meth'ed-out zombie-bears whom I previously hired to randomly attack me.
It is the S/D method I learned from Inspector Clouseau and his trusty valet Cato.

 

[bnkrazy]

Since I shoot on private land, I have the opportunity to do many more drills than would otherwise be possible at a public / indoor range.

I think I'd do OK in most situations. However, I think SA would do more good than firearm proficiency in the case of 3 gangbangers attempting to get the drop on you.

 

[Tim the student]

whould you be both physically and mentally prepared?

Not physically, unless I was in my house. I don't own any handguns (but am considering one), and choose not to carry a shotgun or rifle. But I can tell you I'll run like hell until I can't run anymore, and then I'll do whatever I need to do to not get beaten up. Eyes, groin, throat, bricks, finger locks, I'll do it all if its between me going into the coma and them going into the coma.

Mentally, yes. I can tell you absolute certainty that I will do whatever I need to do to live. And while I have never been in the position to defend my family, I have no doubts that I will do whatever I need to do to defend them.

 

[sohcgt2]

I think I'd do OK in most situations. However, I think SA would do more good than firearm proficiency in the case of 3 gangbangers attempting to get the drop on you.

Amen, far better to not let "three gangbangers" jump you. Always be aware of who and what is near. Failing that, I like the Clouseau plan

I keep four crackheads on retainer to sporadically mug me. This trains me to expect the unexpected/expected.
The crackheads replaced seven meth'ed-out zombie-bears whom I previously hired to randomly attack me.
It is the S/D method I learned from Inspector Clouseau and his trusty valet Cato.

I don't care who you are, that's funny.

 

[bigfatdave]

I keep four crackheads on retainer to sporadically mug me. This trains me to expect the unexpected/expected.
The crackheads replaced seven meth'ed-out zombie-bears whom I previously hired to randomly attack me.

You win, Sir or Ma'am.
Are the zombie bears still viable? I'm looking for an entry-level Danger Room hazard to start out with, and my range forbids shooting at human-shaped targets, so the crackheads are out.

 

[BullfrogKen]

replicating the stark terror and potential consequences of a real shooting is damn near impossible. You could always guzzle three or four espressos, take a nice run, and then shoot on targets while dodging airsoft pellets from a friend, but I got tired just typing all that, and it still wouldn't replicate a real defensive scenario.

I've heard that stated time and time again. I don't believe it's true.

The premise is that since real conditions can't be replicated, neither can the associated stress and anxiety, therefore anything short of a real gunfight is a useless exercise.

I've seen it done. I've seen it done hundreds and hundreds of times. We've had Practitioners who are veterans of combat and officers on departments in major cities ridden with violent crime tell us that the simulations we've created caused them more stress than the actual shootings they were involved in gave them.

It is possible. It just takes the right kinds of people, under the right kinds of circumstances, to design the scenarios.


For decades the US military had its recruits undergo exercises that induce stress. The purpose behind those drills is not to learn to become a master repeller, climber, swimmer, or rope-crawler. The purpose is to allow the recruit to experience anxiety, learn he can control it, and press forward. The system works.

1-Where did you find a place to shoot in more than one direction? I've always wanted somewhere I could practice stopping one assailant from each cardinal direction.

I belong to two gun clubs that allow the shooter to practice these kinds of drills. They aren't easy to find, and 20 years ago my own club didn't allow it. But we had a group of guys who got involved with the Board of Directors, created the ranges on the property to safely allow it, and we changed the range rules to make it possible.

 

[MarineOne]

I think that being situationally aware is a lost concept today.

I utterly dislike these kinds of posts where its more of a pissing contest over how many BG's (Bad Guys) you can shoot if you're in a situation you shouldn't have let yourself get into in the first place. You better know what's going on in your environment and it doesn't matter if you're carrying or not. This holds even more true for an environment you're unfamilar with or one that changes dramatically.

For an example, I'll use myself ....

As a contractor overseas (classified as a non-combatant) I cannot use nor can I carry a weapon unless I am directly trying to save the life of a soldier, and even then once it's investigated it will be run over with a fine toothed comb. Being on a base here a lot of people become lax with their surroundings because they don't think anything will happen to them. These are the same people that run around like chickens with their heads cut off because they don't know what to do and/or can't find a bunker when we have practice drills for in-direct fire, or when we have to do it for the real thing. I've seen it with other civilians I work with, and with both soldiers and airmen on my base.

OTOH, there are a few people here that know where the bunkers are located at work, on their way back and forth to the living area, the PX, and the chow hall. These people are in the minority, and IMHO it will be these people that become our first responders if and when something really bad happens.

I'm glad I'm in the second group.



Kris

 

[oldfool]

"this ain't Dodge, and me ain't Bill Hickock"

I shoot weekly, but mostly leave the Cato routines to Cato
Willing enough to draw and fire, if unavoidable, likely to get a hit or two on 1st target
but if suddenly jumped by 3 gangbangers, real likely to just get dead

I do put some considered effort into staying out of warzones
too old to fight, too fat to run

 

[ar10]

About once a month, IDPA. Then when most of the customers leave the range I usually try to practice at the 25' targets, that's about 3 times per week. On the days the range is closed I usually hit the 300yd range and practice with the rifles. How's that?

 

[zombienerd]

Sort of like pondering "how many 5-year-old kids you could take in a fight"

I think my Limit is 7 or 8, more than that and they have a pretty good chance I was there during the preschool riot of aught-three, it was not a pretty sight....


Seriously, though, One can never truly be "prepared" to get jumped by more than one assailant.

You can practice, you can drill, but one thing is for sure, your life isn't long enough to practice and prepare for every eventuality.

I practice drawing and point shooting. I look for exits and solid cover each time I enter a room I may be in for a while (not paranoid-esque, but I do glance around) and I am prepared to shoot every person I meet, should the need arise.

I think that keeps me in at least good chances of survival should something happen.

 

[jackstinson]

I am prepared to shoot every person I meet, should the need arise

Perhaps we should all wear t-shirts with that written on it......

 

[ChCx2744]

The human body will do some funny things during a FOF situation...How the mind handles that change is a different story...You must train your mind as well as your physical limitations with your tools...You have to constantly think about how you will handle it in your mind...If you seriously are bent on a STRAIGHT OUT "YES OR NO" "KILL OR DIE" situation, you better make your decision way before anything happens. Get your morals and mindset straight beforehand, because if you do not, you will face dire consequences later. Whether you end up 6 feet under, or sitting on the stand next to a judge, you better see those as DEFINATE outcomes from any deadly force oriented encounter. Do not tell yourself "I might die if I dont do (x);" Tell yourself, "If I don't do (X), I WILL die." If you can warrant and articulate using deadly force, always use deadly force. If there are ANY other possible scenarios, then do NOT use deadly force. There is no "second guessing" the use of deadly force; If you do not choose to use deadly force AT THAT MOMENT, you are GOING TO DIE. If you CAN NOT run, you must FIGHT. In today's world, the power of the tongue has gone neutral. Criminals are not always sober. Criminals do not always care. Criminals are not only armed with hands. Criminals are ALWAYS larger in number now than they were 30 seconds ago, and every 30 seconds, that number WILL go up. This is no longer a DOG EAT DOG world; You must be prepared to NEVER GET EATEN, because if you are not, just tell yourself constantly, "BAAAAAAA."

 

[Dr_2_B]

I think he raises a good question and I like Bullfrog's response. Unfortunately most of will not have the time, money, or inclination to undergo the excellent training Ken has been able to undergo. I would love it if I could go to that training just once... and I intend to as soon as I get my quackers in a row.

For the REST of us, there is far too much left to chance. And chance demonstrates that some of us will perform poorly without the great training and others of us will actually do well enough to survive. Mind you, I'm talking about the majority of us who aren't able to train intensely like some do. But the more realistic the training, the more likely one will survive.

Man, I gotta get me some good training.

 

[LaVere]

I am half way though a defence shooting class. We shoot about 200 rounds a class. This is like being at Disneyland for me. I have learned alot in the three classes I taken so far. Will I be able to do this or even remember next month? I don't know. I hope so. While I don't go to the range every week I can practice at home with unloaded gun the things I can't do at the range..

Right now after and in between, I practice and I practice. In time I assume mussel memory will make it automatic.
I can practice or better do situation awareness all of the time.

 

[bigfatdave]

The premise is that since real conditions can't be replicated, neither can the associated stress and anxiety, therefore anything short of a real gunfight is a useless exercise.

I'm not saying non-gunfight training has no value, but it won't let you measure the number of gangbangers you are capable of defeating accurately.
Training and practice are completely necessary to those who CC, but nobody can train for every possibility.